UK General Discussion:The Rt. Hon Alex Boris de Pfeffel Johnson, Populist Hero

[Blair]

I don't know what would be more depressing- the fact that they booked him despite knowing, or that they employ production staff who are that lazy.

[Blair]

In unrelated news I was very confused to see part of UK political twitter debating about Marxism and the desire to abolish the family.

With the disclaimer that my reading of Marx only ever extended to various Marxist interpretations of the British Economy it's interesting how much of the argument consisted of quoting what Marx wrote 160 years ago. It gave me flashbacks of arguments within the Church of England.

[CumbrianLefty]

I don't know what would be more depressing- the fact that they booked him despite knowing, or that they employ production staff who are that lazy.

Though it is still interesting that they have apologised for this one so quickly and unequivocally - their usual response to this sort of thing, in recent years especially, has been to double down.

[Suburbia]

Lest we forget: UKIP were (briefly) the first semi-relevant party to have a "nonwhite" leader.

A sellout, according to Dianne Abbott.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddy_Vachha

[Suburbia]

Sunak may be associated with the ‘treasury view’ of the public finances, but he’s still by far the best candidate to succeed Johnson. The rest of the senior cabinet ministers are hardly on what one might tentatively describe as the ‘economically populist’ wing of the party (if such a wing can even be said to exist), so I’m not sure if there’s much in the argument that Sunak is too far to the right on economic policy. Meanwhile, at the very least he isn’t a loose cannon (like Truss), voter repellent (Gove, Patel, Raab etc) or a non-entity (most of the rest of the cabinet) and generally speaking comes across as being on top of his brief and as a nice, decent family man (unlike Johnson). Given that whenever we change the PM we usually end up with someone very different to his or her predecessor, I think the latter factors augur well for Sunak to be the best replacement for Johnson.

Truss may get the vote because she is white. I don't know if Dame Joan Collins and others can stomach a nonwhite PM. The younger generation, yea, but not the old guard.

[Conservatopia]

Bronz, why don't you go check for scary Jews under your bed instead derailing the thread with this clueless nonsense?

[Suburbia]

Bronz, why don't you go check for scary Jews under your bed instead derailing the thread with this clueless nonsense?

I am just speaking reality.

Conservatives are proud they elevated the first woman to UK prime minister, a boast countered by the left with the accusation that Margaret Thatcher did nothing to protect or advance the rights of women. Then came Theresa May and it was 2-0 to the Tories. The same argument is now being played out over the current cabinet and Conservative Party, seemingly more diverse with every election. But this time it’s a lot more than a point-scoring exercise. Scratch around the debate about why minorities lend their support to anyone and you unearth something scary for Labour and the left in general.

Broadly speaking, the left argues that someone from a minority who aligns with the Conservatives is betraying the historic injustices inflicted on marginalised groups by the Establishment. The other side asserts that anyone from a minority who shares Conservative values is free to pursue their individual life goals without being beholden to the groupthink of identity politics. You can see why this looks increasingly like a culture war the left cannot win.
In his maiden speech in the Commons in June 2020, Broxtowe MP Darren Henry said, “The members opposite claim Windrush as their own. As if it is obvious that immigrants are somehow obliged, morally and practically, to be Labour supporters. Well, my family was not – and I am not. I stand here as evidence of what immigrants, and their children, can achieve in what my parents called the land of opportunity. I am proud to be the first Conservative MP of West Indian heritage. Black, British with all my heart, immensely proud of my West Indian heritage and Conservative to my fingertips.”

This is personally sincere but politically adroit: you see the tactics (undermine the left’s preoccupation with identity politics) and the strategy (chip away at Labour’s hold over minority voters). Former Conservative Party co-chairman James Cleverly was playing the same gambit when he said, “The left really don’t like us BAME people being successful.” Conservatives highlight what they call the “victim narrative” of the left as a trap to prevent minority Britons fulfilling their potential. It’s a potent message. They wield it against arguments such as this, tweeted by the writer Afua Hirsch last year: “Imperial systems have always relied on the complicity of a small number of colonised people to invest in the status quo. Applies to the mental colonisation of today’s black Tories as much as the literal co-option of the black elites in the Empire. Nothing new. By design. But triggering AF.”

https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/politics/article/conservative-party-diversity

Same rules apply globally in any white-dominated country with the Left and the Right.

[gerritcole]

should labour disavow blair and apologize for the 1997, 2001, 2005 victories due to iraq in order to solidify young bipoc and terf support

[Suburbia]

should labour disavow blair and apologize for the 1997, 2001, 2005 victories due to iraq in order to solidify young bipoc and terf support

It would lose them the centrist base and the WWC, so no. Blair is the past, they should learn how he won, but not adopt all of his ideology.

Starmer should have more BAME people on his cabinet to match the Tories.

And if he is PM, Starmer should invite some of the association footballers to connect with young people.

[Blair]

If you're talking about Joan Collins in relation to the next conservative leadership election then you've lost touch with reality.

