Why do people even believe in hell?

[HillGoose]

personally bcuz i have to be as negative as possible at all times so i have to constantly tell myself and believe i will go to hell when i die bcuz of course that would happen to me just bcuz god hates me for existing

like i dont know if i even believe in god or anything but one thing i do know is that when i die i'm going to end up in hell no matter what i do

[TDAS04]

I have met far too many clever people who were desperately immoral to deny the reality of Hell.

I beg to differ. The idea of a Sikh man going to a Christian hell makes zero sense.

I’m not sure what you mean by that.  If Christianity is the correct religion, a Sikh can go to whatever hell Christianity teaches the existence of.  If Sikhism is the correct religion, a Christian can reincarnate.  If a religion is true, it’s true.

[Samof94]

I have met far too many clever people who were desperately immoral to deny the reality of Hell.

I beg to differ. The idea of a Sikh man going to a Christian hell makes zero sense.

I’m not sure what you mean by that.  If Christianity is the correct religion, a Sikh can go to whatever hell Christianity teaches the existence of.  If Sikhism is the correct religion, a Christian can reincarnate.  If a religion is true, it’s true.

What I mean is that non Christians in a Christian hell shows how absurd the idea of Hell is.

[Kingpoleon]

What I mean is that non Christians in a Christian hell shows how absurd the idea of Hell is.

I find myself baffled by your theological insight.

[James Monroe]

Look at John Shelby Spong statement on the issue of Hell. This man is a pastor and he even acknowledges the position of Hell was used as a scar tactic by the church, something that those who are serious about their faith should look into.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc

[The world will shine with light in our nightmare]

Look at John Shelby Spong statement on the issue of Hell. This man is a pastor and he even acknowledges the position of Hell was used as a scar tactic by the church, something that those who are serious about their faith should look into.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc

As a card-carrying member of the Atlas Christian Left Gang™, I've never been a fan of Spong even though he's right that Hell has been and is used as a weapon to keep people in line. It is one thing to differ on the existence or nature of Hell, but flat-out denying the Resurrection or Divinity of Christ, as Spong has done, makes you an apostate. And it is his method of theology that has contributed to the bleeding of the Episcopal Church compared to churches which are more (small-o) orthodox.

[Former President tack50]

Hell seems like the kind of tool that a conquering army would use to intimidate people.

Tbh a belief I've had for quite a while is that many religious norms and tenets hold not really a "spiritual" use, but rather a very pragmatic one. Nothing about God giving us orders but rather something that had a practical application here on Earth, certainly at the time the religion was "invented".

My go-to example is the Jewish and Muslim restrictions on various food, born not out of God giving us orders but rather because poorly cooked pork or whatever could have given you an illness back in the day. Of course it isn't applicable now but the religion has stuck with that.

Hell indeed is just another tool like that. It's much easier to convert people to your religion when you tell them that if they don't, they'll burn in hell for eternity rather than telling them "sure, it's fine if you don't convert ".

Of course the real incentive wasn't hell or the lack thereof but rather the invading army which has been destroing villages in your kindgom or whatever. I find "Convert or we'll burn you at the stake" more convincing than "convert or you'll go to hell when you die" personally

[Kingpoleon]

Look at John Shelby Spong statement on the issue of Hell. This man is a pastor and he even acknowledges the position of Hell was used as a scar tactic by the church, something that those who are serious about their faith should look into.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc

Look at Michael Behe statement on the issue of Evolution. This man is a biochemist and even he acknowledges the position of Evolution was used as justification for Holocaust, something that those who are serious about Evolution should look into.

[Samof94]

Look at John Shelby Spong statement on the issue of Hell. This man is a pastor and he even acknowledges the position of Hell was used as a scar tactic by the church, something that those who are serious about their faith should look into.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF6I5VSZVqc

Look at Michael Behe statement on the issue of Evolution. This man is a biochemist and even he acknowledges the position of Evolution was used as justification for Holocaust, something that those who are serious about Evolution should look into.

He’s not a credible source by any definition. They used social Darwinism, not evolution. Whales did once live on land and have legs.

[Samof94]

Hell seems like the kind of tool that a conquering army would use to intimidate people.

Tbh a belief I've had for quite a while is that many religious norms and tenets hold not really a "spiritual" use, but rather a very pragmatic one. Nothing about God giving us orders but rather something that had a practical application here on Earth, certainly at the time the religion was "invented".

My go-to example is the Jewish and Muslim restrictions on various food, born not out of God giving us orders but rather because poorly cooked pork or whatever could have given you an illness back in the day. Of course it isn't applicable now but the religion has stuck with that.

Hell indeed is just another tool like that. It's much easier to convert people to your religion when you tell them that if they don't, they'll burn in hell for eternity rather than telling them "sure, it's fine if you don't convert ".

