Would overturning Roe actually depoliticize the abortion debate?
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  Would overturning Roe actually depoliticize the abortion debate?
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Question: If Roe v. Wade were overturned, would we actually see a decrease in political polarization on the issue of abortion?
#1
Yes
 
#2
No
 
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Total Voters: 49

Author Topic: Would overturning Roe actually depoliticize the abortion debate?  (Read 1899 times)
John Dule
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« on: November 27, 2021, 02:02:35 PM »

I've been wondering about this lately. If states like Arkansas were allowed to ban abortion entirely, while other states like California kept their abortion laws, would that satisfy anti-abortion activists? Honestly, I don't think it would. These people literally think babies are being murdered across the country, and I don't think they'd become any less strident in their beliefs just because babies in red states are being "saved" while babies in blue states continue "dying." I'm afraid this is an all-or-nothing game, and compromises like this might fundamentally misunderstand where both sides of this debate are coming from.
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TML
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« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2021, 02:16:46 PM »

It should be noted that in places with blanket abortion bans, well-off people can still afford to travel to places where abortion is legal in order to get the procedure, whereas people who are not well-off are screwed. Thus, overturning Roe will only help to shed a light on unequal access to abortion by economic status (and contrary to what some people may think, even people who may outwardly declare themselves to be anti-abortion will still seek it if they think it helps their own self-image - Tim Murphy of PA is an example of this).
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The Mikado
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« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2021, 04:44:46 PM »

Overturning Roe means that especially in swing states like, say, Michigan or Arizona, whether or not abortion is legal or not might well switch with every gubernatorial election and it becomes higher salience, not lower.
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MarkD
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« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2021, 12:04:23 PM »

No, it certainly would not depoliticize the debate, but overturning Roe and Casey would mean that OUR opinions about abortion matter the most, not the opinions of a committee of lifetime-appointed lawyers in Washington D.C.
JD, don't assume that all pro-lifers are the same, and that they would all want to make sure that some branch of the federal government bans abortion nationwide. I believe many pro-lifers would be satisfied with the prospect that some other states make abortion legal so long as their own state bans it. This would include pro-lifers who recognize that the Constitution is silent on the topic of abortion, so no branch of the federal government is delegated the power to ban abortion across the entire nation. And so many Americans self-identify as "pro-choice" that there will probably never be a political coalition strong enough to take over Congress; the only danger lies is whether "pro-life," conservative judges - who don't really care about the originally-understood meaning of the Constitution - might become a majority of the SCOTUS.
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John Dule
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« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2021, 04:30:31 PM »

I believe many pro-lifers would be satisfied with the prospect that some other states make abortion legal so long as their own state bans it. This would include pro-lifers who recognize that the Constitution is silent on the topic of abortion, so no branch of the federal government is delegated the power to ban abortion across the entire nation.

This was my initial thinking on this subject as well, but I'm not sure I believe it anymore. If someone genuinely believes abortion is child murder, why should they be satisfied with a situation where babies are being killed in California but not Tennessee?
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Хahar 🤔
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« Reply #5 on: November 29, 2021, 05:38:21 PM »

I believe many pro-lifers would be satisfied with the prospect that some other states make abortion legal so long as their own state bans it. This would include pro-lifers who recognize that the Constitution is silent on the topic of abortion, so no branch of the federal government is delegated the power to ban abortion across the entire nation.

This was my initial thinking on this subject as well, but I'm not sure I believe it anymore. If someone genuinely believes abortion is child murder, why should they be satisfied with a situation where babies are being killed in California but not Tennessee?

This relates to something that I think foreigners have a hard time understanding about American politics. More than once I've seen someone comment that the anti-abortion side is winning because abortion rates are going down in America, which is just an absolute misunderstanding of the actual issue. It's not a matter of one side wanting more abortions and the other wanting fewer abortions; given the belief that abortion constitutes murder, any legal abortion is too many.
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DavidB.
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« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2021, 06:49:54 PM »

Of course not. It will rather become one of the issues that are permanently high up on the political agenda, which is what many Republicans want (they don't understand how stupid this is).
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PSOL
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« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2021, 07:24:02 PM »

People would collectively go ape••••
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progressive85
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« Reply #8 on: November 30, 2021, 06:19:50 PM »

Not "depoliticize", but transform the debate overnight into a reset where the sides are now switched... so I argue yes, overturning Roe does more in the long run for legalization supporters.  

It gives the pro-life movement a desperately desired victory, and fuels a resistance movement from the pro-choice side... it takes us out of the current status quo, which is barely holding up at all.  Roe's been so chipped at that it's practically been neutered by a slew of state governments who have made their opposition to it a key part of their governing platform.

Sometimes you need to face an enormous loss before building back up again, and the best thing for the pro-choice side would be a staggering defeat by the Supreme Court.  

