COVID-19 Megathread 6: Return of the Omicron

[Bandit3 the Worker]

In the controlled environment of schools, masks do work. In the real world where mask mandates have exceptions for food/drink establishments and private gatherings, most spread happens there and it looks like the mask mandate is not effective.

So it works in military dictatorships, not in liberal democracies.

[Tintrlvr]

This bet is open to anyone who wants to take it. If you all really believe that COVID is not a threat, that the pandemic is over, and we should return to 2019, then surely COVID won't be sending people to the hospital at this level again, right?

The huge problem with your scenario is that a very large portion of reported hospitalizations are not COVID sending people to the hospital but rather people showing up to the hospital with some other issue and testing positive for COVID, often asymptomatic or with only very mild symptoms.

Being "not a threat" means that, if you are vaccinated, you are at roughly flu or lower risk of death. That's it. Lots of idiotic unvaccinated people may still die, but we're not trying to protect them with public policy at this point. And, realistically, a small number of vaccinated people will also still die, but people die from infectious diseases all the time, and we accept a certain low level of death from infectious disease annually without taking socially massive efforts to prevent it.

[compucomp]

This bet is open to anyone who wants to take it. If you all really believe that COVID is not a threat, that the pandemic is over, and we should return to 2019, then surely COVID won't be sending people to the hospital at this level again, right?

The huge problem with your scenario is that a very large portion of reported hospitalizations are not COVID sending people to the hospital but rather people showing up to the hospital with some other issue and testing positive for COVID, often asymptomatic or with only very mild symptoms.

Being "not a threat" means that, if you are vaccinated, you are at roughly flu or lower risk of death. That's it. Lots of idiotic unvaccinated people may still die, but we're not trying to protect them with public policy at this point. And, realistically, a small number of vaccinated people will also still die, but people die from infectious diseases all the time, and we accept a certain low level of death from infectious disease annually without taking socially massive efforts to prevent it.

The first paragraph is wild speculation driven from a lack of information, and the pieces of information we do have contradict it. In one CDC report published last week, a California hospital found that 80 percent of its patients came into the facility for Covid-19 and 20 percent were admitted “primarily for non–COVID-19 conditions.” NY state did an accounting one day in January and found that about half of its COVID hospitalizations were caused by COVID and the rest were "with COVID". This is not the "very large number" you are looking for.

If hospitals are full of COVID patients, the quality of medical services degrades for everyone. Ambulances sit at hospitals for hours waiting for space and non-emergency care is delayed. Also this will drive up the medical costs for everyone in the medium and long term. This is still a threat that should be taken seriously, particularly since we all know that  later booster uptake will be far short of the uptake for initial vaccine.

[Tintrlvr]

This bet is open to anyone who wants to take it. If you all really believe that COVID is not a threat, that the pandemic is over, and we should return to 2019, then surely COVID won't be sending people to the hospital at this level again, right?

The huge problem with your scenario is that a very large portion of reported hospitalizations are not COVID sending people to the hospital but rather people showing up to the hospital with some other issue and testing positive for COVID, often asymptomatic or with only very mild symptoms.

Being "not a threat" means that, if you are vaccinated, you are at roughly flu or lower risk of death. That's it. Lots of idiotic unvaccinated people may still die, but we're not trying to protect them with public policy at this point. And, realistically, a small number of vaccinated people will also still die, but people die from infectious diseases all the time, and we accept a certain low level of death from infectious disease annually without taking socially massive efforts to prevent it.

The first paragraph is wild speculation driven from a lack of information, and the pieces of information we do have contradict it. In one CDC report published last week, a California hospital found that 80 percent of its patients came into the facility for Covid-19 and 20 percent were admitted “primarily for non–COVID-19 conditions.” NY state did an accounting one day in January and found that about half of its COVID hospitalizations were caused by COVID and the rest were "with COVID". This is not the "very large number" you are looking for.

