When will the U.S supreme court rule the death Penalty unconstitutional?
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
March 29, 2024, 02:27:43 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Discussion
  Constitution and Law (Moderator: World politics is up Schmitt creek)
  When will the U.S supreme court rule the death Penalty unconstitutional?
« previous next »
Pages: 1 [2]
Author Topic: When will the U.S supreme court rule the death Penalty unconstitutional?  (Read 2158 times)
True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
Moderators
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 42,157
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #25 on: February 13, 2021, 01:54:40 PM »

OK, no problem. We shall just agree to disagree on this one.

Agreed.  I realize that my belief that the judicial branch should be extremely deferential to the other two branches absent a clear Constitutional provision to the contrary is not commonly held. It also means there a quite a few Supreme Court decisions where I agree with the results, but not the means used to achieve them.
Logged
Torie
Moderators
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 46,057
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -3.48, S: -4.70

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #26 on: February 13, 2021, 01:58:32 PM »

Always a pleasure chatting with you. That is even true even when I lose the argument!
Logged
Spark
Spark498
Atlas Politician
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,708
United States


Political Matrix
E: -6.58, S: 0.00


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #27 on: February 13, 2021, 03:37:15 PM »
« Edited: February 13, 2021, 03:53:25 PM by Southern Senator Spark »

Hopefully very soon - it's wasteful, inhumane violation of the 8th amendment, and expensive. We need an immediate federal moratorium and eventual abolition.

I've written about this before, but the Supreme Court's misapplication of the Eighth Amendment prohibition on "cruel and unusual punishment" is the clearest example of judicial overreach that is currently going on. (Only the Lochner era treatment of the Fourteenth Amendment is comparably bad.) The prohibition was intended as a limit on the judicial and the executive branches, not the legislative branch. In my opinion, the only valid reason for the court to strike down a punishment under the eighth would be if the prosecution had sought and obtained a punishment that was on the books, but hadn't been used in a long while. That still leaves Fifth and Fourteenth Amendment reasons to strike down particular cases or implementations of capital punishment.

As it pertains to the 8th Amendment, states should take the lead on banning capital punishment to outlaw it legislatively. I think inherently that the death penalty deprives a person of a second chance and life itself. Other countries grant the death penalty for offenses that do not warrant that punishment, we should be above the fray on this subject and instate an immediate moratorium on the federal death penalty. The practice itself is inhumane and I agree that other provisions can be used. The death penalty is also wasteful, expensive, and ineffective at serving as a deterrent to prevent crimes.

What do you think about the case People v. Anderson in California?
Logged
True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
Moderators
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 42,157
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #28 on: February 13, 2021, 07:45:33 PM »

What do you think about the case People v. Anderson in California?

I think Justice Mosk's concurrence in People v. Frierson (1979) 25 C3d 14, which was heard after Proposition 17 had amended the California Constitution to overturn People v. Anderson is on point, albeit he does make himself abundantly clear that on this issue, his view is: "the people have spoken; damn them!"

Quote
The people of California responded quickly and emphatically, both directly and through their elected representatives, to callously declare that whatever the trends elsewhere in the nation and the world, society in our state does not deem the retributive extinction of a human life to be either cruel or unusual.

"Cruelty" is not definable with precision. It is in the eye of the beholder: what may be perceived as cruelty by one person is seen as justice by another. Thus, this court, in ascertaining the permissible limits of punishment, must look in the first instance to those values to which the people of our state subscribe. That as one individual I prefer values more lofty than those implicit in the macabre process of deliberately exterminating a human being does not permit me to interpret in my image the common values of the people of our state.
Logged
Spark
Spark498
Atlas Politician
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,708
United States


Political Matrix
E: -6.58, S: 0.00


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #29 on: February 13, 2021, 08:34:57 PM »

What do you think about the case People v. Anderson in California?

I think Justice Mosk's concurrence in People v. Frierson (1979) 25 C3d 14, which was heard after Proposition 17 had amended the California Constitution to overturn People v. Anderson is on point, albeit he does make himself abundantly clear that on this issue, his view is: "the people have spoken; damn them!"

Quote
The people of California responded quickly and emphatically, both directly and through their elected representatives, to callously declare that whatever the trends elsewhere in the nation and the world, society in our state does not deem the retributive extinction of a human life to be either cruel or unusual.

"Cruelty" is not definable with precision. It is in the eye of the beholder: what may be perceived as cruelty by one person is seen as justice by another. Thus, this court, in ascertaining the permissible limits of punishment, must look in the first instance to those values to which the people of our state subscribe. That as one individual I prefer values more lofty than those implicit in the macabre process of deliberately exterminating a human being does not permit me to interpret in my image the common values of the people of our state.

That is absolutely fair. It should be up to the people of the states to decide, I totally agree. It is only my personal view that capital punishment is an inadvisable course of action.
Logged
Coolface Sock #42069
whitesox130
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,695
United States


Political Matrix
E: 4.39, S: 2.26

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #30 on: March 05, 2021, 08:13:57 PM »

Never, but it will be abolished state-by-state statutorily.
Logged
Cokeland Saxton
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 2,601
United States


Political Matrix
E: -0.26, S: -6.26

P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #31 on: March 06, 2021, 02:54:37 AM »

Not while the conservative wing makes up the majority
Logged
Pages: 1 [2]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.036 seconds with 11 queries.