Concealed carry

[mileslunn]

Discuss.  I believe in No Issue but live in Canada where have never really had concealed carry or at least its always been next to impossible to get.  In US where now the norm even though many states banned it at one times, what do people think?

[dead0man]

By the numbers, CCW holders are the most lawful group of adult Americans.  The bloodbath the anti-gunners just knew was going to happen when millions of Americans started regularly carrying guns never happened.  Part of the reason they are such good, non-law breaking Americans is that "bad guys" have a real hard time getting a CCW.  If you limit sh**tty people from a group, it's going to be a better group than another that has sh**tty people in it.  Which is why I voted Shall Issue.

[Alcibiades]

By the numbers, CCW holders are the most lawful group of adult Americans.  The bloodbath the anti-gunners just knew was going to happen when millions of Americans started regularly carrying guns never happened.  Part of the reason they are such good, non-law breaking Americans is that "bad guys" have a real hard time getting a CCW.  If you limit sh**tty people from a group, it's going to be a better group than another that has sh**tty people in it.  Which is why I voted Shall Issue.

Then why not apply the same rigour to obtaining a license for any firearm?

[AGA]

Shall issue. I believe people should be able to defend themselves in public.

[Esteemed Jimmy]

Shall issue. I believe people should be able to defend themselves in public.

[Samof94]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

[fhtagn]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

Many hunters do, actually.

[SnowLabrador]

Honestly, this is an unpopular opinion: We need to ban private gun ownership and confiscate them from people who currently own them. Background checks won't stop mass shootings at this point, we still have too many guns. No civilian needs an AR-15, period.

[mileslunn]

Honestly, this is an unpopular opinion: We need to ban private gun ownership and confiscate them from people who currently own them. Background checks won't stop mass shootings at this point, we still have too many guns. No civilian needs an AR-15, period.

I largely share this view too although I live in Canada where there is no 2nd amendment so much easier to do (still get lots of pushback, but at least public is largely supportive and courts won't block it).  Gun lobby here will make a huge stink, but they will lose PR war however.

[Samof94]

Honestly, this is an unpopular opinion: We need to ban private gun ownership and confiscate them from people who currently own them. Background checks won't stop mass shootings at this point, we still have too many guns. No civilian needs an AR-15, period.

I largely share this view too although I live in Canada where there is no 2nd amendment so much easier to do (still get lots of pushback, but at least public is largely supportive and courts won't block it).  Gun lobby here will make a huge stink, but they will lose PR war however.

Good points.

[dead0man]

Honestly, this is an unpopular opinion: We need to ban private gun ownership and confiscate them from people who currently own them. Background checks won't stop mass shootings at this point, we still have too many guns. No civilian needs an AR-15, period.

it's not unpopular here, lots of ignorant Atlasians want cops and previously legal gun owners to shoot at each other.  Too bad for you and the others that that will never, ever happen.

[West_Midlander]

Permitless/constitutional carry, obviously.

[America Needs a 13-6 Progressive SCOTUS]

There is no good reason for owning a gun and so I voted no issue.

[S019]

Concealed carry is an awful idea and should be banned. Also anyone who thinks you actually need a gun for yourself is either ignorant, dumb, or bought by the NRA. There is no other reason why you can believe that you deserve to own something that literally only exists to kill people.

[fhtagn]

Concealed carry is an awful idea and should be banned. Also anyone who thinks you actually need a gun for yourself is either ignorant, dumb, or bought by the NRA. There is no other reason why you can believe that you deserve to own something that literally only exists to kill people.

The rising number of black gun owners makes this an awfully racist reply.

[Ferguson97]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

Many hunters do, actually.

Sounds like a pretty crappy hunter.

[fhtagn]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

Many hunters do, actually.

Sounds like a pretty crappy hunter.

Sounds like you know nothing about guns to make that assessment.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

Many hunters do, actually.

Sounds like a pretty crappy hunter.

Sounds like you know nothing about guns to make that assessment.

Facts.

[Crane]

By the numbers, CCW holders are the most lawful group of adult Americans.  The bloodbath the anti-gunners just knew was going to happen when millions of Americans started regularly carrying guns never happened.  Part of the reason they are such good, non-law breaking Americans is that "bad guys" have a real hard time getting a CCW.  If you limit sh**tty people from a group, it's going to be a better group than another that has sh**tty people in it.  Which is why I voted Shall Issue.

The problem with selling unlimited guns to large swathes of idiots like the kind of people who get concealed carry permits is that it often leads them to get their guns stolen (not to mention have accidents and an easier time killing themselves.) That's why "illegal guns" exist that gun fetishists claim will run rampant after any kind of gun restriction is passed.

People buying guns is why we have such high gun crime.

