Will Gorsuch or Kavanaugh want to keep gay marriage around?

[GeneralMacArthur]

Amy Coney Barrett, Trump's likely nominee, signed a letter in 2015 declaring that marriage should be between a man and a woman.

Roberts, Thomas, and Alito were all dissenting opinions in Obergefell v. Hodges.

So that's 4 guaranteed NO votes on LGBT rights.  The only unknowns are Gorsuch and Kavanaugh.

So what do we think.  Do gay people get to stay married?  Because as soon as ACB is on the court, you know the Christian right will have a court case ready to escalate whose implications would be nullifying Obergefell v. Hodges.

[Damocles]

Say what you will about Gorsuch, but he did author and deliver a majority opinion which ruled that discrimination based on sexual orientation is illegal under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act 1965, since this is a logical extension of sex. There is precedent for it.

[Migrant Crime]

Yeah, everyone understands that gay marriage is settled.  Nice try though.

[GeneralMacArthur]

Yeah, everyone understands that gay marriage is settled.  Nice try though.

Roe v Wade is also settled law.  It was a 7-2 decision.

[Migrant Crime]

Yeah, everyone understands that gay marriage is settled.  Nice try though.

Roe v Wade is also settled law.  It was a 7-2 decision.

I don't see mass murder and allowing gays to marry as being on the same level.

[Badger]

Yeah, everyone understands that gay marriage is settled.  Nice try though.

Roe v Wade is also settled law.  It was a 7-2 decision.

I don't see mass murder and allowing gays to marry as being on the same level.

"Power justifies everything, and Democracy is undermining our power."

[Don't blame me I voted for Harris]

Yeah, everyone understands that gay marriage is settled.  Nice try though.

Roe v Wade is also settled law.  It was a 7-2 decision.

I don't see mass murder and allowing gays to marry as being on the same level.

LOL "mass murder".

[Fuzzy Bear]

While I consider the Obergefell decision to be a case of pure Judicial Activism, I also believe it to be a fait acompli.  The confusion that would occur by what now must be MILLIONS of married couples becoming unmarried would be daunting.

Actually, I don't thing that the SCOTUS could "unmarry" married people; they could only empower states to do so, and I'm not sure that any state would do so.  State pols are more aware of the bureaucratic nightmare such a move would create, no matter what their rhetoric may be.

I should also say that while I pray for the overturning of Roe, I am not convinced that this will happen even if, say, Mary Coney Barrett were appointed to the Court.  At his confirmation hearings, Samuel Alito stated that Roe was "a precedent worthy of respect".  Stare Decisis is a powerful principle amongst Justices.  As much as I loathe Roe, it is, by SCOTUS standards, well-established law at this point.

[Free Speech Enjoyer]

I should also say that while I pray for the overturning of Roe, I am not convinced that this will happen even if, say, Mary Coney Barrett were appointed to the Court.  At his confirmation hearings, Samuel Alito stated that Roe was "a precedent worthy of respect".  Stare Decisis is a powerful principle amongst Justices.  As much as I loathe Roe, it is, by SCOTUS standards, well-established law at this point.

Alito has consistently voted for upholding abortion restrictions and Kavanaugh called Roe "precedent on precedent" and still voted to uphold Louisiana's clinic law. Statements made during hearings mean nothing.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I should also say that while I pray for the overturning of Roe, I am not convinced that this will happen even if, say, Mary Coney Barrett were appointed to the Court.  At his confirmation hearings, Samuel Alito stated that Roe was "a precedent worthy of respect".  Stare Decisis is a powerful principle amongst Justices.  As much as I loathe Roe, it is, by SCOTUS standards, well-established law at this point.

Alito has consistently voted for upholding abortion restrictions and Kavanaugh called Roe "precedent on precedent" and still voted to uphold Louisiana's clinic law. Statements made during hearings mean nothing.

There's a Grand Canyon's worth of difference between that Louisiana law and Roe.

Roe never granted an unfettered right to abortion; it was a 7-2 decision with only 5 justices signing off on the core reasoning.  It was Judicial Activism that, nonetheless, left many abortion restrictions intact as far as state power went.

[GeneralMacArthur]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

John Roberts is the only normal conservative justice on the bench.  None of the other Republicans is going to suddenly become the next John Roberts just because they have unlimited power now.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts.  They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

[lfromnj]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts. They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles. You can hate his judicial principles but atleast say that rather than attacking his character.

[Kyle Rittenhouse is a Political Prisoner]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts.  They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles.

Obergefell is here to stay. Deciding it through the courts was a bad idea, but overturning it now would be absurd.
Roe is plainly wrong on the constitutional merits and likely falls. There is no constitutional right to an abortion, and liberals who wish to change that should do so through the ballot box instead of the courts.

[Beet]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts.  They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles.

Obergefell is here to stay. Deciding it through the courts was a bad idea, but overturning it now would be absurd.
Roe is plainly wrong on the constitutional merits and likely falls. There is no constitutional right to an abortion, and liberals who wish to change that should do so through the ballot box instead of the courts.

