International COVID-19 Megathread
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Samof94
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« Reply #2200 on: November 25, 2020, 06:42:28 AM »

Hey guys, lots of great information on here.  We really need an "opinions/discussion from unqualified people" thread for people like me so I don't derail anything productive.  Canada saw a record 7,000 cases yesterday, so we're at about the same level of infection the U.S. was during the summer.  Things are not going so well here despite all the lockdowns and mandates.  One big difference is that a lot of schools are still open, and I've noticed the last couple months that people are not taking the distancing thing so seriously.  I am of the opinion that distancing is probably more effective than mask wearing.  I can't imagine the negative impact all the Black Friday/Christmas shopping will do in places that are still open this week.  S*** is about to hit the fan.
That number is pretty scary once you scale it. People will visit their relatives over the holidays as well.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2201 on: November 25, 2020, 06:47:50 AM »

My state, Salzburg, today clarified plans for the mass testing of the population:

It will be held statewide on the weekend of December 12-13.

1 town (Annaberg) will already test on December 1-2 and serve as a test-run for the state.

In general, all 570.000 people in the state are allowed to be tested incl. children if their parents want to do so.

The mass tests will be performed at the 534 voting precincts used for elections.

https://service.salzburg.gv.at/lkorrj/detail?nachrid=64242

The governor expects a "turnout" of 60%, but if the mass test in South Tyrol is an indicator, it will be much higher.

The tests will be performed from 8am-7pm Saturday+Sunday.

The states of Vorarlberg and Tyrol will mass-test their population even a weekend earlier and they also start on Friday already, December 4-6.

https://vorarlberg.orf.at/stories/3077500
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President Johnson
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« Reply #2202 on: November 25, 2020, 02:38:32 PM »

German "lookdown light" likely to be extended to December 20 later today. Daily cases are still at a high level, but have not gone up further since early November. However, yesterday were over 400 deaths reported. A new high. The current death toll is at 18,000.

It's still discussed whether to ban fireworks on New Year's Eve this year to provide relief in hospitals. The Netherlands issued a fireworks ban for New Year's Eve earlier this month.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2203 on: November 26, 2020, 08:50:40 AM »

Austria's mass population testings over the next 3 weeks will be administered differently by state:

While some states (like Salzburg here) will conduct it like a federal election in voting precincts, the city of Vienna will test people in 3 huge convention centers.

As for me, who has not voted in my election precinct in more than 10 years (I'm a regular postal voter), it would mean visiting my election precinct again.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2204 on: November 26, 2020, 08:59:19 AM »

Austria's mass population testings over the next 3 weeks will be administered differently by state:

While some states (like Salzburg here) will conduct it like a federal election in voting precincts, the city of Vienna will test people in 3 huge convention centers.

As for me, who has not voted in my election precinct in more than 10 years (I'm a regular postal voter), it would mean visiting my election precinct again.

Vienna will install 300 walk-in test lanes at those 3 convention centers, which are able to test 150.000 people per day.

Vienna's mass testing will remain open 10 hours a day and for 12 days (December 2-13), so they can test 1.8 million city residents.
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parochial boy
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« Reply #2205 on: November 26, 2020, 02:44:12 PM »

Big Europe-wide fights about the Ski resorts today. That is, Austria vs everywhere else and Switzerland is just going to do whatever the hell we want.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2206 on: November 26, 2020, 02:52:59 PM »

Big Europe-wide fights about the Ski resorts today. That is, Austria vs everywhere else and Switzerland is just going to do whatever the hell we want.

Austria, Switzerland, France vs. everyone else.

The skiing itself is not a problem. It's the silly apres-ski and partying.

People and tourists only need to be required to buy their food at the supermarkets instead.
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parochial boy
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« Reply #2207 on: November 26, 2020, 03:07:47 PM »

Big Europe-wide fights about the Ski resorts today. That is, Austria vs everywhere else and Switzerland is just going to do whatever the hell we want.

Austria, Switzerland, France vs. everyone else.

The skiing itself is not a problem. It's the silly apres-ski and partying.

People and tourists only need to be required to buy their food at the supermarkets instead.

The French genius master plan appears to be "the slopes can open but the lifts can't", which, er...

But yeah, it's an activity where you are outside and fairly socially distanced most of the time - issues could come up with téléphérique type cable cars and queues... but they've been running them in some of the resorts here all month and seem to have got away with some capacity limits and masks.

I don't think anyone is pushing for the bars and clubs to be allowed to open
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FrancoAgo
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« Reply #2208 on: November 26, 2020, 03:18:10 PM »

Big Europe-wide fights about the Ski resorts today. That is, Austria vs everywhere else and Switzerland is just going to do whatever the hell we want.

Austria, Switzerland, France vs. everyone else.

