This Once Great Movement Of Ours

[Blair]

This is very strange- I’ve not seen any Labour MPs refer to health measures as a dictatorship.

https://twitter.com/EmmaLewellBuck/status/1471414716912254983?s=20

[CumbrianLefty]

Though the underlying sentiment - "we must learn to live with Covid" - is more widely shared.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Lewell-Buck's chaotic energy is underrated.

[Blair]

Lewell-Buck's chaotic energy is underrated.

She was on the deselection express at one stage!

It was a strange mix who seemed to join it in 2019!

[Blair]

Someone should write a book about the 2017 intake...

https://twitter.com/Thelma_DWalker/status/1472464530580152324?ref_src=twsrc%5Ego...

[Filuwaúrdjan]

The context is that Piers Corbyn has just been arrested for... wait a minute... ah yes... calling for people to physically assault Members of Parliament because vaccinations are a (((conspiracy))).

[Continential]

Someone should write a book about the 2017 intake...

https://twitter.com/Thelma_DWalker/status/1472464530580152324?ref_src=twsrc%5Ego...

Remember when Corbynite twitter thought that the NIP could do well and she ended up only two votes ahead of a nonce.

[CumbrianLefty]

Walker was regarded as one of the more "normal" within the 2017 intake, believe it or not.

[Blair]

https://labourlist.org/2021/12/sharon-graham-commissions-qc-led-inquiry-into-hotel-and-conference-centre/

I have no experience in construction but I do struggle to understand how something can be projected to cost £7 million, but end up costing £98 million. These are numbers only the MOD could be proud of!

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

https://twitter.com/AaronBastani/status/1466033275462467584?s=19
Why did this person have a media role ?

[Filuwaúrdjan]

https://labourlist.org/2021/12/sharon-graham-commissions-qc-led-inquiry-into-hotel-and-conference-centre/

I have no experience in construction but I do struggle to understand how something can be projected to cost £7 million, but end up costing £98 million. These are numbers only the MOD could be proud of!

Well there is one way...

[EastAnglianLefty]

https://twitter.com/AaronBastani/status/1466033275462467584?s=19
Why did this person have a media role ?

To be fair, I don't think he's ever been employed by Labour, unless working for the David Miliband leadership campaign counts.

At this point I think he's mostly kept around to make the rest of Novara look better by comparison.

[Blair]

He was a CLP secretary but quit that position.

[CumbrianLefty]

And his partner is now (I think) a Labour councillor in Portsmouth.

[Blair]

He didn’t happen to mention that the largest number come from Iran.

https://mobile.twitter.com/PressTV/status/1473211328986767366

[cp]

He didn’t happen to mention that the largest number come from Iran.

https://mobile.twitter.com/PressTV/status/1473211328986767366

Your point being?

I must say, it was refreshing to hear a Labour politician speak so unambiguously in defense of the rights of migrants. Shame we don't have a leader like that.

[CumbrianLefty]

He didn’t happen to mention that the largest number come from Iran.

https://mobile.twitter.com/PressTV/status/1473211328986767366

Given who he was talking to, is that a surprise?

[Blair]

An interesting amount of blowback to the below- I was surprised by the reaction from parts of the left who seemed surprised. Especially as I don't think it's the first time he's said it?

I guess it's just a sign of how well Lammy reinvented himself post 2015 (largely through Brexit & windrush) but he was & has always been a politician of the right to me! He refused to serve in Ed M's cabinet & was part of the right (but never part of the clique)

I wonder if its because of his tone towards Corbyn*

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/dec/28/david-lammy-apologises-for-nominating-corbyn-to-be-labour-leader

*An interesting development in the Corbyn & post Corbyn era is that people still confuse or assume that the left/right spectrum in the party relates to how open you were in your corbynsceptism. Wes Streeting was one of the most devout anti-Corbyn MPs but he isn't the most right wing member of the PLP while equally some MPs like Johnny Reynolds are members of the Labour right but wouldn't be necessarily be identified as such based on serving under JC.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

An interesting amount of blowback to the below- I was surprised by the reaction from parts of the left who seemed surprised. Especially as I don't think it's the first time he's said it?

He said it more or less immediately after Corbyn won!

I guess it's just a sign of how well Lammy reinvented himself post 2015 (largely through Brexit & windrush) but he was & has always been a politician of the right to me! He refused to serve in Ed M's cabinet & was was part of the right (but never part of the clique)

Yes, he's actually one of the most 'right wing' members of the PLP and has been since he was first elected. It's just that a lot of people, as you say, confuse political position with vibes.

An interesting development in the Corbyn & post Corbyn era is that people still confuse or assume that the left/right spectrum in the party relates to how open you were in your corbynsceptism. Wes Streeting was one of the most devout anti-Corbyn MPs but he isn't the most right wing member of the PLP while equally some MPs like Johnny Reynolds are members of the Labour right but wouldn't be necessarily be identified as such based on serving under JC.

