Is liberal religion decreasing in the US?

[°Leprechaun]

If yes, why?

[Ferguson97]

Yes, because while religion as a whole is on a decline, Evangelicalism is on a rise.

[Del Tachi]

The wreckage of the former "mainline" denominations sits atop a modernist theology that began to dominate mainline seminaries during the early 20th century.  Eventually, many mainline theologians came to reject nearly every doctrinal aspect of traditional Christianity.  The resulting secularization of the mainline denominations has proven itself a self-limiting process; as these churches become further removed from doctrinal Christianity, they are being replaced by churches that offer more vigorous spiritual messages. 

Even though so many have left, those remaining in the mainline pews still overwhelmingly regard the traditional tenets of Christian belief as central to their faith.  Their exodus will continue as long as mainline clergy and seminaries claim it is their right to instruct the faithful in more "progressive" spiritual and political views.

[World politics is up Schmitt creek]

The wreckage of the former "mainline" denominations sits atop a modernist theology that began to dominate mainline seminaries during the early 20th century.  Eventually, many mainline theologians came to reject nearly every doctrinal aspect of traditional Christianity.  The resulting secularization of the mainline denominations has proven itself a self-limiting process; as these churches become further removed from doctrinal Christianity, they are being replaced by churches that offer more vigorous spiritual messages. 

Even though so many have left, those remaining in the mainline pews still overwhelmingly regard the traditional tenets of Christian belief as central to their faith.  Their exodus will continue as long as mainline clergy and seminaries claim it is their right to instruct the faithful in more "progressive" spiritual and political views.

The progressives/modernists/whatever are also comprehensively failing to pass on any understanding of why religion is important to their children, which leads to hemorrhaging on the left of the mainline denominations as well as on the right.

[H. Ross Peron]

The wreckage of the former "mainline" denominations sits atop a modernist theology that began to dominate mainline seminaries during the early 20th century.  Eventually, many mainline theologians came to reject nearly every doctrinal aspect of traditional Christianity.  The resulting secularization of the mainline denominations has proven itself a self-limiting process; as these churches become further removed from doctrinal Christianity, they are being replaced by churches that offer more vigorous spiritual messages. 

Even though so many have left, those remaining in the mainline pews still overwhelmingly regard the traditional tenets of Christian belief as central to their faith.  Their exodus will continue as long as mainline clergy and seminaries claim it is their right to instruct the faithful in more "progressive" spiritual and political views.

The progressives/modernists/whatever are also comprehensively failing to pass on any understanding of why religion is important to their children, which leads to hemorrhaging on the left of the mainline denominations as well as on the right.

There is a certain parallel between the decline of mainline Protestant denominations in the West and the decline of social democratic/labour parties in Europe, which incidentally shared overlapping demographics in places such as the UK and Germany. In both cases, constant watering down of core principles and doctrines made adherents/voters see little point in continuing to supporting them while making the leap to secularism/conservative parties all the more easier. Moreover, their beliefs undermined key institutions that ensured reproduction of support-liberal theology made it less likely parents would teach their children Christian beliefs and the turn to the Third Way undermined labour union strength.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

No, we are defined as Secularist or Traditionalist and cuts both ways between religion and politics

I just find it fascinating that the found Jesus grave an Ossuary Box, Priests don't talk about Mary Magdalene for a reason because they found the boxes of James, Jesus and Mary


No one said they're isn't a God or alien like Creature that is God but Jesus was a High Priest of God of Course

Many Secularists question the death of Jesus including Muslims, that's why there hasn't been a Rapture but there is the Astral plane and can be Reincarnation

[Dr. MB]

No, we are defined as Secularist or Traditionalist and cuts both ways between religion and politics

I just find it fascinating that the found Jesus grave an Ossuary Box, Priests don't talk about Mary Magdalene for a reason because they found the boxes of James, Jesus and Mary


No one said they're isn't a God or alien like Creature that is God but Jesus was a High Priest of God of Course

Many Secularists question the death of Jesus including Muslims, that's why there hasn't been a Rapture but there is the Astral plane and can be Reincarnation

Why would God be an alien like creature? Do you watch Ancient Aliens?

[afleitch]

Mainstream religious affiliation is on the rise, and has been for a number of years (PRRI, GSS) and the median age of a white evangelical Protestant is higher than any other denomination.

[Torie]

Mainstream religious affiliation is on the rise, and has been for a number of years (PRRI, GSS) and the median age of a white evangelical Protestant is higher than any other denomination.

I did not know that, and it surprises me frankly.

[TJ in Oregon]

Mainstream religious affiliation is on the rise, and has been for a number of years (PRRI, GSS) and the median age of a white evangelical Protestant is higher than any other denomination.

I did not know that, and it surprises me frankly.