The skiing itself is not a problem. It's the silly apres-ski and partying.

People and tourists only need to be required to buy their food at the supermarkets instead.

Italian news report that France is in the same side of Italy and Germany
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palandio
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« Reply #2209 on: November 26, 2020, 03:23:19 PM »

Skiing itself is not the problem. The issues with lifts and gondolas might be solveable, too.

Mass tourism at the height of a pandemic is the problem. Day tourists can sleep at home, drive there by car and bring their own sausage sandwich and their own thermos jug of tea. That's completely unrealistic for all the German (north of Munich) and Dutch tourists. And when mass tourism breaks away keeping the lifts open may prove deficitary altogether in the bigger destinations inside the Alps.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2210 on: November 26, 2020, 03:29:11 PM »

As Chancellor Kurz says (and he’s right on this), ski lifts and gondolas are nothing else than public transport like a bus or something.

And the ski lifts are just lifts in open area, and gondolas have windows to open for fresh air.

This is no big deal. A closed full bus or subway is far more dangerous in this regard.

We need to be careful not to infringe every little freedom despite everything that’s going on.

But apres ski and mountaintop restaurants need to remain closed this winter.
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parochial boy
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« Reply #2211 on: November 26, 2020, 04:05:00 PM »
« Edited: November 26, 2020, 04:08:07 PM by parochial boy »

Skiing itself is not the problem. The issues with lifts and gondolas might be solveable, too.

Mass tourism at the height of a pandemic is the problem. Day tourists can sleep at home, drive there by car and bring their own sausage sandwich and their own thermos jug of tea. That's completely unrealistic for all the German (north of Munich) and Dutch tourists. And when mass tourism breaks away keeping the lifts open may prove deficitary altogether in the bigger destinations inside the Alps.

Which raises an interesting question itself. Even in a normal year, the actual ski lifts have a difficult time managing to break even by themselves, and tend to be heavily subsidised. A lot of the profit is always made off of the ancilliary accomodation/restaurants/bars that drive those local economies. The big star resorts like Zermatt or the Trois-Vallées can get away with it; but your average small alpine village with 12 lifts and 50kms of slope is basically on life support already. Many of them are already on the verge of being killed off by climate change.

In that respect, the resorts in the latter category tend to be much less dependent on the international tourism and more on the family day trip. But in these cases, it's the mountain top lunch that is the dealbreaker that keeps these places alive. I don't see those restaurants as being a problem by themselves, a lot of them are outside in any case, and restaurants don't seem to have been the be all and end all in transmissions as it turns out.

But the point is, for a lot of the small family resorts - another year with only very limited opportunity to open could wind up being the factor that convinces them to give up completely and shut down permanently.

Although it's a bit moot - at the moment we don't seem to be anywhere near seeing the snow line drop below about 2500m, so it's only the high alps where there's even the question to be asked.
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Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #2212 on: November 26, 2020, 04:17:18 PM »
« Edited: November 26, 2020, 04:24:24 PM by ByeDon/Harris »

Germany

From December 1 to December 22: A maximum of five people from two households can meet (all children until 14 are exempted from this).

From December 23 to January 1: A maximum of ten people irrespective of the number of households can meet (all children until 14 are exempted from this).

So much for the theory. In reality, a number of states are deviating from this as they see fit. Less-affected states Schleswig-Holstein and Saxony-Anhalt have already announced to use looser rules than this.
COVID hotspot Berlin has adopted that first rule for December 1 to December 22 (except that children until 12 are exempted), but a stricter rule of a maximum of five people irrespective of the number of households for Christmas and New Year's Eve.
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Clarko95 📚💰📈
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« Reply #2213 on: November 26, 2020, 07:38:09 PM »

Sweden at 70% of ICU capacity, new polls shows only 42% of Swedes have confidence in the authority's ability to fight the virus, 44% worry that they are not doing enough.

Currently averaging about 4800 cases per day, projected to go up to 8000 per day in December. And we're back to about 20-40 deaths per day.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2214 on: November 27, 2020, 07:18:06 AM »

Dates of mass population tests in the federal states:

Vienna: December 2-13
Tyrol: December 4-6
Vorarlberg: December 4-6
Burgenland: December 10-15
Upper Austria: December 11-14
Salzburg: December 12-13
Carinthia: December 12-13
Styria: December 12-13
Lower Austria: December 19-20

Estimated „turnout“: 50-80% (4-7 million people).
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Samof94
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« Reply #2215 on: November 27, 2020, 08:05:39 AM »

Sweden at 70% of ICU capacity, new polls shows only 42% of Swedes have confidence in the authority's ability to fight the virus, 44% worry that they are not doing enough.