Roe. Wrong is a straightforward application of Griswold and must stand no matter what. It has even higher support than abortion rights in general. Women have a constitutional right to their own bodies, otherwise freedom in this country means nothing.

[tmthforu94]

Yes, the issue will never be taken up again.

[Kyle Rittenhouse is a Political Prisoner]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts.  They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles.

Obergefell is here to stay. Deciding it through the courts was a bad idea, but overturning it now would be absurd.
Roe is plainly wrong on the constitutional merits and likely falls. There is no constitutional right to an abortion, and liberals who wish to change that should do so through the ballot box instead of the courts.

Roe. Wrong is a straightforward application of Griswold and must stand no matter what. It has even higher support than abortion rights in general. Women have a constitutional right to their own bodies, otherwise freedom in this country means nothing.

Griswold was also absurd. The rights contained in the constitution are clear. Privacy is not one of them. The extension of a right to privacy to a right to infanticide moved from the absurd to the plainly immoral.

[Horus]

ssm isn't going anywhere. It is no longer controversial like abortion.

[Figueira]

The gay marriage culture war didn't help Republicans at all, so unless all five of them are hellbent on owning the gays at the expense of everything else, it's here to stay.

[OSR stands with Israel]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

John Roberts is the only normal conservative justice on the bench.  None of the other Republicans is going to suddenly become the next John Roberts just because they have unlimited power now.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts.  They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

Lma right wing justices are far less hacks then left wing justices because of the fact they are strict constructionist and cant justify any ruling based on "living breathing" .


Gorsuch is an excellent justice and saying otherwise is being a hack

[GeneralMacArthur]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts. They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles. You can hate his judicial principles but atleast say that rather than attacking his character.

Well I certainly hope you're right because Neil Gorsuch just became the most powerful man in the country.

[lfromnj]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts. They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles. You can hate his judicial principles but atleast say that rather than attacking his character.

Well I certainly hope you're right because Neil Gorsuch just became the most powerful man in the country.

Im not saying he will uphold Hodges, Im just saying your attack on him was wrong and unfair to him, its perfectly fine to attack his ideology but he does actually have principles with it. For example criticize Alito if you want to.

[Alcibiades]

Same-sex marriage enjoys 60% support (only 30% opposed) nationwide. AL and MS are the only states where more oppose it than support it. This doesn’t preclude some extreme right-wing justices from overturning Obergefell (though personally I think Roberts and Gorsuch wouldn’t), but it would be incredibly foolish for the GOP to want them to do it, from an electoral standpoint. Never mind that most Americans support SSM anyway, tearing up thousands of loving marriages for no good reason would make the optics even worse.

[Beet]

You guys all need to stop being so naive.

Kavanaugh, Thomas, Alito, Gorsuch, and Amy Comey Barrett are all extreme right-wingers.  They hang out with Republicans and brag about how they're getting the conservative agenda enacted through the courts. They don't have principles.  They are ideologues who are dedicated to legislating from the bench.

If you think they're going to respect settled law on major conservative priorities like abortion or gay marriage, you're so f--king wrong.  I don't know how you can think that when you've seen how dedicated the conservative movement has been to achieving this goal.  I don't know how you can think, after everything the conservatives have done over the last decade, that now in their moment of triumph is when they're going to discover some sense of fairness or honor or principle or respect for the constitution.

They're going to dismantle Roe v Wade.  They're going to dismantle Obamacare.  They're going to dismantle Obergefell v. Hodges.  And then they're going to spend the next 15-20 years essentially ruling the country as a 6-man dictatorship.

lol, you seriously want to tell me Gorsuch has no principles? He probably hated the idea of giving transgender/gay anti discrimination law through a loophole, but he decided to do it in the end because it fit with his judicial principles.

Obergefell is here to stay. Deciding it through the courts was a bad idea, but overturning it now would be absurd.
Roe is plainly wrong on the constitutional merits and likely falls. There is no constitutional right to an abortion, and liberals who wish to change that should do so through the ballot box instead of the courts.

Roe. Wrong is a straightforward application of Griswold and must stand no matter what. It has even higher support than abortion rights in general. Women have a constitutional right to their own bodies, otherwise freedom in this country means nothing.

Griswold was also absurd. The rights contained in the constitution are clear. Privacy is not one of them. The extension of a right to privacy to a right to infanticide moved from the absurd to the plainly immoral.

Griswold establishes women's right to bodily autonomy. This is essential for our nation's recognition of women's rights, since the Equal Rights Amendment didn't pass and we also haven't gotten a woman President. If you want to deny abortion rights by limiting Roe then go ahead and enforce your morality by reducing its scope, but it is a symbolically important enough case that it should not simply be overturned.

I'll add that support for Roe is extremely high at 71% (only 23% opposed) nationwide.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Roberts will probably rule for gay marriage on a new case.

[You are responsible]

Ruling against gay marriage NOW would just stir up way too much sh**t. What's done is done.

So I find it likely that the "conservative" justices would simply draw straws who is gonna be the suckers to rule for upholding it, if Roberts and Gorsuch wouldn't already volunteer on their own.