If hospitals are full of COVID patients, the quality of medical services degrades for everyone. Ambulances sit at hospitals for hours waiting for space and non-emergency care is delayed. Also this will drive up the medical costs for everyone in the medium and long term. This is still a threat that should be taken seriously, particularly since we all know that  later booster uptake will be far short of the uptake for initial vaccine.

Half are "with COVID" is definitely a "very large" portion to me.

[Calthrina950]

There may be some hope yet, as Walmart is dropping its mask mandate for vaccinated employees. Amazon has also discarded the mask mandate for such employees. We may hopefully start to see other "big box" and national employers do the same. I fervently pray that once they are dropped, they don't come back.

[compucomp]

There may be some hope yet, as Walmart is dropping its mask mandate for vaccinated employees. Amazon has also discarded the mask mandate for such employees. We may hopefully start to see other "big box" and national employers do the same. I fervently pray that once they are dropped, they don't come back.

As I predicted, the mask mandate for retail employees was not tied to the CDC but instead to  the assessment of corporate weighing the threat level of COVID and the risk of lawsuits against the pressure to retain employees. So it would be natural for the mask mandates to come and go as the threat level of COVID goes up and down.

[Calthrina950]

There may be some hope yet, as Walmart is dropping its mask mandate for vaccinated employees. Amazon has also discarded the mask mandate for such employees. We may hopefully start to see other "big box" and national employers do the same. I fervently pray that once they are dropped, they don't come back.

As I predicted, the mask mandate for retail employees was not tied to the CDC but instead to  the assessment of corporate weighing the threat level of COVID and the risk of lawsuits against the pressure to retain employees. So it would be natural for the mask mandates to come and go as the threat level of COVID goes up and down.

As I've said before, I don't want for this to be the situation. It's not fair for the employees to be required to mask up when customers aren't required to do so and most of them don't, and it's not fair to force employees into a "revolving door" of restrictions. We must accept that this virus is endemic and we cannot spend the next seventy years revolving our lives around it.

[emailking]

Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

There's nothing wrong with their story. You don't have to agree with the people they're writing about. There have been plenty of stories about the other side. That comparison is absurd.

[compucomp]

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1492290872096043026
Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

Wait, so conservatives are in favor of a Fairness Doctrine now? When it would ruin Fox News, right wing talk radio, OANN, Alex Jones, etc?

[Zohranism is OUR future]

If Oakvale had his way, anyone who posts anything even remotely pro-mask would be imprisoned for life.

[Kamala-Tim 2024]

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1492290872096043026

Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

One of my best friends literally has cancer, takes chemo every two weeks and has a multitude of other issues that weaken his immune system too. But he understands that masks were a temporary measure and doesn't throw a tantrum when he sees maskless people at the store like the hypochondriac white chick or neurotic COVID mom in that piece probably do.

It’s hard to agree with you when you call immunocompromised people “hypochondriac white chicks”.

[Zohranism is OUR future]

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1492290872096043026

Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

One of my best friends literally has cancer, takes chemo every two weeks and has a multitude of other issues that weaken his immune system too. But he understands that masks were a temporary measure and doesn't throw a tantrum when he sees maskless people at the store like the hypochondriac white chick or neurotic COVID mom in that piece probably do.

It’s hard to agree with you when you call immunocompromised people “hypochondriac white chicks”.

Honestly this just shows Atlas’s underlying sexism. Everything you don’t like is because of the “white chicks” or the “suburban soccer moms” or the “Squad”. Heck, most Atlas Democrats seem to support outright insurrectionists over them. I’m definitely going to be told “oh nooo I like xxx and she’s female” but that’s literally just the “I have black friends” excuse.

[Kamala-Tim 2024]

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1492290872096043026

Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

One of my best friends literally has cancer, takes chemo every two weeks and has a multitude of other issues that weaken his immune system too. But he understands that masks were a temporary measure and doesn't throw a tantrum when he sees maskless people at the store like the hypochondriac white chick or neurotic COVID mom in that piece probably do.

