Hillary covid

[Samof94]

2020 happens on schedule but Hillary Clinton is President. Let’s say a generic Republican is her opponent.
What changes???

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

First off, explain how she got to be President.  She likely does worse against any other Republican nominee than Trump, and might not have even had the consolation of winning the popular vote.

[Lechasseur]

First off, explain how she got to be President.  She likely does worse against any other Republican nominee than Trump, and might not have even had the consolation of winning the popular vote.

Nah, I've never boughten this narrative. That Republican field was AWFUL. There's a reason Trump won the nomination in the first place.

Hillary would have beaten anyone else who could have plausibly gotten the nomination. The other GOP candidates were just too out of touch with their base and the electorate at large.

Ironically, had Romney ran instead of Jeb and Rubio, I think he could have gotten the nomination and won. But it wasn't Jeb, Rubio, Walker or Cruz who were going to beat Hillary.

I think liberals like pushing this narrative that anyone would have done better than Trump just to point out that Trump was the "worst president ever", but the reality is I actually believe he was much more electable than most of that field. People were sick of Reaganomics and Tea Party politics, and that's all the others were proposing.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

First, I'm not exactly a liberal (except maybe in the European sense of the term). Without Trump, 2016 would certainly have been a lower energy election, with easily 10 million fewer voters overall.

I held my nose and voted Hillary in 2016, as Trump was clearly the worse of two weevils, but anecdotally, in a Hillary v. Generic Republican race I'd have probably voted third-party (make that certainly in a Hillary v. Jeb? race).

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

She obviously loses re-election. The Republicans might have 60+ Senate seats now.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

She obviously loses re-election. The Republicans might have 60+ Senate seats now.

OK Doomer.

Taking a look at the Senate races under a Hillary presidency doesn't get us to a 60+ Republican Senate right now, though it probably does get us to a Republican Senate.

I see the probable effects on 2018 as follows:
Arizona: Flake doesn't retire and holds the seat for the Republicans.
Florida: Nelson narrowly holds the seat for the Democrats.
Virginia: It's a narrower race than in OTL, but whoever was appointed to fill Kaine's seat still holds it for the Democrats.
West Virginia: Morrisey takes the seat from Manchin for the Republicans.
(Net Republican +1)

For 2020:
Arizona: Someone other than McSally is appointed to McCain's seat and holds it for the Republicans.
Georgia: Without the albatross of Trump around his neck, Perdue holds on and retains his seat for the Republicans, but Warnock still beats Loeffler.
Michigan: James takes the seat from Peters for the Republicans.
(Net Republican+3)

So something like 54 Republican Senators right now, but definitely not 60+ Republicans. Hillary's effect on downballot races would come primarily because there was a Democrat in the White House, not anything personally problematic about her.

For that matter, if she managed to win in 2016, she probably wins in 2020 despite COVID, as her administration would definitely have handled it much better than Trump's. I just don't see how she wins the general election in 2016 to set up this alternative timeline.

[Samof94]

She obviously loses re-election. The Republicans might have 60+ Senate seats now.

OK Doomer.

Taking a look at the Senate races under a Hillary presidency doesn't get us to a 60+ Republican Senate right now, though it probably does get us to a Republican Senate.

I see the probable effects on 2018 as follows:
Arizona: Flake doesn't retire and holds the seat for the Republicans.
Florida: Nelson narrowly holds the seat for the Democrats.
Virginia: It's a narrower race than in OTL, but whoever was appointed to fill Kaine's seat still holds it for the Democrats.
West Virginia: Morrisey takes the seat from Manchin for the Republicans.
(Net Republican +1)

For 2020:
Arizona: Someone other than McSally is appointed to McCain's seat and holds it for the Republicans.
Georgia: Without the albatross of Trump around his neck, Perdue holds on and retains his seat for the Republicans, but Warnock still beats Loeffler.
Michigan: James takes the seat from Peters for the Republicans.
(Net Republican+3)

So something like 54 Republican Senators right now, but definitely not 60+ Republicans. Hillary's effect on downballot races would come primarily because there was a Democrat in the White House, not anything personally problematic about her.