It's incredible how broken the discourse is on guns now. After World War II the American public agreed by a strong majority that most people should not have easy access to handguns. The NRA did an amazing job of convincing gullible Americans that millions of our dumbest citizens with Rambo delusions stocking up on their products was actually great for freedom and they somehow haven't connected it to the inevitable fallout of regular mass shootings and rates of violent gun crime the Syrians would be ashamed of. It was great for the profits of the industry the NRA represents, but incredibly destructive to the health of our society.

[Crane]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

Many hunters do, actually.

Sounds like a pretty crappy hunter.

Sounds like you know nothing about guns to make that assessment.

You simp for 17 year-old murderers. Don't pretend like your gun fetish is about hunting, you know exactly what it's for.

[fhtagn]

I am rather hard on guns and don’t see owning an Ar-15 as something regular people should have. Are you going to use it to kill deer?

Many hunters do, actually.

Sounds like a pretty crappy hunter.

Sounds like you know nothing about guns to make that assessment.

You simp for 17 year-old murderers. Don't pretend like your gun fetish is about hunting, you know exactly what it's for.

You know nothing, dude. Both about me and about guns.

[The Undefeatable Debbie Stabenow]

By the numbers, CCW holders are the most lawful group of adult Americans.  The bloodbath the anti-gunners just knew was going to happen when millions of Americans started regularly carrying guns never happened.  Part of the reason they are such good, non-law breaking Americans is that "bad guys" have a real hard time getting a CCW.  If you limit sh**tty people from a group, it's going to be a better group than another that has sh**tty people in it.  Which is why I voted Shall Issue.

The problem with selling unlimited guns to large swathes of idiots like the kind of people who get concealed carry permits is that it often leads them to get their guns stolen (not to mention have accidents and an easier time killing themselves.) That's why "illegal guns" exist that gun fetishists claim will run rampant after any kind of gun restriction is passed.

People buying guns is why we have such high gun crime.

It's incredible how broken the discourse is on guns now. After World War II the American public agreed by a strong majority that most people should not have easy access to handguns. The NRA did an amazing job of convincing gullible Americans that millions of our dumbest citizens with Rambo delusions stocking up on their products was actually great for freedom and they somehow haven't connected it to the inevitable fallout of regular mass shootings and rates of violent gun crime the Syrians would be ashamed of. It was great for the profits of the industry the NRA represents, but incredibly destructive to the health of our society.

This is spot-on. It's also criminally underdiscussed how the idea of an individual right to bear arms for the purpose of self-defense, derived from the Second Amendment, was not officially affirmed by SCOTUS until 2008, and only by a 5-4 majority. (And Justice Stevens would go on to say that this affirmation was "the most clearly incorrect decision that the Supreme Court announced during [his] tenure on the bench.") Yet, the vast majority of both citizens and politicians today accept an individual's right to own a handgun as an absolute truth, hence everyone's excessive focus on issues like the assault weapons ban (which aren't necessarily bad policies but do not remotely strike at the heart of the majority of gun violence in the United States).

[Chips]

Shall issue. I believe people should be able to defend themselves in public.

[Damocles]

I’m going to differ from the conventional response expected from folks with yellow avatars, and say may-issue permissive. I think may-issue permissive is a reasonable position to have for most topics regarding permit issuance for gun policy.

May-issue permissive means that the permit issuance authority retains the right to deny the applicant their permit if, in the opinion of the issuance authority, there is a preponderance of the evidence to suggest issuing a permit to this person would present a clear and dangerous threat to public safety.

But, if the issuance authority cannot meet the preponderance of the evidence standard to support denying the applicant, then they must grant the permit. In this case, it is permissive.

Issuing a permit for concealed carry constitutes a privilege conferred to certain people, above and beyond the normal rights guaranteed by constitutional law. Rather than simply having the right to use firearms, you are essentially asking for the privilege to bear these arms in a public context, while concealed - where others might or might not know you have that privilege.

Due to the awesome responsibility that carrying a firearm in public entails, you don’t want malcontents and blowhards having this privilege. You, as the issuing authority, have to balance the applicant’s desire to acquire a permit, with the ramifications this has on others, and how likely the applicant is to abuse this privilege.

You want to retain the ability to deny permit issuance in select cases, but you also want people to otherwise not face any sort of burden. That’s why may-issue permissive is probably the most reasonable position to hold on this issue.

[ElectionsGuy]

Honestly, this is an unpopular opinion: We need to ban private gun ownership and confiscate them from people who currently own them. Background checks won't stop mass shootings at this point, we still have too many guns. No civilian needs an AR-15, period.

You need a large police state, equipped with assault weapons like AR-15's, to take away other people's AR-15's. What a civilized way to solve the "problem" of gun ownership!

One thing that's hilarious is to ask leftists who favor both abolishing the police and confiscation of guns how that would work. I still haven't gotten a comprehensible answer.