It’s hard to agree with you when you call immunocompromised people “hypochondriac white chicks”.

Honestly this just shows Atlas’s underlying sexism. Everything you don’t like is because of the “white chicks” or the “suburban soccer moms” or the “Squad”. Heck, most Atlas Democrats seem to support outright insurrectionists over them. I’m definitely going to be told “oh nooo I like xxx and she’s female” but that’s literally just the “I have black friends” excuse.

I’d be far from the first to point out that a lot of people online will say sexist things about “white women” and use their (the women’s) whiteness as a shield.

[Zohranism is OUR future]

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1492290872096043026

Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

One of my best friends literally has cancer, takes chemo every two weeks and has a multitude of other issues that weaken his immune system too. But he understands that masks were a temporary measure and doesn't throw a tantrum when he sees maskless people at the store like the hypochondriac white chick or neurotic COVID mom in that piece probably do.

It’s hard to agree with you when you call immunocompromised people “hypochondriac white chicks”.

Honestly this just shows Atlas’s underlying sexism. Everything you don’t like is because of the “white chicks” or the “suburban soccer moms” or the “Squad”. Heck, most Atlas Democrats seem to support outright insurrectionists over them. I’m definitely going to be told “oh nooo I like xxx and she’s female” but that’s literally just the “I have black friends” excuse.

I’d be far from the first to point out that a lot of people online will say sexist things about “white women” and use their (the women’s) whiteness as a shield.

Oh I know, I’m not accusing you, you’re probably one of the most aware people on here anyways.

[Frodo]

Now that Omicron and Delta are in the rear-view mirror, Americans are starting to regain their sense of optimism that the worst of the COVID pandemic is behind us, and that now we can see the end is in sight:

Americans' views of pandemic, economy tick up: poll

[GregTheGreat657]

There may be some hope yet, as Walmart is dropping its mask mandate for vaccinated employees. Amazon has also discarded the mask mandate for such employees. We may hopefully start to see other "big box" and national employers do the same. I fervently pray that once they are dropped, they don't come back.

I visited my local Walmart today, and while most of the employees still chose to wear masks, only about 1/4 of the shoppers chose to wear masks. It seems like Walmart is moving into "endemic mode" as they have even removed the "masks recommended" sign

[Pericles]

I wouldn't know if this is accurate, but I know for some people the area covered by the mask is less attractive than the rest of their face.

I shouldn't be forced to wear a mask just because of other people's insecurities.

If you think that's what I said, you're an idiot.

[Kamala-Tim 2024]

https://twitter.com/NBCNews/status/1492290872096043026

Was astonished to run across this today. A news organisation literally just posting a moralising, pro-restrictions Twitter thread without any pretence of balance. Enemies of the people indeed.

One of my best friends literally has cancer, takes chemo every two weeks and has a multitude of other issues that weaken his immune system too. But he understands that masks were a temporary measure and doesn't throw a tantrum when he sees maskless people at the store like the hypochondriac white chick or neurotic COVID mom in that piece probably do.

It’s hard to agree with you when you call immunocompromised people “hypochondriac white chicks”.

Honestly this just shows Atlas’s underlying sexism. Everything you don’t like is because of the “white chicks” or the “suburban soccer moms” or the “Squad”. Heck, most Atlas Democrats seem to support outright insurrectionists over them. I’m definitely going to be told “oh nooo I like xxx and she’s female” but that’s literally just the “I have black friends” excuse.

I’d be far from the first to point out that a lot of people online will say sexist things about “white women” and use their (the women’s) whiteness as a shield.

Oh I know, I’m not accusing you, you’re probably one of the most aware people on here anyways.

Oh, I know, I was just trying to not take unearned credit.