For that matter, if she managed to win in 2016, she probably wins in 2020 despite COVID, as her administration would definitely have handled it much better than Trump's. I just don't see how she wins the general election in 2016 to set up this alternative timeline.

Have the Stormy Daniels story break early.

[True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)]

I just don't see how she wins the general election in 2016 to set up this alternative timeline.

Have the Stormy Daniels story break early.

LOL

More like Teapot Tempest Daniels. Regardless of whether it should have hurt Trump politically, this incident didn't and there's no reason to think it ever would. Indeed, while it could not have happened before the election, any damage Trump may have suffered came from the cover up, not the actual event.

[Samof94]

I just don't see how she wins the general election in 2016 to set up this alternative timeline.

Have the Stormy Daniels story break early.

LOL

More like Teapot Tempest Daniels. Regardless of whether it should have hurt Trump politically, this incident didn't and there's no reason to think it ever would. Indeed, while it could not have happened before the election, any damage Trump may have suffered came from the cover up, not the actual event.

An inverted Comey letter.

[Oregon Eagle Politics]

She obviously loses re-election. The Republicans might have 60+ Senate seats now.

OK Doomer.

Taking a look at the Senate races under a Hillary presidency doesn't get us to a 60+ Republican Senate right now, though it probably does get us to a Republican Senate.

I see the probable effects on 2018 as follows:
Arizona: Flake doesn't retire and holds the seat for the Republicans.
Florida: Nelson narrowly holds the seat for the Democrats.
Virginia: It's a narrower race than in OTL, but whoever was appointed to fill Kaine's seat still holds it for the Democrats.
West Virginia: Morrisey takes the seat from Manchin for the Republicans.
(Net Republican +1)

For 2020:
Arizona: Someone other than McSally is appointed to McCain's seat and holds it for the Republicans.
Georgia: Without the albatross of Trump around his neck, Perdue holds on and retains his seat for the Republicans, but Warnock still beats Loeffler.
Michigan: James takes the seat from Peters for the Republicans.
(Net Republican+3)

So something like 54 Republican Senators right now, but definitely not 60+ Republicans. Hillary's effect on downballot races would come primarily because there was a Democrat in the White House, not anything personally problematic about her.

For that matter, if she managed to win in 2016, she probably wins in 2020 despite COVID, as her administration would definitely have handled it much better than Trump's. I just don't see how she wins the general election in 2016 to set up this alternative timeline.

HRC was very unpopular with the 40% approval ratings. It would have been a GOP wave along the lines of 2010/2014, not a 2018 like blue wave year.

https://www.270towin.com/2018-senate-election/MGnbkq

[Beet]

Let's say the Comey Letter doesn't happen or Charles Delavan identifies the Russian phishing attempt or Hillary visits Wisconsin or Anthony Weiner keeps it in his pants or something like that and she narrowly wins.

First of all she's the most polarizing, unpopular person ever elected. Her approval rating likely drops through the floor during 2017 to 35%-40%. After the election, the various investigations of Benghazi, the Clinton Foundation, and the FBI dominate headlines. The Republicans are totally enraged and energized beyond belief. Mitch McConnell absolutely flat out refuses to confirm Merrick Garland, and the stalemate lasts through 2018. By the 2018 elections they win all the Senate seats they normally win but get MT, AZ, NV, OH, WV, MI, PA, and WI as well for a total of 61 seats. They also pick up another two dozen House seats for 265. But most importantly, they win enough legislative seats to call a constitutional convention. This has been talked about for two years. In 2019 a new constitutional convention is called where various right-wing measures are added to the constitution, such as repealing birthright citizenship, a balanced budget amendment, banning gun control, and so on.

