Worst Political Leaders #2: Vladimir Putin vs. George W. Bush (user search)
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  Worst Political Leaders #2: Vladimir Putin vs. George W. Bush (search mode)
Pages: [1]
Poll
Question: Who is worse?
#1
George W. Bush
 
#2
Vladimir Putin
 
Show Pie Chart
Partisan results

Total Voters: 23

Author Topic: Worst Political Leaders #2: Vladimir Putin vs. George W. Bush  (Read 1136 times)
LAKISYLVANIA
Lakigigar
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*****
Posts: 15,165
Belgium


Political Matrix
E: -7.42, S: -4.78

P P P
« on: April 08, 2021, 03:45:38 AM »

This one is hard. Putin will obviously win this poll, but personally i don't think the difference is very big. As a person I think Bush is a better person, no question, although I also think Putin is a better person IRL than his policies suggest, but Putin is also very strategic, intelligent and smart, and outclasses Bush in that regard.

I'm not sure how we have to define worst political leader. If we measure it in terms of capability and things like that, Putin wins this, because Bush was not a good leader at all.

But if we measure it in terms of would you rather have Bush as president or Putin as prime minister of your country. Perhaps the answer is Bush. But what if turn the tides, and make Putin president of the USA and Bush president of Russia. Would the answer still be the same, and i'm not that sure anymore.

So i'll probably vote Bush, but i'm not voting yet, because i'm not sure what the definition of worst political leader is, since depending on the definition, Putin might be the worst after all, and also because I want to hear some other users out what they think about this match-up, which could change my opinion.

Not that it would matter in the end, because Putin is certainly going to have the "honour" to win this poll.

Part of my reasoning is also: "okay we have Putin", but are we sure that if someone else leads Russia, Russia is going to be a better country, and that relations wouldn't even be more hostile? I mean Zhirinovsky and Zyuganov are his two main opponents, and I don't think they're better than Putin in regards to international policy. Even Navalny isn't really an FF, given his attitude towards Georgia.
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LAKISYLVANIA
Lakigigar
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,165
Belgium


Political Matrix
E: -7.42, S: -4.78

P P P
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2021, 03:53:47 AM »

Bush did some war crimes (but perhaps it's a bit much too only blame him, and not only congress). IIRC people like Hillary Clinton just agreed with those war crimes, and they should have known better. Even the current president just voted in favour of it. Social democrats like Blair did the same thing.

Putin however also did some war crimes, although i have a hard time finding a worser offence than the Iraq disaster. But if you count all incidents, perhaps what Russia did or does is worse than Iraq alone (esp. Ukraine conflict comes close to Iraq), but these conflicts are geopolitical and Europe / Western world trying to usurp Ukraine into their sphere of influence might've provoked something that wouldn't have happened if we didn't do anything.

If i want to not vote for Bush because of his attitude towards LGBTQ people (as president, not now, but as president), i can't vote for Putin either, because he isn't better in that regard. However Russia's people have shown less support for LGBTQ rights than the USA where it could have been a bit easier to set the right example. It was far easier for someone like Bush to be a better leader, than it is for Putin obviously, because of the public opinion.

Bush also enabled the polarized environment in which someone like Trump could rise and that gave birth to the polarization we now see today (although Reagan also played a role in that).

The economical crisis of 2008 is not something i'm going to blame the Bush administration for all that much, since it happened at the end, and could have happened under a Democratic president, and was a result of year-long / decade-long economic policies, that were inevitably going to result in that (and it will happen again).
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