Currently averaging about 4800 cases per day, projected to go up to 8000 per day in December. And we're back to about 20-40 deaths per day.
Having the second worst record in the industrialized world is a serious problem.
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Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #2216 on: November 27, 2020, 08:57:53 AM »
« Edited: November 27, 2020, 10:33:56 AM by ByeDon/Harris »

COVID situation continues to be very serious in Germany.

But be it as it may, today is BLACK FRIDAY (in some stores Black Week(end)). So, let's go shopping. And indeed many seem to be doing just that.

However, facilities like museums or galleries - which operate under the same hygiene and sanitation protocols as consumer electronics retail stores - have been shut down for almost a month now, with no end in sight. That's probably supposed to make sense, even if it doesn't.

Politicians and scientists have recently pointed out that the current lockdown "light" measures seem to be much less effective than expected and hoped for. I guess that's because the constant transmission of mixed and incoherent messages leads to people not taking COVID seriously any longer, having that topic checked off as "over and done with" for themselves. After all, you can make a good bargain today.
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Cassius
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« Reply #2217 on: November 27, 2020, 10:00:25 AM »

The current standard for lockdowns now appears to be:

Anything vaguely enjoyable: Banned or severely curtailed.
Anything dull and will-sapping: Carry on as normal (with a mask).
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urutzizu
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« Reply #2218 on: November 27, 2020, 10:56:48 AM »

COVID situation continues to be very serious in Germany.

But be it as it may, today is BLACK FRIDAY (in some stores Black Week(end)). So, let's go shopping. And indeed many seem to be doing just that.

However, facilities like museums or galleries - which operate under the same hygiene and sanitation protocols as consumer electronics retail stores - have been shut down for almost a month now, with no end in sight. That's probably supposed to make sense, even if it doesn't.

Politicians and scientists have recently pointed out that the current lockdown "light" measures seem to be much less effective than expected and hoped for. I guess that's because the constant transmission of mixed and incoherent messages leads to people not taking COVID seriously any longer, having that topic checked off as "over and done with" for themselves. After all, you can make a good bargain today.

There a no good options, but in my perspective it is preferable than the Austrian/UK/French approach of screwing the Economy through JoJo-ing Hard Lockdowns or attempting Herd Immunity. The Partial Lockdown hasn't brought down the Infection rate, but it is hard enough to keep the Infection rate stable and soft enough that our Country can cope economically.

Composite PMI numbers for November:



L to R: Eurozone: 45.1; UK: 47.4; France 39.9; Germany 52.0

Value above 50 indicates Economic Growth, Germany being one of few in Europe to do so. Essentially Germany can stick Culture and much of Hospitality being shut down, as long as the rest of the Economy remains operating (Manufacturing, Retail, Hairdressers etc.) and Schools stay open, not least because the first two are a smaller part of the economy than in many other European Countries. Google Mobility is also only down by about 10 percent, compared to about 40 during the first Lockdown and a much smaller decrease than in most of the rest of Europe.

If we have to for at least the next few months, as the Government has strongly indicated, we can do that - arguably it is one of the few more quasi-sustainable strategies in Europe right now. But I guess it is more of a moral Issue then about whether it is acceptable to essentially sacrifice some 300 odd people per day and a ton of jobs in culture and hospitality to keep the rest of the Country going.
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Middle-aged Europe
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« Reply #2219 on: November 27, 2020, 11:19:46 AM »

COVID situation continues to be very serious in Germany.

But be it as it may, today is BLACK FRIDAY (in some stores Black Week(end)). So, let's go shopping. And indeed many seem to be doing just that.

However, facilities like museums or galleries - which operate under the same hygiene and sanitation protocols as consumer electronics retail stores - have been shut down for almost a month now, with no end in sight. That's probably supposed to make sense, even if it doesn't.

Politicians and scientists have recently pointed out that the current lockdown "light" measures seem to be much less effective than expected and hoped for. I guess that's because the constant transmission of mixed and incoherent messages leads to people not taking COVID seriously any longer, having that topic checked off as "over and done with" for themselves. After all, you can make a good bargain today.

There a no good options, but in my perspective it is preferable than the Austrian/UK/French approach of screwing the Economy through JoJo-ing Hard Lockdowns or attempting Herd Immunity. The Partial Lockdown hasn't brought down the Infection rate, but it is hard enough to keep the Infection rate stable and soft enough that our Country can cope economically.

Composite PMI numbers for November:



L to R: Eurozone: 45.1; UK: 47.4; France 39.9; Germany 52.0

Value above 50 indicates Economic Growth, Germany being one of few in Europe to do so. Essentially Germany can stick Culture and much of Hospitality being shut down, as long as the rest of the Economy remains operating (Manufacturing, Retail, Hairdressers etc.) and Schools stay open, not least because the first two are a smaller part of the economy than in many other European Countries. Google Mobility is also only down by about 10 percent, compared to about 40 during the first Lockdown and a much smaller decrease than in most of the rest of Europe.

