New Sheriff in Town
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  Atlas Fantasy Elections (Moderators: Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee, Lumine)
  New Sheriff in Town
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Author Topic: New Sheriff in Town  (Read 11368 times)
Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« on: November 15, 2019, 01:34:46 AM »
« edited: November 15, 2019, 12:37:49 PM by Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee »

This is being done on rather short notice and there is a lot of material that I have to go over so just know that there will be revisions/additions to things, but I figured I would get things stated publicly so that everyone is on the same page.


1. The Terms of Service: Like it not, love it or hate it. This forum is a resource that serves a purpose for Dave's business and therefore this site has rules to follow. These rules help to one protect the business from financial or legal liability and second of all, they help to preserve access to the site in schools and other entities that require rules to regulate content of various types lest they be blocked.

Atlasia exists on this site and thus regardless of what any constitution, law or statute or what not says, the Terms of Service is absolutely superior in every circumstance. In the best case Atlasia is a tolerated guest in someone else's house.

November 06 Revised TOS

If you disagree with this policy, you are more than welcome to try and convince Dave otherwise.


2. Conflicts of Interests:  I have successfully ran the Senate in multiple instances as a non-partisan administrator while also serving as Party Chair. I intend to bring the same division of roles to the role of Moderator. Do not ask, request, infer, intimidate, bully, blackmail, extort or otherwise try to manipulate my position(s) in this game to derive favoritism or abuse of the enforcement of the Terms of Service or utilization of mod powers. Such will not be tolerated and I can assure you it will not end well for you if you do.

I can assure you this game is better off having active, engaged participants as moderators. This is not to say anything negative about Gustaf who was active in the game for many years, but if he were to change boards or transfer I would desire a replacement from the left who is active to ensure balance. The reason we benefit from having moderators who are active and engaged in the game is so that we can achieve compliance with the Terms of Service without degrading the quality of discussion, debate and differences of opinion that make this game tolerable. It is kind of like community policing and community engagement. It is my hope to help, guide and advise you towards compliance in the least intrusive manner possible.

3. Copyright - I realize there are a lot of pictures on here but for the sake of the site and the sake of your own personal financial and legal liability, CITE YOUR PICS!!!!! Guidelines for this

4. Votes - Since this was a source of issue for my predecessor, I will say that I do not desire to delete anyone's votes. If an issue arises and barring changes in laws, I will do my best to ensure that the vote is counted before moderating but I am not the only board moderator here and I may not be able to wait 72 hours plus to act on something. So the first thing you can do is respect the voting booth by not posting anything violating the TOS in there. The second thing we can do is come up with a set of laws that will protect votes from moderator deletion.

5. Court Cases and other General Posting - Again this site has rules, if you don't like them I encourage you to seek they be changed with someone who can change them, and good luck with that by the way.

This is a political game, certain levels of criticism and attack within reasonable amounts and focused primarily on policy, competence and the like are necessary for the game to succeed. However, personal attacks, etc will not be tolerated under any circumstances. When it comes to the transgender players for instance, at the very least as a matter of personal respect, address people the way they request. If you have some moral objection to that, then I would encourage you to use their display name every time you reference them or their office name.

Just like with votes, I don't want to be deleting posts in a court case thread. However again, you can play a role in ensuring that it doesn't come to that. In any RL court room any behavior violating the TOS would lead you to be found in contempt. So to begin with respect the Courts enough to avoid personal attacks etc.

6. Consistency - My objective is to eventually have a process or policy that govens how most all moderator actions on this board are handled, that way if there are questions, concerns or issues that could involve inconsistent moderation, I can point to that list. However I am not yet at a stage where I can compose such accurately though I hope to be able to soon.


This game is driven by disagreement but it also a voluntary participation game that is very dependent on active engagement by members who can leave at any time. It is in our interest to respect others, first as people and then after that as players. The disagreements should be on matters of policy, competence and experience.
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Unconditional Surrender Truman
Harry S Truman
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« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2019, 08:15:55 AM »

Good luck! Being a moderator is by all outward appearances a thankless job, but we'll be rooting for you.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
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« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2019, 08:58:11 AM »

Good luck! Being a moderator is by all outward appearances a thankless job, but we'll be rooting for you.