The study had a flawed methodology. It considered all people who self-identify as Christian but not as Evangelical or Catholic to be mainline. So what is almost certainly actually happening is younger non-denominational Christians who don't like labels are getting lumped into their "Mainline" category. There has not been any kind of corresponding increase in membership in mainline denominations.

[Antonio the Sixth]

The wreckage of the former "mainline" denominations sits atop a modernist theology that began to dominate mainline seminaries during the early 20th century.  Eventually, many mainline theologians came to reject nearly every doctrinal aspect of traditional Christianity.  The resulting secularization of the mainline denominations has proven itself a self-limiting process; as these churches become further removed from doctrinal Christianity, they are being replaced by churches that offer more vigorous spiritual messages. 

Even though so many have left, those remaining in the mainline pews still overwhelmingly regard the traditional tenets of Christian belief as central to their faith.  Their exodus will continue as long as mainline clergy and seminaries claim it is their right to instruct the faithful in more "progressive" spiritual and political views.

The progressives/modernists/whatever are also comprehensively failing to pass on any understanding of why religion is important to their children, which leads to hemorrhaging on the left of the mainline denominations as well as on the right.

There is a certain parallel between the decline of mainline Protestant denominations in the West and the decline of social democratic/labour parties in Europe, which incidentally shared overlapping demographics in places such as the UK and Germany. In both cases, constant watering down of core principles and doctrines made adherents/voters see little point in continuing to supporting them while making the leap to secularism/conservative parties all the more easier. Moreover, their beliefs undermined key institutions that ensured reproduction of support-liberal theology made it less likely parents would teach their children Christian beliefs and the turn to the Third Way undermined labour union strength.

I think I made that exact point to Nathan many years ago. It seems like a really salient parallel.

[they don't love you like i love you]

Mainstream religious affiliation is on the rise, and has been for a number of years (PRRI, GSS) and the median age of a white evangelical Protestant is higher than any other denomination.

I did not know that, and it surprises me frankly.

The study had a flawed methodology. It considered all people who self-identify as Christian but not as Evangelical or Catholic to be mainline. So what is almost certainly actually happening is younger non-denominational Christians who don't like labels are getting lumped into their "Mainline" category. There has not been any kind of corresponding increase in membership in mainline denominations.

This is purely anecdotal, but one thing I have noticed is there's a tendency for Millennial Democratic politicians to belong to liberal churches that they converted to. For example this woman (who went kind of viral in Minnesota political circles recently for her anti-vax takedown tweets) has a surname that doesn't exactly scream "cradle Episcopalian" (it's hyphenated but neither one does) and went to a Catholic university. And Xochitl Torres Small even if she was a Blue Dog was raised Mormon but is also an active member of an ELCA Lutheran church that she was fairly vocal about as well. Just two examples but I've noticed others.

Of course one could also argue that Millennial politicians are more likely to attend church and convert than Millennials in general even if they are liberal, as attending church is a form of civil engagement, and more civic engaged people are more likely to get involved and run for office.

[Хahar 🤔]

Mainstream religious affiliation is on the rise, and has been for a number of years (PRRI, GSS) and the median age of a white evangelical Protestant is higher than any other denomination.

I did not know that, and it surprises me frankly.

The study had a flawed methodology. It considered all people who self-identify as Christian but not as Evangelical or Catholic to be mainline. So what is almost certainly actually happening is younger non-denominational Christians who don't like labels are getting lumped into their "Mainline" category. There has not been any kind of corresponding increase in membership in mainline denominations.

This is purely anecdotal, but one thing I have noticed is there's a tendency for Millennial Democratic politicians to belong to liberal churches that they converted to. For example this woman (who went kind of viral in Minnesota political circles recently for her anti-vax takedown tweets) has a surname that doesn't exactly scream "cradle Episcopalian" (it's hyphenated but neither one does) and went to a Catholic university. And Xochitl Torres Small even if she was a Blue Dog was raised Mormon but is also an active member of an ELCA Lutheran church that she was fairly vocal about as well. Just two examples but I've noticed others.

Of course one could also argue that Millennial politicians are more likely to attend church and convert than Millennials in general even if they are liberal, as attending church is a form of civil engagement, and more civic engaged people are more likely to get involved and run for office.

"Carlie Kotyza-Witthuhn" may not sound like the name of an Episcopalian, but it absolutely does sound like the name of a woman who graduated from St. Thomas with a degree in something that doesn't sound academic and lives in the southwest suburbs now. It's the name of someone who works in marketing at Target whom you see in the skyway at lunchtime among a group of other women who look exactly the same. (She herself doesn't look exactly like that, though.)

