UK General Discussion:The Rt. Hon Alex Boris de Pfeffel Johnson, Populist Hero

[Blair]

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1360309462796500995

[Alcibiades]

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1360309462796500995

I do wonder if the Greens will be able to get a breakthrough in the next election (I don’t know if 7% necessarily counts as one, but it would be a very good result for them - the unknown factor is obviously how that would translates into seats). This is a pattern we’ve been seeing across Europe, although the UK’s circumstances are obviously different - firstly, the UK Greens have a less moderate reputation than say, the German Greens, and secondly, there is the matter of FPTP.

[CumbrianLefty]

Greens polling well in mid-term and then being squeezed (by both Labour and the LibDems) as a GE approaches has been a regular feature of the past decade. It might be different this time, but equally it might not. They have never fielded a full slate of candidates at a GE either.

[EastAnglianLefty]

Green support bouncing up is a pattern seen in several polls and is notable but perhaps not significant in the long-term. Neither a boost for the Lib Dems nor a fall for the Tories has been seen in other polls, so Occam's razor applies.

[CumbrianLefty]

Which hasn't stopped the s***post left writing political obituaries of Starmer on the back of it.

[Blair]

The interesting thing is that while I don't disagree with some of the critiques of Starmer; it does seem that everyones advice seems to relate to their pre-existing views.

The Greens & Lib Dems seem convinced that Labour just need to come out in favour of PR & others are now saying that Labour need a vision, a story or policies.

[Swedish Rainbow Capitalist Cheese]

Greens polling well in mid-term and then being squeezed (by both Labour and the LibDems) as a GE approaches has been a regular feature of the past decade.

Indeed, I remember when the Greens were gonna have their big break-through in 2015.

The interesting thing is that while I don't disagree with some of the critiques of Starmer; it does seem that everyones advice seems to relate to their pre-existing views.

That's always the story of politics though. Last spring was particularly bad here in Sweden when every single politician was proclaiming how their old policy proposals were the magic bullet that was going to see us through the Covid and that the pandemic proved that they had been right all along...

[Blair]

I'd highly reccomend that everyone watches It's a Sin on Channel 4; it's a TV drama about the AIDs epidemic in the 1980s (with a particular focus on the gay community) in the UK.

It's one of the best series I've seen for a while (It's by Russel T Davies so I'm not surprised) & it's a pretty harrowing look into the personal impact of the epidemic, while brushing up against some of the political themes of the era.

[CumbrianLefty]

Ah yes, the time when a Tory MP could express delight at a gay bookshop being attacked with "it is right that there should be intolerance of evil" and one of their councillors went even further with the claim the way to deal with AIDS was to "gas 95 per cent of queers".

They would now have you believe this sort of stuff never happened, nor Section 28 either.

Don't let the Tories airbrush their inglorious history.

[cp]

It's quite good, isn't it? Certainly better than Davies' last show (Banana/Cucumber/Tofu), and I'd say better than QaF was back in the day, though I was much more partial to the American version of that anyway.

I actually thought It's a Sin really pulled its punches on the political commentary. The complacency, if not outright malevolence, of a lot of Tory and some Labour politicians at the time was much uglier   than the show depicted. Also, the AIDS activism in the series was a little glossy and pollyannaish for my taste, a la the 2014 movie Pride.

Not sure it was mentioned before, but there was a minor media scuffle about it when it aired. One of the semi-fascist papers referred to the sex scenes as 'explicit'* while referring to equally sexy depictions of straight intercourse in another show as 'steamy'. Homophobic double standards at their best.

*In fairness, the scenes were pretty graphic in that Russel T Davies/QaF/rimming sort of way.

[Blair]

It's quite good, isn't it? Certainly better than Davies' last show (Banana/Cucumber/Tofu), and I'd say better than QaF was back in the day, though I was much more partial to the American version of that anyway.

I actually thought It's a Sin really pulled its punches on the political commentary. The complacency, if not outright malevolence, of a lot of Tory and some Labour politicians at the time was much uglier   than the show depicted. Also, the AIDS activism in the series was a little glossy and pollyannaish for my taste, a la the 2014 movie Pride.

