Russia-Ukraine war and related tensions Megathread

[Red Velvet]

https://twitter.com/ricwe123/status/1661375358166237192

[Hindsight was 2020]

The lazy whataboutism towards Palestine and Iraq which more or less boils down to “well because the West did bad stuff Ukraine needs to suffer” has been one of the more cringe arguments coming from Putin enablers

[Buffalo Mayor Young Kim]

https://twitter.com/ricwe123/status/1661375358166237192

Literal whataboutism is so very rare.

[Person Man]

https://twitter.com/ricwe123/status/1661375358166237192

Literal whataboutism is so very rare.

I would tell them to stop going off on tangents.

[Torie]

Is it possible that Putin's pugilism channeling Ivan the Terrible's barbarism giving peace a chance elsewhere? Is it possible that Putin's insane irredentist fantasies nurtures sanity elsewhere?

https://insightnews.media/armenia-is-ready-to-relinquish-nagorno-karabakh-and-quit-from-russia-led-csto/

[Middle-aged Europe]

Russia's prime minister was hosted in Beijing today. At this point, the West as a collective should seriously discuss sanctions against China. It's pretty clear the CCP supports Putin's imperialism and war crimes.

Not sanctioning China is needed as a proverbial carrot at this point IMO. They gotta understand, as long as they refrain from bombing Taipeh that we're gonna leave them alone.

[Red Velvet]

The lazy whataboutism towards Palestine and Iraq which more or less boils down to “well because the West did bad stuff Ukraine needs to suffer” has been one of the more cringe arguments coming from Putin enablers

Uhhhh Palestine STILL is ignored right now. And you see the opposite reasoning used to justify it. The “rules-based order” used to defend Ukraine simply doesn’t exist if it’s something that easily flip-flops depending single-handedly on “which side the west is more friends with”.

[Middle-aged Europe]

The obvious whataboutism aside, the Israel/Palestine situation is much more subject to a complex grey-and-grey situation than Ukraine/Russia ever was. Granted, Putin apologists tend to claim that Ukraine/Russia is grey-and-grey too... but it only goes to show that the only way to defend Putin's actions is to make the claim that Ukraine is "just as bad" which is kind of telling in itself.

[Red Velvet]

The obvious whataboutism aside, the Israel/Palestine situation is much more subject to a complex grey-and-grey situation than Ukraine/Russia ever was. Granted, Putin apologists tend to claim that Ukraine/Russia is grey-and-grey too... but it only goes to show that the only way to defend Putin's actions is to make the claim that Ukraine is "just as bad" which is kind of telling in itself.

Yes, it is different. And it starts by the color of the skin difference majority of people in Ukraine have in comparison to Palestine.

[Hindsight was 2020]

Ukraine is bad because they’re white now apparently 🙄

[Storr]

Somebody didn't put out their cigarette:

https://twitter.com/IntelCrab/status/1661509892014735362?s=20

[Storr]

The lazy whataboutism towards Palestine and Iraq which more or less boils down to “well because the West did bad stuff Ukraine needs to suffer” has been one of the more cringe arguments coming from Putin enablers

It's even stupider to bring up Palestine since it and Ukraine recognize each others' independence.

[Badger]

“Pre-recorded”? Wow this is embarrassing even for you

[Badger]

The lazy whataboutism towards Palestine and Iraq which more or less boils down to “well because the West did bad stuff Ukraine needs to suffer” has been one of the more cringe arguments coming from Putin enablers

[Oleg 🇰🇿🤝🇺🇦]

Russia's prime minister was hosted in Beijing today. At this point, the West as a collective should seriously discuss sanctions against China. It's pretty clear the CCP supports Putin's imperialism and war crimes.

Not sanctioning China is needed as a proverbial carrot at this point IMO. They gotta understand, as long as they refrain from bombing Taipeh that we're gonna leave them alone.

Sanctions against the PRC will be even less effective than against Russia, because the PRC has a gigantic population, many satellites around the world, an economy comparable to that of the US, and in general much more geopolitical weight than Russia. And the West is afraid of the PRC, otherwise there would have been an investigation into how Xi manages Pu. I wouldn't be surprised if Pu decided to turn Russia into one big car bomb because Xi told him to do so.