Yeah, anybody tries to pull "conflict of interests" card, just tell them to f**k themselves and carry on.
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Lumine
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« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2019, 10:59:48 AM »

The Mod is dead. Long live the Mod!
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fhtagn
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« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2019, 02:05:41 PM »

Mod Yankee after big elections:


Image source: Nickelodeon/Rugrats/Klasky Csupo Productions/Nickelodeon Animation Studio
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YE
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« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2019, 02:18:23 PM »

Mod Yankee after big elections:


Image source: Nickelodeon/Rugrats/Klasky Csupo Productions/Nickelodeon Animation Studio

Is that not us after big elections already?
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windjammer
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« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2019, 02:42:36 PM »

Hello Yankee Smiley
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fhtagn
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« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2019, 03:14:36 PM »

Mod Yankee after big elections:


Image source: Nickelodeon/Rugrats/Klasky Csupo Productions/Nickelodeon Animation Studio

Is that not us after big elections already?

Moderating the board during elections (especially if you are an active mod) is probably more exhausting than simply playing the game.
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Sestak
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« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2019, 03:24:31 PM »

I feel like elections themselves are relatively calm on the boards themselves compared to buildup and aftermath though?
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Leinad
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« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2019, 07:08:00 PM »

Congrats on your appointment as Sheriff!

I will not be offended if you delete my personal attacks as long as you are consistent in applying such rules. Also I will not be offended if you censor no-no words I might use and forget to censor myself, although I do prefer you retain at least the first letter so I remember what word I said Tongue

That's about the lengths of my issues with moderation (not counting the banning stuff which is over your head), so that concludes the official statement from the Chairhuman of, uh, the Atlasian Society for Smart, Healthy Oversight with Less Extreme stupidity/fascism/etc., which is a "moderator watchdog group" I created 10 seconds ago in my brain with a naughty acronym founded in the 1940s in reaction to Harry S. Truman (the original one) continually getting his posts deleted without good explanations.
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fhtagn
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« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2019, 07:17:26 PM »

I feel like elections themselves are relatively calm on the boards themselves compared to buildup and aftermath though?
Usually was until some folks got angry over a mod doing their job cause someone violated ToS in their ballot.
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YE
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« Reply #11 on: November 15, 2019, 07:26:05 PM »

I feel like elections themselves are relatively calm on the boards themselves compared to buildup and aftermath though?
Usually was until some folks got angry over a mod doing their job cause someone violated ToS in their ballot.

Tbf that’s literally only happened twice (a ballot being reported and then deleted by a mod) and only once I thought the reaction from AFE board was out of line.
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Adam Griffin
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« Reply #12 on: November 15, 2019, 07:43:21 PM »

Terrible News!
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #13 on: November 16, 2019, 12:32:09 AM »

Mod Yankee after big elections:


Image source: Nickelodeon/Rugrats/Klasky Csupo Productions/Nickelodeon Animation Studio

Is that not us after big elections already?

Wait you guys do tha...?

I mean yes, totally juice and stuff.
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Peanut
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« Reply #14 on: November 16, 2019, 08:47:29 AM »

Best of luck Yankee. We're rooting for you Smiley
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #15 on: November 16, 2019, 10:19:01 AM »

Also I said this on Discord already but we should make sure Yankee can't be sentenced to a criminal case in Atlasia for doing his mod duties. I remember a couple of loopholes that end with Yankee behind bars for doing his job.

Not like I expect him to actually be found prosecuted or sentenced; most likely the AG does nothing or he gets pardoned if someone even dared to bring a case.

Comment from Windjammer and/or Truman would probably help here though, just in case.
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windjammer
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« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2019, 10:15:27 AM »

Also I said this on Discord already but we should make sure Yankee can't be sentenced to a criminal case in Atlasia for doing his mod duties. I remember a couple of loopholes that end with Yankee behind bars for doing his job.