Not sure it was mentioned before, but there was a minor media scuffle about it when it aired. One of the semi-fascist papers referred to the sex scenes as 'explicit'* while referring to equally sexy depictions of straight intercourse in another show as 'steamy'. Homophobic double standards at their best.

*In fairness, the scenes were pretty graphic in that Russel T Davies/QaF/rimming sort of way.

I certainly don't disagree here; although an interesting defence I've seen is that the purpose was to show the impact on the part of the gay community which wasn't engaged until the mid/late 1980s- although a part about the utter horror of being one of those people on the switchboard or one of those activists could have been fleshed out if they had more episodes.

The scene where the main characters reject the early AIDS activists in the pub as 'scare-mongering because they can't get any' was sadly too true of the treatment that many faced.

There was a very minor discussion on twitter about the main character Richie confessing he voted Tory; this is something that was actually a lot more common than people think. Before the epidemic/Section 28 the 'gay' vote was certainly a lot Tory than people appreciate- I remember reading newspaper cuttings from some of the community press about the Miners strike and there was a strong disdain for the miners & their community (which was associated by some as being Macho, homophobic & the provincal community many gay people left as young adults)

The other interesting thing is that it seems the first time that the British response to HIV/AIDs is actually being discussed- a lot of people know about the American experience (no doubt due to Rent, Angels in America)

There was an amazing play on in London in 2018 called the The Inheritance which while dealing with the US side really put into perspective just what it did to an entire generation of gay men; including those who survived and had to live with it.

[afleitch]

I'd highly reccomend that everyone watches It's a Sin on Channel 4; it's a TV drama about the AIDs epidemic in the 1980s (with a particular focus on the gay community) in the UK.

It's one of the best series I've seen for a while (It's by Russel T Davies so I'm not surprised) & it's a pretty harrowing look into the personal impact of the epidemic, while brushing up against some of the political themes of the era.

I binged it. It broke me.

[Silent Hunter]

It's quite good, isn't it? Certainly better than Davies' last show (Banana/Cucumber/Tofu), and I'd say better than QaF was back in the day, though I was much more partial to the American version of that anyway.

I actually thought It's a Sin really pulled its punches on the political commentary. The complacency, if not outright malevolence, of a lot of Tory and some Labour politicians at the time was much uglier   than the show depicted. Also, the AIDS activism in the series was a little glossy and pollyannaish for my taste, a la the 2014 movie Pride.

Not sure it was mentioned before, but there was a minor media scuffle about it when it aired. One of the semi-fascist papers referred to the sex scenes as 'explicit'* while referring to equally sexy depictions of straight intercourse in another show as 'steamy'. Homophobic double standards at their best.

*In fairness, the scenes were pretty graphic in that Russel T Davies/QaF/rimming sort of way.

I certainly don't disagree here; although an interesting defence I've seen is that the purpose was to show the impact on the part of the gay community which wasn't engaged until the mid/late 1980s- although a part about the utter horror of being one of those people on the switchboard or one of those activists could have been fleshed out if they had more episodes.

The scene where the main characters reject the early AIDS activists in the pub as 'scare-mongering because they can't get any' was sadly too true of the treatment that many faced.

There was a very minor discussion on twitter about the main character Richie confessing he voted Tory; this is something that was actually a lot more common than people think. Before the epidemic/Article 28 the 'gay' vote was certainly a lot Tory than people appreciate- I remember reading newspaper cuttings from some of the community press about the Miners strike and there was a strong disdain for the miners & their community (which was associated by some as being Macho, homophobic & the provincal community many gay people left as young adults)

The other interesting thing is that it seems the first time that the British response to HIV/AIDs is actually been discussed- a lot of people know about the American experience (no doubt due to Rent, Angels in America)

There was an amazing play on in London in 2018 called the The Inheritance which while dealing with the US side really put into perspective just what it did to an entire generation of gay men; including those who survived and had to live with it.

The Bay Area Reporter in San Francisco, a weekly paper for the community there, was regularly running a large number of obituaries for those who died of AIDS in the area and when they had an issue in 1998 where they had for once received no death notices, they made that fact the cover story.