[CanadianDemocrat]

Is it possible that Putin's pugilism channeling Ivan the Terrible's barbarism giving peace a chance elsewhere? Is it possible that Putin's insane irredentist fantasies nurtures sanity elsewhere?

https://insightnews.media/armenia-is-ready-to-relinquish-nagorno-karabakh-and-quit-from-russia-led-csto/

With the Russian Empire collapsing and the CSTO being proven as a joke, Armenia should join NATO. NATO is strong enough to enforce it's mutual defense treaty, while Russia is too weak to help out one of their allies.

[NOVA Green]

Somebody didn't put out their cigarette:

https://twitter.com/IntelCrab/status/1661509892014735362?s=20

It is clear the Russian military folks and defense plant workers do have a bad habit of smoking in prohibited areas.

[Stranger in a strange land]

The lazy whataboutism towards Palestine and Iraq which more or less boils down to “well because the West did bad stuff Ukraine needs to suffer” has been one of the more cringe arguments coming from Putin enablers

Uhhhh Palestine STILL is ignored right now. And you see the opposite reasoning used to justify it. The “rules-based order” used to defend Ukraine simply doesn’t exist if it’s something that easily flip-flops depending single-handedly on “which side the west is more friends with”.

This isn’t necessarily wrong, but I think you know full well what people are usually doing when they say “What about Palestine?” in a conversation about Ukraine. The point is almost never that you should also support Palestine: it’s that you shouldn’t support Ukraine

[Hindsight was 2020]

The lazy whataboutism towards Palestine and Iraq which more or less boils down to “well because the West did bad stuff Ukraine needs to suffer” has been one of the more cringe arguments coming from Putin enablers

Uhhhh Palestine STILL is ignored right now. And you see the opposite reasoning used to justify it. The “rules-based order” used to defend Ukraine simply doesn’t exist if it’s something that easily flip-flops depending single-handedly on “which side the west is more friends with”.

This isn’t necessarily wrong, but I think you know full well what people are usually doing when they say “What about Palestine?” in a conversation about Ukraine. The point is almost never that you should also support Palestine: it’s that you shouldn’t support Ukraine

Red Velvet is in that camp too so it’s not really a swaying point to them

[NOVA Green]

Surprised that nobody has yet posted "Putin's Chef" comments from earlier today...

Fresh off his claim of victory in capturing the Ukrainian city of Bakhmut, Russian mercenary boss Yevgeniy Prigozhin warned that Moscow’s brutal war could plunge Russia into turmoil similar to the 1917 revolution unless its detached, wealthy elite become more directly committed to the conflict.

In a lengthy interview with Konstantin Dolgov, a political operative and pro-war blogger, Prigozhin, the founder and leader of the Wagner mercenary group, also asserted that the war had backfired spectacularly by failing to “demilitarize” Ukraine, one of President Vladimir Putin’s stated aims of the invasion. He also called for totalitarian policies.

“We are in a situation where we can simply lose Russia,” Prigozhin said, using an expletive to hammer his point. “We must introduce martial law. We unfortunately … must announce new waves of mobilization; we must put everyone who is capable to work on increasing the production of ammunition,” he said. “Russia needs to live like North Korea for a few years, so to say, close the borders … and work hard.”

Citing public anger at the lavish lifestyles of Russia’s rich and powerful, Prigozhin warned their homes could be stormed by people with “pitchforks.” He singled out Ksenia Shoigu, the daughter of Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu, who was spotted vacationing in Dubai with her fiancé, Alexei Stolyarov, a fitness blogger.

“The children of the elite shut their traps at best, and some allow themselves a public, fat, carefree life,” Prigozhin said in the interview, which was released Wednesday on video. “This division might end as in 1917, with a revolution — when first the soldiers rise up, and then their loved ones follow.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/05/24/yevgeniy-prigozhin-war-backfired-revolution/

[NOVA Green]

Looks like Ukraine will be getting another NASAMS system in the neat future...