Anyway, beyond the reasons that the sort of person who might go into politics would also be the sort of person to join a church, it's clear that church membership is in itself helpful for candidates. Membership in a church (or other religious congregation) brings with it a built-in group of supporters, and it also suggests moral values and rootedness in the community, both of which are real assets.

[they don't love you like i love you]

Mainstream religious affiliation is on the rise, and has been for a number of years (PRRI, GSS) and the median age of a white evangelical Protestant is higher than any other denomination.

I did not know that, and it surprises me frankly.

The study had a flawed methodology. It considered all people who self-identify as Christian but not as Evangelical or Catholic to be mainline. So what is almost certainly actually happening is younger non-denominational Christians who don't like labels are getting lumped into their "Mainline" category. There has not been any kind of corresponding increase in membership in mainline denominations.

This is purely anecdotal, but one thing I have noticed is there's a tendency for Millennial Democratic politicians to belong to liberal churches that they converted to. For example this woman (who went kind of viral in Minnesota political circles recently for her anti-vax takedown tweets) has a surname that doesn't exactly scream "cradle Episcopalian" (it's hyphenated but neither one does) and went to a Catholic university. And Xochitl Torres Small even if she was a Blue Dog was raised Mormon but is also an active member of an ELCA Lutheran church that she was fairly vocal about as well. Just two examples but I've noticed others.

Of course one could also argue that Millennial politicians are more likely to attend church and convert than Millennials in general even if they are liberal, as attending church is a form of civil engagement, and more civic engaged people are more likely to get involved and run for office.

"Carlie Kotyza-Witthuhn" may not sound like the name of an Episcopalian, but it absolutely does sound like the name of a woman who graduated from St. Thomas with a degree in something that doesn't sound academic and lives in the southwest suburbs now. It's the name of someone who works in marketing at Target whom you see in the skyway at lunchtime among a group of other women who look exactly the same. (She herself doesn't look exactly like that, though.)

Anyway, beyond the reasons that the sort of person who might go into politics would also be the sort of person to join a church, it's clear that church membership is in itself helpful for candidates. Membership in a church (or other religious congregation) brings with it a built-in group of supporters, and it also suggests moral values and rootedness in the community, both of which are real assets.

I was going to make a joke about with how she looks I'm surprised she's married to a man, but then remembered she kind of resembles a woman at my church who is also married to a man. That hairstyle is obviously not uncommon on straight women, it's just that they usually tend to be either college aged or middle aged.

FWIW my very evangelical cousin's daughter just started attending the same university this month and it's obviously not a "Catholic only" place, but upon a quick search it appears her father passed away in 2019, (quite sad as he wasn't really that old) and received a Catholic funeral. So her background is obvious.

But in regards to the last point: absolutely. And an Episcopal church in Edina is exactly the sort of place to look for DFL primary voters in Eden Prarie, as well as previously Republican voters who adamantly refused to vote for Trump but were still willing to vote Republican downballot initially but after two years of Trump were open to even voting out a pro-choice/pro-same sex marriage/pro-marijuana legalization incumbent who had never had a competitive race in the past, like who she narrowly defeated in 2018. Also while she won by 10 points in 2020 and the seat is basically Safe D now that's still a significant underrunning of Biden who carried it by 25 points. And an Episcopal church in Edina is also the sort of place one could expect to find people at least open to split ticket voting.

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

The 'Spongian' elements of progressive Christianity have certainly been no help in winning over converts and keeping people and their families in the pews. I am of the belief that a church can be 'open and affirming' to LGBT people while maintaining a theologically orthodox message that offers a real and enticing alternative to secularism. In that regard, mainline churches have failed.

The Church of England has actually managed to attract young people by going back to basics and rejecting modernist theology that denies the divinity of Christ and the Resurrection. Because absent those things, there is little incentive to join a church that merely reinforces modernist norms rather than preach the Word. Mainline churches ought to take lessons from the CoE and Billy Graham if they want to stop the bleeding of membership and believers.

[Kingpoleon]

The 'Spongian' elements of progressive Christianity have certainly been no help in winning over converts and keeping people and their families in the pews. I am of the belief that a church can be 'open and affirming' to LGBT people while maintaining a theologically orthodox message that offers a real and enticing alternative to secularism. In that regard, mainline churches have failed.

The Church of England has actually managed to attract young people by going back to basics and rejecting modernist theology that denies the divinity of Christ and the Resurrection. Because absent those things, there is little incentive to join a church that merely reinforces modernist norms rather than preach the Word. Mainline churches ought to take lessons from the CoE and Billy Graham if they want to stop the bleeding of membership and believers.

There’s also the fact that secular people and religious liberal people have far fewer children than, say, evangelicals do. A facinating book on the subject is called “The Religious Shall Inherit the Earth.”