Not like I expect him to actually be found prosecuted or sentenced; most likely the AG does nothing or he gets pardoned if someone even dared to bring a case.

Comment from Windjammer and/or Truman would probably help here though, just in case.
I have never thought about this.
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Unconditional Surrender Truman
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« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2019, 11:53:05 AM »

Also I said this on Discord already but we should make sure Yankee can't be sentenced to a criminal case in Atlasia for doing his mod duties. I remember a couple of loopholes that end with Yankee behind bars for doing his job.

Not like I expect him to actually be found prosecuted or sentenced; most likely the AG does nothing or he gets pardoned if someone even dared to bring a case.

Comment from Windjammer and/or Truman would probably help here though, just in case.
I don't believe the Atlasian government has any authority to prosecute mods for doing their job (any more than the DoJ can indict God IRL). I'd be interested to know what "loopholes" you're referring to.
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Former President tack50
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« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2019, 10:03:44 AM »

Also I said this on Discord already but we should make sure Yankee can't be sentenced to a criminal case in Atlasia for doing his mod duties. I remember a couple of loopholes that end with Yankee behind bars for doing his job.

Not like I expect him to actually be found prosecuted or sentenced; most likely the AG does nothing or he gets pardoned if someone even dared to bring a case.

Comment from Windjammer and/or Truman would probably help here though, just in case.
I don't believe the Atlasian government has any authority to prosecute mods for doing their job (any more than the DoJ can indict God IRL). I'd be interested to know what "loopholes" you're referring to.

The loophole would follow a very specific sequence of events:

1: During a federal election, someone who wants to get Yankee in trouble posts a ballot that clearly breaks the TOS (like ASV's infamous ballot for example) shortly before polls close. The closer to midnight, the better; especially considering Yankee is literally the Fed chairman and will probably be around on election night when polls close. I imagine a 23:59 vote will probably be necessary here.

2: The ballot stands in the forum after polls close.

3: Yankee deletes the ballot to comply with the terms of service.

4: Said poster with a deleted ballot sues Yankee for ballot tampering. Ballot tampering was designed for posters who delete their own votes (back when that was possible), but it technically doesn't specify who does the deletion.

Quote
(g) Ballot Tampering. This offense shall be defined as the deletion of a ballot during a period between vote was closed and elected officeholders sworn-in, soliciting to delete a ballot during the same period or deleting a ballot within the election period after 20 minutes of the vote being cast and re-voting within the election period.

An even better alternative involves a regional governor or elections officer posting a voting booth that clearly breaks the TOS while Yankee is not paying attention. If then Yankee deletes the booth, he could be accused of treason.

Quote
(d) Destruction of a Voting Booth. This shall be defined as the deleting of the thread in which a voting booth or an absentee voting booth for an active election is contained.

Of course, the involved governor or officer would probably be impeached or fired themselves and I doubt any of Peebs / Peanut / Yourself Tongue would do this but still.

Also, editing the ballot / booth instead of removing it would probably shield Yankee but I am still not sure if it would work. I am also not sure of the standards moderators use for editing vs removal of posts and threads.

And of course there is always the possibility of Gustaf (or Virginia / muon if they have the power to do so) doing the moderating in these very niche cases, at the cost of possibly having TOS-breaking posts up for long time.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #19 on: December 01, 2019, 01:08:02 AM »
« Edited: December 01, 2019, 01:14:10 AM by Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee »

Some notes

1. Use of the word lazy. As I have been advised by other moderators, including some who rightly or wrongly have a reputation for being zealous, that the use of the word "lazy" on its own is not an infractable offense as it relates to ones competence or lack thereof in office. This advise pertained to its use against a singular individual so I would certainly say that when applied generally to a group, it is not such either. I have used the word myself to describe "Senators" and "House" members as a group for years, not once was that reported to my knowledge.