In 2020 Covid hits. Hillary handles it better than Trump, with only a total of 20,000 deaths instead of 200,000 by the election. However, given how much hay the Republicans made over just 4 deaths in Benghazi, the Republicans scream bloody murder over 20,000 deaths and say that Clinton directly murdered them in collaboration with the CPC. Her image is hung, and burned in effigy, and calls to have her killed are common in mass right-wing gatherings. The Republicans are even more uncooperative with masks and lockdowns than they are in the real TL, completely disobeying them and saying it's the end of the republic and the end of freedom. They find a lot of support among independents for this cause. Hillary can't go anywhere in the country without being booed and spat on, and she resorts to wearing a bulletproof vest after narrowly missing an assassination attempt.

Due to the balanced budget amendment, deficit spending is prohibited and the economy plunges into a tailspin, with GDP dropping 30% and failing to recover. 'Clintonvilles' of camps of homeless people sprout up all over the country. Donald Trump runs for president again, saying "If I had been president, not one person would have died. This is all her fault. You should have listened to me." By now Clinton's approval rating has dropped to 20%. By 2020, Trump defeats Clinton in the biggest landslide since 1984, with especially support among young people and Gen Z, for whom the failure of Clinton has been a defining event turning them against the Democrats, similar to Bush and Millennials. The Republicans win 65 Senate seats and 275 House seats. Ruth Bader Ginsburg dies. In 2021, Anthony Kennedy announces his retirement and Trump fills his seat as well as Ginsburg's and Scalia's seat.

[Samof94]

Let's say the Comey Letter doesn't happen or Charles Delavan identifies the Russian phishing attempt or Hillary visits Wisconsin or Anthony Weiner keeps it in his pants or something like that and she narrowly wins.

First of all she's the most polarizing, unpopular person ever elected. Her approval rating likely drops through the floor during 2017 to 35%-40%. After the election, the various investigations of Benghazi, the Clinton Foundation, and the FBI dominate headlines. The Republicans are totally enraged and energized beyond belief. Mitch McConnell absolutely flat out refuses to confirm Merrick Garland, and the stalemate lasts through 2018. By the 2018 elections they win all the Senate seats they normally win but get MT, AZ, NV, OH, WV, MI, PA, and WI as well for a total of 61 seats. They also pick up another two dozen House seats for 265. But most importantly, they win enough legislative seats to call a constitutional convention. This has been talked about for two years. In 2019 a new constitutional convention is called where various right-wing measures are added to the constitution, such as repealing birthright citizenship, a balanced budget amendment, banning gun control, and so on.

In 2020 Covid hits. Hillary handles it better than Trump, with only a total of 20,000 deaths instead of 200,000 by the election. However, given how much hay the Republicans made over just 4 deaths in Benghazi, the Republicans scream bloody murder over 20,000 deaths and say that Clinton directly murdered them in collaboration with the CPC. Her image is hung, and burned in effigy, and calls to have her killed are common in mass right-wing gatherings. The Republicans are even more uncooperative with masks and lockdowns than they are in the real TL, completely disobeying them and saying it's the end of the republic and the end of freedom. They find a lot of support among independents for this cause. Hillary can't go anywhere in the country without being booed and spat on, and she resorts to wearing a bulletproof vest after narrowly missing an assassination attempt.

Due to the balanced budget amendment, deficit spending is prohibited and the economy plunges into a tailspin, with GDP dropping 30% and failing to recover. 'Clintonvilles' of camps of homeless people sprout up all over the country. Donald Trump runs for president again, saying "If I had been president, not one person would have died. This is all her fault. You should have listened to me." By now Clinton's approval rating has dropped to 20%. By 2020, Trump defeats Clinton in the biggest landslide since 1984, with especially support among young people and Gen Z, for whom the failure of Clinton has been a defining event turning them against the Democrats, similar to Bush and Millennials. The Republicans win 65 Senate seats and 275 House seats. Ruth Bader Ginsburg dies. In 2021, Anthony Kennedy announces his retirement and Trump fills his seat as well as Ginsburg's and Scalia's seat.

That almost sounds worse than real life.