[CumbrianLefty]

Before the epidemic/Section 28 the 'gay' vote was certainly a lot Tory than people appreciate- I remember reading newspaper cuttings from some of the community press about the Miners strike and there was a strong disdain for the miners & their community (which was associated by some as being Macho, homophobic & the provincal community many gay people left as young adults)

And, of course, vice versa. Though these two different cultures "mixing" in pro-miners support groups in 1984-85 did sometimes produce positive long term effects.

[afleitch]

Before the epidemic/Section 28 the 'gay' vote was certainly a lot Tory than people appreciate- I remember reading newspaper cuttings from some of the community press about the Miners strike and there was a strong disdain for the miners & their community (which was associated by some as being Macho, homophobic & the provincal community many gay people left as young adults)

And, of course, vice versa. Though these two different cultures "mixing" in pro-miners support groups in 1984-85 did sometimes produce positive long term effects.

Well yes. There was a social conservatism in working class culture that saw homosexuality as 'weak' or a middle class (read Tory) public/grammar school vice. The TUC did lead the way in 1985 calling for equal rights, but in terms of early intervention and structural support for LGBT workers it was more white collar unions like NALGO (later Unison) in the 1970's that led the way over more traditional unions. But that's why the TUC was so important.

[Blair]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/education/gavin-williamson-education-university-free-speech-b1802674.html

I don't know what's worse- the fact that this is a shameless pandering*, the fact that virtually no students actually care about this or that this is going to be a pretty pointless waste of time policy wise.

It's a fascinating example also of people creating a fiction in their head; most people commenting in support seem to think this applies to lecturers/teaching (rather than external debates) or that universities back in the 70s or 50s were some sort of sedate debating club.

I might be wrong but my assumption was that the expansion of HE actually meant that the actual scale of the events/debates/protests are a lot smaller- even at my Russel Group uni you'd struggle to get more than 50-70 people to see a relatively high profile political figure.

*Williamson took education as a post in the pre-covid era believing he could use it to focus on vocational education & HE bashing such as this- if this idea was being promoted by Truss it would get a lot more pickup. Williamson is nearing grayling levels of any headline becoming a punchline...

[Blair]

I forgot to add the Government didn't seem to care when it was the SWP types who use to get hounded off campus!

[afleitch]

Gender critical feminists have ruffled feathers ober a gender 'self-ID' question on the Census. Despite the fact that nearly all census questions are self-id.

[CumbrianLefty]

I forgot to add the Government didn't seem to care when it was the SWP types who use to get hounded off campus!

Though the SWP is a totally terrible organisation that deserves all it gets and then some.

[Estrella]

This Tory obsession with plagiarising Republicans is getting ridiculous.

https://mobile.twitter.com/PoliticsForAlI/status/1362022590064304129

[CumbrianLefty]

Eric Pickles was chuntering on about this almost a decade ago, so its not just the US influence (and of course there is a pretty straightforward solution - everyone on the register gets a "voting card")

[Sir Tiki]

On a different note:

U.K. And Ireland Celebrate 50 Years Since 'Decimal Day'

Fifty years ago Monday, the U.K. and Ireland put an end to a system of currency that had been used for hundreds of years, and made a switch to decimalization — the system where currency is based on multiples of 10 and 100.

Before Feb. 15, 1971, Britain's currency was 12 pennies to the shilling and 20 shillings to the pound — or 240 pence to a pound.

https://www.npr.org/2021/02/15/968146708/u-k-and-ireland-celebrate-50-years-since-decimal-day

Happy (belated) decimal day!

[CumbrianLefty]

Still get people occasionally talking in "old money" terms (eg "two bob" for 10 pence) even today.

[GenerationTerrorist]

Decimalisation was 9 years before I was born, but still people (even my age!) say "I'll give my 2 Shillings Worth" when debating something!

[CumbrianLefty]

Rumours abounding in the last 24 hours that the life of the Queen Consort is "drawing peacefully to a close", to use the 1930s vernacular.