[Frodo]

New Covid Data Show New York Returning to Pre-Omicron Surge Levels

[Bandit3 the Worker]

It looks like the Super Bowl might be the final nail in the coffin of mask mania.

[compucomp]

It looks like the Super Bowl might be the final nail in the coffin of mask mania.

Way to make a total non sequitur and take a random cheap shot for no reason.

Edit: You deserved to see your Bengals lose.

[Donerail]

It looks like the Super Bowl might be the final nail in the coffin of mask mania.

Way to make a total non sequitur and take a random cheap shot for no reason.

Los Angeles is, in theory, under a mask mandate. The local mask ordinance requires masks at all gatherings of this size. Every fan was provided with a KN95.



And no one complied. We're done, it's over. America is BACK.

[compucomp]

It looks like the Super Bowl might be the final nail in the coffin of mask mania.

Way to make a total non sequitur and take a random cheap shot for no reason.

Los Angeles is, in theory, under a mask mandate. The local mask ordinance requires masks at all gatherings of this size. Every fan was provided with a KN95.



And no one complied. We're done, it's over. America is BACK.

What a piece of work you are, celebrating a picture of utter moral degeneracy. But I'll tell you something, the mandates might be going away for now, but it's not over. We will never surrender to the likes of you. We will continue to wear masks as long as COVID remains a threat, which it does. We form a substantial portion of the population and you will see us in public. It triggers you to see masking in public? Well that's just too damn bad, you'll just have to deal with it.

Oh by the way, the pandemic is far from over and COVID will come back in force. Mask mandates will come back. My bet remains open to any takers.

You seem quite confident in this. If you really think that people who continue to take COVID seriously are insane, then put your money where your mouth is. At this moment, the 7 day average of COVID hospitalizations as tracked by the CDC is 91,650. I make you a bet. If this number ever reaches 100,000 before Jan. 1, 2023, then you leave the forum for a year. If it doesn't, then I leave the forum for a year. Deal or no deal?

Fine Print: If any state or the CDC stops reporting COVID cases or hospitalizations, then the bet is cancelled. If the standard for COVID hospitalization, which is presently "Counts of new admissions and hospitalized patients with confirmed COVID-19", changes the bet is cancelled. The page says "based on reporting from all hospitals (N = 5266)", if this number drops below 5000, the bet is cancelled.

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#hospitalizations

[Trump Is A Maoist]

It looks like the Super Bowl might be the final nail in the coffin of mask mania.

Way to make a total non sequitur and take a random cheap shot for no reason.

Los Angeles is, in theory, under a mask mandate. The local mask ordinance requires masks at all gatherings of this size. Every fan was provided with a KN95.



And no one complied. We're done, it's over. America is BACK.

Wow. THIS is one of the biggest problems in our society these days... fake libertarianism. People that don't understand or care what freedom / libertarianism means. The football stadium is not a public space, it's private property. The stadium has obligations involving municipal / state / federal laws. In theory (but maybe not in practice) they are liable legally for a stadium full of maskless customers. My parents always taught me that you follow the rules of the house when you visit somewhere. It's their freedom to set their own rules, outside of those they are legally required to set. The stadium has the right to remove people that won't wear a mask... can you imagine the temper tantrums if that had actually happened? People going into the stadium, igmoring the rules, getting kicked out and then melting down. This is childish behaviour and yet millions of North Americans think and act this way. It's pathetic.

[Calthrina950]

As I've said many times before, no one is saying that you can't wear masks in public, or that you should be forbidden from doing so. But it seems that the majority of Americans are done with masking at this point. Where I live, the numbers of maskless have been increasing again over the past weeks. The breakdown is probably close to 70% maskless, 30% masked at this point. It's obvious that there's going to be a substantial contingent of people continuing to mask up, possibly for several months or years more, but it should not be mandated at this point. Those who favor perpetual mask mandates seem to have forgotten that mask mandates did not become widespread when the Spanish Flu ended. We went nearly a century without them.