There are really three things here aren't there - personal relations, 'vibes', and actual political/ideological positions. In terms of factionalist nonsense the former is often the most important, but it really shouldn't be confused with the latter and a lot of people make this mistake.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Perhaps this is a difference in perceptions of different types of people between the US and the UK, but I never got particularly left-wing vibes from Lammy. He's always struck me as very much a social-liberal type of person rather than a social-democratic one. During the various dramas of 2019 he was on MSNBC all the time to explain the situation to liberal middle-class Americans.

[afleitch]

Perhaps this is a difference in perceptions of different types of people between the US and the UK, but I never got particularly left-wing vibes from Lammy. He's always struck me as very much a social-liberal type of person rather than a social-democratic one. During the various dramas of 2019 he was on MSNBC all the time to explain the situation to liberal middle-class Americans.

Interestingly it's news to me he was an MSNBC regular. He's a Harvard grad (quick Google has him as the first black Briton at Harvard Law) and worked in the States so it makes sense.

[Blair]

I guess it's just a sign of how well Lammy reinvented himself post 2015 (largely through Brexit & windrush) but he was & has always been a politician of the right to me! He refused to serve in Ed M's cabinet & was was part of the right (but never part of the clique)

Yes, he's actually one of the most 'right wing' members of the PLP and has been since he was first elected. It's just that a lot of people, as you say, confuse political position with vibes.

His mayoral campaign in 2015 was a sign of that- I can't remember much beyond finding it very weird & even too right wing for me. On googling to try and refresh my memory I saw he was endorsed by Siobhan Mcdonagh- who might be the only London MP who was more right wing than David.

https://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2015/05/why-im-backing-david-lammy-be-labours-candidate-london-mayor

Perhaps this is a difference in perceptions of different types of people between the US and the UK, but I never got particularly left-wing vibes from Lammy. He's always struck me as very much a social-liberal type of person rather than a social-democratic one. During the various dramas of 2019 he was on MSNBC all the time to explain the situation to liberal middle-class Americans.

I think part of it relates to the fact that he has pretty regularly hit progressive notes since 2016; devoutly opposing Brexit, calling out anti-migrant language & the Windrush scandal along with doing a lot on criminal justice reform- he is relatively high profile for an MP & is someone who my politically engaged (but normal!) friends will have heard of through this- so the natural assumption is that he would at the least not be hostile to it.

I think it does actually come down to the divide you mentioned of social liberalism v democratic socialism; a lot of Corbyn's soft support in the party came from the first group.

Perhaps this is a difference in perceptions of different types of people between the US and the UK, but I never got particularly left-wing vibes from Lammy. He's always struck me as very much a social-liberal type of person rather than a social-democratic one. During the various dramas of 2019 he was on MSNBC all the time to explain the situation to liberal middle-class Americans.

Interestingly it's news to me he was an MSNBC regular. He's a Harvard grad (quick Google has him as the first black Briton at Harvard Law) and worked in the States so it makes sense.

He also appeared on various Crooked Media podcasts about foreign policy & specifically Brexit; which was weird as he was never a big player on the Labour remain side- but I think that was because of various political shenanigans in the PLP about who was leading the FBPE wing at that time.

[CumbrianLefty]

Yes, the social liberal v social democrat thing is underrated as a factor in internal Labour politics. It is indeed not totally untrue to say that many of Corbyn's most fervent supporters are actually very left wing liberals at heart, rather than from the democratic socialist tradition.

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/labour-is-training-up-a-new-generation-of-competent-and-normal-future-mps
Hillarious headline, but hopefuly it works out well. Already attracted factional controversy though.

[Blair]

https://www.politicshome.com/news/article/labour-is-training-up-a-new-generation-of-competent-and-normal-future-mps
Hillarious headline, but hopefuly it works out well. Already attracted factional controversy though.

A bold claim to say that anyone in THIGMOO is normal.

The most normal people tend to be those who keep miles away from any form of elected office.

On a serious point the problem with the 2017 & 2019 intakes wasn't competency- it was that there was a lack of serious local vetting.

There are essentially two types of vetting that political parties can do.

The first which makes you sign a form saying 1.) have you been charged with a crime 2.) have you got any financial problems 3.) is there anything you should tell us etc. This obviously weeds out obvious cases but people have been known to either lie or embellish- or their problems are unrelated to the above.

The second is to hold a proper interview process, ask questions about the role & more importantly ask their branch and CLP secretary what they're like- people tend to build up a reputation and it's generally relatively non-factional.

In 2017 the process was rushed & frankly stitched up- of course the problem was that the only seats stitched up where the ones held by sitting Labour MPs as it was assumed we'd not win any opposition held seats. We then ended up with MPs who frankly we did not expect to win & who had most likely only been through the first stage of vetting.

In a sense 2019 had the opposite problem; the leadership were parachuting people into seats & engaging in a wide range of dirty tricks to achieve this.