[Boobs]

But what will Fanny Cradock think of a non-white Conservative PM?

[Suburbia]

If you're talking about Joan Collins in relation to the next conservative leadership election then you've lost touch with reality.

Dame Joan is too old. In the 70s and 80s, if she quit acting, she would have given Thatcher a run. She is a UKIP member but says she is apolitical and afraid of giving her opinions on topics.

She is a anti-illegal immigration conservative, but supports the NHS. She supports Donald Trump, one of her closest friends in life. She is a populist conservative for a rich woman.

The Dynasty actor mentioned that she had been on the receiving end of abuse about her own politics in the past.

She admitted: “I stopped saying anything political on social media, because I got so much hate mail when I mentioned I’d gone to an event for Nigel Farage, and I thought, ‘Oh my god, this isn’t worth it.’ So I will keep my political opinions to myself and my friends.”

Tory leadership post Boris is down to Sunak, Truss, Patel and Javid. If Tories were smart, they'd pick Johnny Mercer, a military man. Your Dan Crenshaw.

https://www.thecourier.co.uk/fp/opinion/2827776/boris-johnson-finished-next-prime-minister/

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Is it just me or can anyone else smell solvents?

[Conservatopia]

I think it's important to find out whether (((Ruby Wax))) would support smart military man Johnny Mercer over old white man evil Tory Bill Cash.

[CumbrianLefty]

should labour disavow blair and apologize for the 1997, 2001, 2005 victories due to iraq in order to solidify young bipoc and terf support

This take is so white hot it makes bronz look like an amateur

[Torrain]

should labour disavow blair and apologize for the 1997, 2001, 2005 victories due to iraq in order to solidify young bipoc and terf support

This take is so white hot it makes bronz look like an amateur

There’s a certain irony that this British thread keeps getting colonised by Americans who keep trying to impose their way of thinking onto our political framework.

Is this what it must have felt like to be a foreign subject of the Empire? Just guys like Bronz trying to tell you how your nation worked?

_{Disclaimer: this only applies to Bronz and gerritcole. Guys like Ishan are genuinely solid contributors.}

[Conservatopia]

Tony Blair has been given a knighthood.

We definitely live in the banter timeline.

[Silent Hunter]

Tony Blair has been given a knighthood.

We definitely live in the banter timeline.

News article here

They made Eden an Earl, mind.

[Secretary of State Liberal Hack]

Tony Blair has been given a knighthood.

We definitely live in the banter timeline.

I think maybe that was to defuse the speculation he was being refused one as a personal slight by the queen or something ?. Also can Bronz be threadbanned or something ?

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

Tony Blair has been given a knighthood.

We definitely live in the banter timeline.

He should be sharing a prison cell with Prince Andrew.

[Silent Hunter]

Tony Blair has been given a knighthood.

We definitely live in the banter timeline.

I think maybe that was to defuse the speculation he was being refused one as a personal slight by the queen or something ?. Also can Bronz be threadbanned or something ?

A PM that doesn't get some form of post-Downing Street gong would be a rare one indeed. You have to go back to Chamberlain for a case where it didn't happen and that's arguably entirely because he died before the year is out. Ramsay MacDonald would be the latest non-death exemption; Douglas-Home was already knighted before he got there (well, a peer in fact) as would be Sir Keir Starmer.

In other news, Daniel Craig has been made a Commander of the Order of St. Michael and St. George. The CMG isn't something usually given to actors, who get the British Empire gongs instead, instead being the kind of honour that goes to diplomats... and spies. When one remembers that James Bond himself gets the CMG (and declines a knighthood in the final Fleming novel written), one can conclude a good sense of humour in the honours world.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

As pointed out above, some kind of serious honour basically goes with the territory.* The norm used to be a peerage but the last to accept one of those was Thatcher. Blair 'ought' to have had something a while ago, but it was an open secret that the Queen was holding out on that as she found his actions after Diana died to be gauche, even though they likely saved in the monarchy in its present form. We could take this as another sign that she's largely retired from her constitutional functions now, except formally.

Ramsay MacDonald would be the latest non-death exemption

His death was unexpected, though it was no secret that he was not well, and he was still technically politically active as MP for Combined Scottish Universities and as Lord President of the Council. Had he retired on paper as well as in practice he would certainly have been given something.

_{*Which means that, yes, David Cameron will indeed get something in the post as well at some point. I know. I know. But we must prepare ourselves.}

[Conservatopia]

It feels weird that I, a right-winger, am probably one of the only people here that actually likes Tony Blair.

Actually no on second thoughts that isn't weird - it makes perfect sense...

[(no subject)]

Blair won three general elections for Labour. Jeremy and Ten Pound Trots Leftism will not win any general elections for Labour.

[Pericles]

Starmer had it right when he said Labour should be proud of Blair's government. If you have a Labour government for 13 years, you can do a lot of progressive stuff such as significantly reducing child poverty and introducing the minimum wage. Labour needs to remind people of the good stuff they did, this helps people believe in what they are offering for the future.