The U.S. State Department approved a possible $285 million sale of a NASAMS air defense system to Ukraine Wednesday. NASAMS — which stands for National Advanced Surface-to-Air Missile Systems — is the air defense suite used to protect the White House. The U.S. previously sent two NASAMS systems to Ukraine, and planned to send six more, not including the one system approved Thursday.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/05/24/russia-ukraine-war-news-belgorod/

[NOVA Green]

For anybody still claiming the Russian vs. Ukrainian casualties in Bakhmut "was a wash" with relatively comparable casualty levels, there are others who might disagree.

https://twitter.com/JimmySecUK/status/1661411293390094336?s=20

Let's face it 100k casualties for a single battle is insane in 2023, considering the total number of both active duty Russian Military, and even if you combine it with the "Irregulars" of the Wagner Corp. and the annexed Russian Oblasts within Ukraine, still....

Putin's Chef's claim that there might well be a revolution in Russia does Grok a bit, considering the history of Russian Revolutions...

Sure, he has his own agenda, but yet Putin can't live with him, or live without him...

Acting you like you are "The Godfather" doesn't always play well once their has become a crisis of confidence of the elites regarding the state of the regime.

Let's face it, this was a one-man show and decision to invade Ukraine, namely Mr. Putin himself has also lost a significant amount of confidence amongst the Russian people himself.

The current Russian Czar has been caught with his pants down, just like the Emperor with no Clothes, and even now the "Mocking Jays" are lurking waiting for the right time to seize a favorable political opportunity to take down the authoritarian regime.

Although I do not yet believe the Revolutionary Conditions are current right in Russia for a mass uprising against the regime, it appears to be patently clear that the Putin Regime and his "United Russia" Party are basically "Paper Tigers", where the wind can shift extremely quickly, just like the Winds from the Artic....

[NOVA Green]

Somebody didn't put out their cigarette:

https://twitter.com/IntelCrab/status/1661509892014735362?s=20

In theory this is plausible, but one must assume that within office environments, especially something such as an MoD office there should be adequate fire suppression systems, as well a Life Safety Systems (LSS), including electronic monitoring systems designed to automatically flag and quickly suppress the fire with the sprinkler system designed to quickly detect smoke and extinguish the fire, well before it comes to a point where we see exterior smoke images.

Meanwhile we do have a couple other titbits from the ''Radio Free Russia Underground", that provide a few additional details:

In Moscow, the building of the Ministry of Defense on Frunzenskaya Embankment turned out to be smoky, the Moscow agency reports with reference to the capital's department of the Ministry of Emergency Situations. The emergency services refused to call it a fire and explained the appearance of smoke as "starting a generator."

A video from a place where smoke is visible around the building was posted by the Moscow Live telegram channel . The public, citing eyewitnesses, also wrote about the “pungent smell of plastic” in the air.

In April, there was a fire in the building of the Ministry of Defense on Znamenka, near the old building of the General Staff. It started because of a lit kettle.

https://zona.media/news/2023/05/24/frnz

Now, the Russians are claiming it was "starting a Generator" sounds absurd at the best, although granted I am not an expert on the subject, we have multiple E-GENS located at the factory, where we are required to various monthly maintenance PMs, Monitor visible plumage coming out of the stacks to meet the opacity ratios on a certain frequency, it does not appear that the "Emergency Generator" plumes would exhibit the traditional patterns which are being claimed.

Sure, I get that eyewitnesses sometimes have memories which cheat, but "the pungent smell of plastics", makes me wonder if "The Facility" might have had an incinerator in the compound?

Recall conversations from years back in Tejas, about how they used to have incinerators onsite until not that long ago.

Even if it just a "Technical Malfunction" involving routine "Preventative Maintenance and Testing" and or a small fire caused up a decrepit ancient Soviet onsite Incinerator or Generator, or even an accidental fire out in the plastic recycling bin area on the backside, where a few workers might have been joking around drinking a bit of Wodka, pulled out a can of spray paint, pulled out a lighter, and suddenly "Boom"...