If we have to for at least the next few months, as the Government has strongly indicated, we can do that - arguably it is one of the few more quasi-sustainable strategies in Europe right now. But I guess it is more of a moral Issue then about whether it is acceptable to essentially sacrifice some 300 odd people per day and a ton of jobs in culture and hospitality to keep the rest of the Country going.

I'm not working in culture, arts, tourism, or gastronomy myself, so I guess it doesn't affect me that much personally. I do have a self-employed actor (nobody you'd know by name or face, although you'd probably recognize a few of the movies/TV shows he appeared in) among my acquaintances and I don't think I really need to lay down his opinion on the "Lockdown light" here. Because his opinion is exactly what you would assume it is, given the cirumstances. Herein lays perhaps a bit of danger, that is the political radicalization of certain segments of society. The first lockdown in spring had been "brutal, but fair". Everybody was shut down back then. Now some parts of society keep on going, while others were singled out and selected for lockdown. That means a lot of people who feel themselves treated unfairly, and the AfD is already working hard in getting the votes of the pissed offs.

That being said, the current situation may still be preferable to the one in spring, all things considered. I think what I was rather getting at is: Keeping all the department stores open is one thing, but in the context of the phenomena described above it seems like a dumbass decision to conduct a "Black Friday" this year. Because that event I would have considered redundant, at the very least.
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Estrella
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« Reply #2220 on: November 27, 2020, 11:52:48 AM »

Until now, Slovakia's PM Igor Matovič has been handling the situation pretty well. Generally low infection rates, reasonably strict measures and even a world first - successful mass testing of the whole population. I don't know what happened in the last month or so, but he seems to have become completely unhinged.

The GALAXY BRAIN of his came up with an idea. On December 7, we'll reopen schools, but with the following measures: before entering, children will gargle salt water (?!) and spit in a bucket (?!!) which will then be sealed and sent for testing. If the result is positive, all children who spat in the bucket (and their parents and siblings) will have to get tested and they will only be allowed to enter school premises with a negative result. The testing will be conducted by teachers (?!?!) because there isn't enough qualified personnel (yet somehow there was enough for the mass testing?).

The reaction from literally everyone (scared children, shocked parents, teachers on the brink of a heart attack, headteachers desperate after being screamed at by parents who threaten to sue them, public health experts, even people in his own cabinet, basically anyone with a functioning brain) was thus. Today, Matovič decided to do a 180° for the xth time in the past few weeks and his new plan is... f**k knows.

Christ alive, what a f****** cretin. Small wonder that he has a like -35 approval rating (and that was before this disaster!).
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DabbingSanta
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« Reply #2221 on: November 27, 2020, 02:18:34 PM »

Looks like we might be entering some sort of twilight zone. Ontario now expecting 10k cases a day in late December. Record high of 1855 set today. 
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2222 on: November 27, 2020, 02:24:20 PM »

THE HORROR:

Reuters: Millions of dead „zombie“ mink re-emerge from their mass graves in Denmark

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2020/1127/1180897-denmark-mink-graves/

😳
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« Reply #2223 on: November 27, 2020, 06:26:22 PM »

After Berlin had been Germany's main COVID hotspot for the past couple of weeks, the regions most affected by the Coronavirus have now shifted to the southern parts of former East Germany.  Oddly enough, these areas had previously been among the least affected in past months.

Saxony has surpassed Berlin as the state with the most new infections per 100,000 inhabitants, particularly in Saxony's more rural counties. The county with most new infections Germany-wide is Hildburghausen in neighbouring Thuringia. The imposition of stricter anti-Corona measures sparked a wave of public protests in Hildburghausen that made national news.

Theorizing has begun to explain this new phenomenon, including the assumption that these counties are major AfD strongholds and the AfD is the German party most critical of any COVID measures and restrictions. So just like Trumpists in the U.S. they don't wear masks und don't abide by hygiene and sanitation protocols.

The more harmless explanation is that since these areas hadn't been much affected by the pandemic so far, the population also hadn't considered Corona much of a danger based on their prior experience. Therefore fewer mask-wearing and less compliance with hygiene and sanitation protocols.

Other explanations include: The virus spread to these counties from the neighbouring Czech Republic which had been severly affected by COVID recently. Also, these counties have for the most part a rapidly aging population and therefore are more susceptible to an outbreak.
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Tender Branson
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« Reply #2224 on: November 28, 2020, 04:34:40 AM »

"Profil" magazine poll:

56% say they will take part in the December mass population tests (22% definitely)
37% not (20% definitely not)

https://www.ots.at/presseaussendung/OTS_20201128_OTS0015/profil-umfrage-56-koennen-sich-teilnahme-an-corona-massentests-vorstellen
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