Of course the real incentive wasn't hell or the lack thereof but rather the invading army which has been destroing villages in your kindgom or whatever. I find "Convert or we'll burn you at the stake" more convincing than "convert or you'll go to hell when you die" personally

Exactly. The problem with hell is it isn’t a credible threat to people who don’t already believe.

[H. Ross Peron]

People like to believe there will be “justice” for bad people, especially those who may not get it in this life.

But nobody thinks THEY will be the ones going to hell…

There's been plenty of Christians (the Puritans are an excellent example) who believed they were going to Hell because they had not properly repented or had not undergone true conversion.

[Ferguson97]

Lies, fear, and emotional manipulation.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

What I mean is that non Christians in a Christian hell shows how absurd the idea of Hell is.

I find myself baffled by your theological insight.

Why are you baffled?

It's fairly obvious his point is that he believes it to be absurd for someone to be judged by a belief system one doesn't share and might not even have heard of.

[patzer]

In the event of Christianity being real, it feels to me like Hell is more of a scary story God would tell the people in order to get them to fall in line and not do awful stuff willy-nilly without consequence. Once someone's dead and in God's world, there would be no need for a hell of course.

[Kingpoleon]

Look at Michael Behe statement on the issue of Evolution. This man is a biochemist and even he acknowledges the position of Evolution was used as justification for Holocaust, something that those who are serious about Evolution should look into.

He’s not a credible source by any definition. They used social Darwinism, not evolution. Whales did once live on land and have legs.

I’m pretty clearly mocking the idea that one fringe person in a group shows the rest of the group to liars.

Why are you baffled?

It's fairly obvious his point is that he believes it to be absurd for someone to be judged by a belief system one doesn't share and might not even have heard of.

He wouldn’t be being judged by “a belief system” - AFAIK, no Christian church claims to know the calculus of whether or not any specific non believer goes to Hell - but by God, the very ground of being. If He is the Good itself, I cannot see a reasonable objection to being judged by the Good. Indeed, it is imitation of this judgment that we feebly attempt when we engage in moral judgment.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

Look at Michael Behe statement on the issue of Evolution. This man is a biochemist and even he acknowledges the position of Evolution was used as justification for Holocaust, something that those who are serious about Evolution should look into.

He’s not a credible source by any definition. They used social Darwinism, not evolution. Whales did once live on land and have legs.

I’m pretty clearly mocking the idea that one fringe person in a group shows the rest of the group to liars.

Why are you baffled?

It's fairly obvious his point is that he believes it to be absurd for someone to be judged by a belief system one doesn't share and might not even have heard of.

He wouldn’t be being judged by “a belief system” - AFAIK, no Christian church claims to know the calculus of whether or not any specific non believer goes to Hell - but by God, the very ground of being. If He is the Good itself, I cannot see a reasonable objection to being judged by the Good. Indeed, it is imitation of this judgment that we feebly attempt when we engage in moral judgment.

The idea that God is the very ground of being is itself a belief system. For that matter, would a just God condemn someone for not believing in God when that one was never given a chance to believe.

[Kingpoleon]

The idea that God is the very ground of being is itself a belief system. For that matter, would a just God condemn someone for not believing in God when that one was never given a chance to believe.

I think most non fundamentalist Christians would agree with Wesley on this point:

“It cannot be doubted, but this plea [lack of knowledge] will avail for millions of modern Heathens. Inasmuch as to them little is given, of them little will be required. As to the ancient Heathens, millions of them, likewise were savages. No more therefore will be expected of them, than the living up to the light they had. But many of them, especially in the civilized nations, we have great reason to hope, although they lived among Heathens, yet were quite of another spirit; being taught of God, by His inward voice, all the essentials of true religion. Yea, and so was that Mahometan, and Arabian, who, a century or two ago, wrote the Life of Hai Ebn Yokdan. The story seems to be feigned; but it contains all the principles of pure religion and undefiled.”

“Yet it is not our part to pass sentence upon them, but to leave them to their own Master.”

“Perhaps there may be some well-meaning persons who carry this farther still; who aver, that whatever change is wrought in men, whether in their hearts or lives, yet if they have not clear views of those capital doctrines, the fall of man, justification by faith, and of the atonement made by the death of Christ, and of his righteousness transferred to them, they can have no benefit from his death. I dare in no wise affirm this. Indeed I do not believe it. I believe the merciful God regards the lives and tempers of men more than their ideas. I believe he respects the goodness of the heart rather than the clearness of the head; and that if the heart of a man be filled (by the grace of God, and the power of his Spirit) with the humble, gentle, patient love of God and man, God will not cast him into everlasting fire prepared for the devil and his angels because his ideas are not clear, or because his conceptions are confused. Without holiness, I own, ‘no man shall see the Lord;’ but I dare not add, ‘or clear ideas.’”

The idea of a baptized heathen is a fairly traditional doctrine in Christendom, and it is, to my knowledge, predominantly Lutherans and Calvinists who are hostile to any notion of anonymous Christians.