Backlash has its own kind of power - and it would even be felt in deeply pro-life, conservative states like Mississippi and Alabama.  Young women in those states could begin their own movements to restrict their legislatures from adopting the most extreme kinds of abortion laws.
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Ferguson97
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« Reply #9 on: December 01, 2021, 10:41:41 AM »

Not at all. If anything, overturning Roe would fan the flames of the abortion debate. It would become the number one issue for state legislature and gubernatorial elections.
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RFayette
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« Reply #10 on: December 01, 2021, 01:30:22 PM »

Of course not.  Then the issue becomes state-level bans and the possibility of the US Congress codifying Roe.
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TPIG
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« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2021, 01:09:15 PM »

I don't imagine so, at all. I think it will make abortion an even more prominent political issue, given the fact that voters and individual states will have far more liberty to craft their own abortion policies.

Either way, it's a good start.
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Mr. Smith
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« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2021, 01:27:18 AM »

Quite the opposite.
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E-Dawg 🇺🇦🇦🇲
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« Reply #13 on: August 01, 2022, 01:47:07 AM »

Bumping this. Answer is clearly no so far, but we'll see how it develops
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The Mikado
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« Reply #14 on: November 26, 2022, 01:39:03 AM »

Overturning Roe means that especially in swing states like, say, Michigan or Arizona, whether or not abortion is legal or not might well switch with every gubernatorial election and it becomes higher salience, not lower.

Megabump because, will you look at that, look which states I picked over a year ago.
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Frodo
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« Reply #15 on: November 26, 2022, 04:43:23 PM »

Well, now we know.  For my part, I was hoping that by overturning the original decision, the momentum and anger would shift to the pro-choice side (for a change) and that would benefit Democratic candidates.  That seems to be happening. 
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Antonio the Sixth
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« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2022, 04:35:40 AM »

If anything, it has repoliticized it for the average American voter. For the past decades, the only people who seemed to actually care about abortion was a tiny bunch of fringe activists who held disproportionate influence over the GOP. For everyone else, it was not really an issue on their radar (let's be real, how many people actually voted Democrat based on their pro-choice stance and not other issues?) because it was considered "settled law".

Now that abortion regulations are clearly defined as a political question (which, let's face it, was always what it should have been), regular voters are forced to face the reality that their vote has a material impact on the issue. And, as it turns out, the vast majority of Americans are not in favor of draconian abortion bans, and when they vote with the awareness that their abortion rights are at stake, they largely vote pro-choice. This is how democracy should work.
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Torie
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« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2022, 08:42:02 AM »

This issue is one where a majority of voters are moderate on the issue, but the political activists of both parties are immoderate. We shall now see if and when given that the issue has been tossed back to the voters, whether or not the two have some convergence over time. So far, the answer is no, but it's early.
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MarkD
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« Reply #18 on: December 04, 2022, 09:22:14 PM »

I have been wondering whether the pro-choice movement is going to rally around an explicit goal of retaking control of the Supreme Court in order to reinstate Roe v. Wade as the prevailing law of the land (notwithstanding Roe's trimester framework -- just using viability as the only line that marks when a government can or cannot regulate abortion -- but reinstating the legal principle that choosing to get an abortion is a fundamental right; legislation that interferes with the right must be strictly scrutinized). Although I would not agree with pursuing that strategy, I can understand why most pro-choicers might pursue it. If Trump can make a campaign promise to appoint "pro-life" people to the Court, with a goal of overturning an important precedent, then our side should elect a president who promises to appoint pro-choice people to the Supreme Court, with the goal of overturning Dobbs, and reinstating most of the principles that were in the original precedent .
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Santander
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« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2022, 06:28:52 PM »

I believe many pro-lifers would be satisfied with the prospect that some other states make abortion legal so long as their own state bans it. This would include pro-lifers who recognize that the Constitution is silent on the topic of abortion, so no branch of the federal government is delegated the power to ban abortion across the entire nation.

This was my initial thinking on this subject as well, but I'm not sure I believe it anymore. If someone genuinely believes abortion is child murder, why should they be satisfied with a situation where babies are being killed in California but not Tennessee?
ExtremeTheocrat thinks American foreign policy should be based on abortion laws.
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Samof94
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« Reply #20 on: December 27, 2022, 10:02:37 PM »

I believe many pro-lifers would be satisfied with the prospect that some other states make abortion legal so long as their own state bans it. This would include pro-lifers who recognize that the Constitution is silent on the topic of abortion, so no branch of the federal government is delegated the power to ban abortion across the entire nation.

This was my initial thinking on this subject as well, but I'm not sure I believe it anymore. If someone genuinely believes abortion is child murder, why should they be satisfied with a situation where babies are being killed in California but not Tennessee?
ExtremeTheocrat thinks American foreign policy should be based on abortion laws.

It’s not a baby at all. It doesn’t even have brain function until much later.
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