Anyway you look it at this is embarrassing, and most likely caused by them sending skilled facilities maint tech guys (Or their sons) over to Ukraine, and suddenly they have a major issue with a dumpster fire in the courtyard (Best Case Scenario for the Kremlin).

I have posted multiple times on this thread about how Russia has historically over the past 25 years one of the worst rates of worker fatalities in many sectors compared to most other major industrial manufacturing nations.

Well prior to Russia's Invasion and Occupation of Ukraine 2.0, Russia was one of the worst in the world for fatal industrial incidents.

The population of Russia is increasingly aging, meaning that there are fewer workers available with the KSE to handle the complex infrastructures of increasingly aging industrial facilities, especially those involved with manufacturing production versus the energy extraction sector.

The forced "draft notices" were disproportionally dislocated in various "Ethnic Minority" regions of Russia when Putin signed the bill into law.

I would continue to expect more natural and horrible industrial incidents in Russia the longer the War in Ukraine continues, and not because of either Ukrainian or Anti-Putin Russian elements, but simply for the fact they cannot continue to maintain their facilities, upgrade their buildings to represent modern standard when it comes to International Fire Code (IFC), let alone International Building Code (IBC).

I shudder to think about the state of the electrical infrastructure at the Russian Ministry of Defense.

Was an Electrician smoking around open HV Panels with tons of Combustible Dust?

Still, even if it was just one little mouse, I'll take it!!!

[Oleg 🇰🇿🤝🇺🇦]

Somebody didn't put out their cigarette:
https://twitter.com/IntelCrab/status/1661509892014735362?s=20

It is clear the Russian military folks and defense plant workers do have a bad habit of smoking in prohibited areas.

As absurd as it may seem, the Russians really believe that their primary need is to smoke in prohibited places and not to use protective equipment when their superiors and labor protection officers are not watching. I see this every day. Guards are pulling steel plates from their bulletproof vests, workers are walking around without helmets and throwing cigarette butts into troughs where oil drips.

[Oleg 🇰🇿🤝🇺🇦]

Surprised that nobody has yet posted "Putin's Chef" comments from earlier today...

Fresh off his claim of victory in capturing the Ukrainian city of Bakhmut, Russian mercenary boss Yevgeniy Prigozhin warned that Moscow’s brutal war could plunge Russia into turmoil similar to the 1917 revolution unless its detached, wealthy elite become more directly committed to the conflict.

In a lengthy interview with Konstantin Dolgov, a political operative and pro-war blogger, Prigozhin, the founder and leader of the Wagner mercenary group, also asserted that the war had backfired spectacularly by failing to “demilitarize” Ukraine, one of President Vladimir Putin’s stated aims of the invasion. He also called for totalitarian policies.

“We are in a situation where we can simply lose Russia,” Prigozhin said, using an expletive to hammer his point. “We must introduce martial law. We unfortunately … must announce new waves of mobilization; we must put everyone who is capable to work on increasing the production of ammunition,” he said. “Russia needs to live like North Korea for a few years, so to say, close the borders … and work hard.”

Citing public anger at the lavish lifestyles of Russia’s rich and powerful, Prigozhin warned their homes could be stormed by people with “pitchforks.” He singled out Ksenia Shoigu, the daughter of Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu, who was spotted vacationing in Dubai with her fiancé, Alexei Stolyarov, a fitness blogger.

“The children of the elite shut their traps at best, and some allow themselves a public, fat, carefree life,” Prigozhin said in the interview, which was released Wednesday on video. “This division might end as in 1917, with a revolution — when first the soldiers rise up, and then their loved ones follow.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/05/24/yevgeniy-prigozhin-war-backfired-revolution/

Prigozhin seems literally one step away from shouting out: 炮打司令部. But I don't think he will actually do it. The Wagner unit is part of Putin's personal structure, not a unit of Limonov, Barkashov, Girkin & Kvachkov or other consistently anti-Putin (but still only in words) Russian fascists.

I think he says this so that Wagner's crimes are not considered Putin's crimes, and also because of the activation of movements like the RDK, so that the real opponents of Putin among the Ruscists come on stage and thereby expose themselves to the blows of state security services.