[Statilius the Epicurean]

The wreckage of the former "mainline" denominations sits atop a modernist theology that began to dominate mainline seminaries during the early 20th century.  Eventually, many mainline theologians came to reject nearly every doctrinal aspect of traditional Christianity.  The resulting secularization of the mainline denominations has proven itself a self-limiting process; as these churches become further removed from doctrinal Christianity, they are being replaced by churches that offer more vigorous spiritual messages.  

Even though so many have left, those remaining in the mainline pews still overwhelmingly regard the traditional tenets of Christian belief as central to their faith.  Their exodus will continue as long as mainline clergy and seminaries claim it is their right to instruct the faithful in more "progressive" spiritual and political views.

The progressives/modernists/whatever are also comprehensively failing to pass on any understanding of why religion is important to their children, which leads to hemorrhaging on the left of the mainline denominations as well as on the right.

There is a certain parallel between the decline of mainline Protestant denominations in the West and the decline of social democratic/labour parties in Europe, which incidentally shared overlapping demographics in places such as the UK and Germany. In both cases, constant watering down of core principles and doctrines made adherents/voters see little point in continuing to supporting them while making the leap to secularism/conservative parties all the more easier. Moreover, their beliefs undermined key institutions that ensured reproduction of support-liberal theology made it less likely parents would teach their children Christian beliefs and the turn to the Third Way undermined labour union strength.

This is an extremely silly parallel. Social democratic parties didn't decline because their voters were so ideologically socialist that they reacted to Third Wayism by becoming conservative (how does that even make any sense?), nor because social democratic parties undermined labour unions (one could argue this in the case of idk New Zealand, but the UK? Sweden? France?). The decline happened because of the transition out of the industrial economy and the increasing fluidity of class society. Longue durée trends or tectonic plates shifting underneath Western society in general and not reducible to a voluntaristic lack of ideological will on the part of every single centre-left party in the world at the same time.

Anyway I'm not competent to comment on the membership of US mainline Protestant churches, and don't mean to dispute the lack of will thesis for churches - it might be right for all I know. But it seems to me the proper comparison would be not be between churches and political parties because 95% of voters for a party aren't members and don't do anything for it except put a cross in a ballot box once every few years. The more proper comparison would be between churches and unions as similar institutions. The key driver of the decline of social democratic and labour parties: why has union density fallen? One reason that links to church membership is that people move jobs, and therefore communities, much more often than they used to 70 years ago. It's more difficult to maintain local institutions of every kind (e.g. Putnam's famous bowling clubs) when people are more transient, and transience applies doubly so to urban areas, where more people live now. Were the members of mainline churches more likely to move communities? Were the churches themselves based in communities which had greater changes in demographics than others? IDK I just made that hypothesis up and I don't know the answer. But it sounds more fruitful to me than bogus analogies to European political parties.

[All Along The Watchtower]

All religion is declining in the US.

Much of what passes for conservative "religion" in the US is right-wing politics with religious trappings. Same with what remains of liberal "religion."

Say what you want about them, at least the secular liberals (and secular conservatives, for that matter) aren't pretending. There are plenty of individuals all over the political spectrum who have sincere religious commitments - I have befriended several on this very forum - but when you are asking about trends in a country of well over 300 million people, the answers are necessarily generalizations.

[Samof94]

All religion is declining in the US.

Much of what passes for conservative "religion" in the US is right-wing politics with religious trappings. Same with what remains of liberal "religion."

Say what you want about them, at least the secular liberals (and secular conservatives, for that matter) aren't pretending. There are plenty of individuals all over the political spectrum who have sincere religious commitments - I have befriended several on this very forum - but when you are asking about trends in a country of well over 300 million people, the answers are necessarily generalizations.

Televangelists are in it for the money.

[John Dule]

All religion is declining in the US.

Much of what passes for conservative "religion" in the US is right-wing politics with religious trappings. Same with what remains of liberal "religion."

Say what you want about them, at least the secular liberals (and secular conservatives, for that matter) aren't pretending. There are plenty of individuals all over the political spectrum who have sincere religious commitments - I have befriended several on this very forum - but when you are asking about trends in a country of well over 300 million people, the answers are necessarily generalizations.

Televangelists are in it for the money.

As opposed to... ?

[Samof94]

All religion is declining in the US.

Much of what passes for conservative "religion" in the US is right-wing politics with religious trappings. Same with what remains of liberal "religion."

Say what you want about them, at least the secular liberals (and secular conservatives, for that matter) aren't pretending. There are plenty of individuals all over the political spectrum who have sincere religious commitments - I have befriended several on this very forum - but when you are asking about trends in a country of well over 300 million people, the answers are necessarily generalizations.

Televangelists are in it for the money.

As opposed to... ?

Actually caring about people. They also back GOP candidates as well and promote hateful ideas .