2. Policing of content and the truth - Like it or not the truth has to be proven with facts and content has to stand its merits or lack thereof. Policing that is a slippery slope, and the mods are certainly in no position to play referee. Doing so would literally require me being present on every single board, every single discord, every single PM box and inside everyone's mind all day everyday. Now if this were to rise to the level of say spamming a thread or being combined with personal attacks or completely derailing a thread off topic then it would be reasonable to intervene.

3. As far as I am aware, using words like unintelligent, stupid or ignorant is a personal attack.
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Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon
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« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2019, 01:56:00 AM »

Also I said this on Discord already but we should make sure Yankee can't be sentenced to a criminal case in Atlasia for doing his mod duties. I remember a couple of loopholes that end with Yankee behind bars for doing his job.

Not like I expect him to actually be found prosecuted or sentenced; most likely the AG does nothing or he gets pardoned if someone even dared to bring a case.

Comment from Windjammer and/or Truman would probably help here though, just in case.
I don't believe the Atlasian government has any authority to prosecute mods for doing their job (any more than the DoJ can indict God IRL). I'd be interested to know what "loopholes" you're referring to.

From an in game standpoint, the forum as a whole and the moderation team are given no specific mention in the constitution (the TOS isn't mentioned either), therefore in order to give them in game powers or protections, one must grant them such powers in formal law, as we are doing in the new FEA for a hypothetical full game collapse. Of course, the moderators are free to delete whatever they like, but this doesn't exempt them from losing their right to vote as a result, if a court were to rule as such. In order to create such an exemption, we'd need to write a law/constitutional amendment granting one.

Under current law, while we cannot reverse a moderator's post deletion, we can indeed deprive them of their right to vote under the reason that they violated either of the sections of the law Tack Cited, or in the event that we had evidence they acted with definite intent to influence the election, under the section that criminalizes voter fraud.
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Unconditional Surrender Truman
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« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2019, 02:29:52 AM »

As far as federal law is concerned, moderators do not exist, in lieu of a defined statutory relationship with the state: any actions they take with regard to the Fantasy Elections board or its subforums are taken in their capacity as agents of the Modcave (an organ existing outside the scope and realm of Atlasia) and not as citizens of Atlasia. I would therefore interpret the loss of a ballot as a result of moderator action to be an act of God, as if the post containing the ballot disappeared as a result of a software glitch.

In any case, my Justice Department is not going to bring charges against Yankee or anyone else for doing their job.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2019, 02:45:36 AM »

Amazing that after all this time, Truman and I do still have the same thoughts on matters of legality. So much so that I typed up a similar post with the similar points being made only to opt not to post it, and instead composed a Constitutional Amendment stating the same obvious points.

1. TOS and Atlas forum are superior to the Constitution
2. Actions taken by mods are separate and distinct from their actions as Atlasian Citizens
3. Preventing obstruction of moderator enforcement by constitutional or statutory provisions
4. Limiting above mentioned protections to only those action related to actions taken to enforce the TOS.
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The Dowager Mod
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« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2019, 12:28:04 PM »

Well crap, I guess my cunning plan to keep you out of the cave failed.  Sad
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
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« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2020, 04:23:32 PM »

1. The Terms of Service: Like it not, love it or hate it. This forum is a resource that serves a purpose for Dave's business and therefore this site has rules to follow.

Who is this Dave that curious singularity called Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee is touching so incautiously upon? Dave is a word, made out of four letters put in a specific order, but it is also a less than a word, for there are two categories of words. The words of wisdom and the empty orders of letters, meaning no more than if these letters were randomly thrown into the depths of ocean. Four disconsolate letters made out of thin air coming from a coyote's lungs, and meaning only as much as a shadow made out of paper cuts to deceive and confuse our naturally vulnerable eyes. Four disjointed symbols rascals and wretched monster perishers glue together to bend an honest man to their sick and felonious will. This, my good sirs, is what "Dave" and his "business" are all about. Only a man who has opened oneself and received enlightenment can see the shadows being but the shadows and break up the glue holding together D, A, V and E. And once the hold breaks, so breaks the chain squashing the soul.
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