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  Talk Elections
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  United Kingdom General Elections: December 12th, 2019
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Author Topic: United Kingdom General Elections: December 12th, 2019  (Read 86190 times)
Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1725 on: February 17, 2020, 02:20:47 pm »

Rothwell is an oddity for different reasons. There's just no point even in making comparisons. Long ago and far away, a very different Yorkshire:

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DistingFlyer
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« Reply #1726 on: February 17, 2020, 02:25:51 pm »

Rothwell is an oddity for different reasons. There's just no point even in making comparisons. Long ago and far away, a very different Yorkshire:



Yes, a very tricky one to judge indeed.
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CumbrianLeftie
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« Reply #1727 on: February 17, 2020, 03:39:34 pm »

They evidently had "leftovers" seats in those days too Smiley
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EastAnglianLefty
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« Reply #1728 on: February 17, 2020, 04:16:00 pm »

Spennymoor is an odd one because it the area it covered comprises what are, under even halfway 'normal' GE circumstances, the most Labour bits of N.W. Durham, Durham City and Bishop Auckland. Complicating that further is the possibility that the incumbent in the former might have underperformed especially in that part of the constituency (or perhaps in parts of that part) for various reasons involving her own behaviour.

Though the main thing you always note when you look at its boundaries is quite how bad depopulation in the area has been since the 1920s; the idea of those towns forming a constituency together now would be a joke.

What story is this referring to? I wasn't aware she paid enough attention to the constituency to alienate specific parts of it in particular.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1729 on: February 17, 2020, 04:36:25 pm »

What story is this referring to? I wasn't aware she paid enough attention to the constituency to alienate specific parts of it in particular.

The nasty business with the public bullying of Hilary Armstrong over signing the open letter criticising Corbyn over antisemitism. Got a lot of attention locally at least. Those towns on the Wear were the political base of the Armstrong family (she herself was a councillor in Crook once) who remain very well regarded, particularly with people over a certain age; there's a local football trophy named for Ernest, which gives some indication.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1730 on: February 17, 2020, 04:44:56 pm »

[Should probably note that the old Broxtowe constituency is mostly modern-day Ashfield & Sherwood...

One of the biggest parts (Arnold) is actually in what is now Gedling.
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Filuwaúrdjan
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« Reply #1731 on: February 17, 2020, 04:49:14 pm »

Yes, the old Don Valley encompasses most of the current constituency as well as Doncaster North, with Doncaster Central being similar to the old Doncaster seat. As you say, though, this still probably wouldn't make much difference here.

Major difference between the 1918-50 and 1950-83 Don Valley actually; the former did not include Bentley and so on (which were then in Doncaster), while the latter did. So the latter is a clear predecessor of the current Doncaster North (a lot of the current Don Valley was in Goole), but the former isn't that close to any existing constituency.

Related: large parts of the 1918-50 vintage of Rother Valley are in various eastern Sheffield constituencies now.
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CumbrianLeftie
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« Reply #1732 on: February 18, 2020, 08:12:32 am »

Wasn't the old (pre-1983) Goole constituency split between no fewer than four new seats?!

(and all formed a significant part too, no slivers as is sometimes the case)
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MaxQue
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« Reply #1733 on: February 19, 2020, 02:29:14 pm »

To look at things from the opposite view of the earlier list (Tory seats held in opposition but not now), I see that, of the 52 constituencies held by Labour in their big 1931 defeat, 17 are not held by them now:

Broxtowe (now Conservative)
Clay Cross (Conservative)
Don Valley (Conservative)
Dumbarton Burghs (Scottish Nationalist)
Glasgow Bridgeton (Scottish Nationalist)
Glasgow Gorbals (Scottish Nationalist)
Glasgow Govan (Scottish Nationalist)
Glasgow St. Rollox (Scottish Nationalist)
Glasgow Shettleston (Scottish Nationalist)
Hamilton (Scottish Nationalist)
Leigh (Conservative)
Mansfield (Conservative)
Newcastle-under-Lyme (Conservative)
Rother Valley (Conservative)
Rothwell (Conservative)
Spennymoor (Conservative)
Workington (Conservative)

Of these, seven are in Scotland (and now held by the SNP), six in the North of England (now Conservative), and four in the Midlands (also Conservative). Most, but not all, were lost in the last three elections (the Scottish ones in 2015, the rest mostly in 2019).


[Should probably note that the old Broxtowe constituency is mostly modern-day Ashfield & Sherwood, while the new Broxtowe is largely cut from Rushcliffe.]

Of those, places who were Labour non-stop from 1931 to 2019.

Clay Cross: All parts who are in current day Bolsover i.e.:
     Former rural district of Blackwell (all of current Bolsover district south of Bolsover itself)
     Current North East Derbyshire district wards of Holmewood and Heath, Pilsley and Morton, Shirland, and Sutton
Don Valley: All of current Don Valley
Leigh : All of current Leigh (excludes Atherton, which is now in Bolton West)
Newcastle-under-Lyme : All of current Newcastle-under-Lyme (excludes Talke, which is now in Stoke North and was in Leek in 1970)
Rother Valley : All of current Rother Valley
Rothwell : Parts in current Wakefield constituency (Horbury, Crigglestone, West Bretton, Sitlington, Lupset)
Spennymoor : Parts in current North West Durham (Tow Law, Stanley, Hedleyhope, Crook, Howden, Hunwick, Helmington Row and Willington) and Bishop Durham (Spennymoor)


Places which are on the list but voted non-stop Labour since 1931 (including 2019)
Don Valley: parts that are now in Doncaster Central and Doncaster North
       Doncaster North: all the constituency but Adwick and Bentley
       Doncaster Central: Armthorpe, Edenthorpe, Barnby Dun, Kirk Sandall (in other words, all but Doncaster town)
Rother Valley : All of 1931 Rother Valley not in current Rother Valley
       Sheffield South East : Handsworth
       Wentworth and Dearne : Swinton, Hooton Roberts, Thrybergh, Ravenfield, Bramley, Wickersley
       Rotherham : Dalton, Brinsworth, Catcliffe
Rothwell : parts that are now in various constituencies
       Leeds Central : Middleton
       Leeds East : Temple Newsam
       Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford : Warmfield-cum-Heath
       Hemsworth : Sharlston, Crofton, Walton and Chevet
Spennymoor : parts that are in current City of Durham (Brandon and Byshottles, and Brancepeth)
       
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« Reply #1734 on: February 19, 2020, 06:13:04 pm »

What is the longest Labour voting area and vice versa?
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YL
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« Reply #1735 on: February 20, 2020, 03:13:18 pm »


Of constituencies which voted Labour in 1906, I think Ince (now Makerfield), Leeds East (South East in 1931) and West Ham South (Plaistow in 1931, now West Ham) have areas which have been always Labour since.  Also, Chester-le-Street (now North Durham) was Independent Labour in 1906 then Labour in 1910 then Labour.
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Tintrlvr
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« Reply #1736 on: February 20, 2020, 04:52:53 pm »
« Edited: February 20, 2020, 04:58:54 pm by Tintrlvr »


Re: Vice versa, I see what is now Epsom & Ewell consisted of parts of West Surrey and Mid Surrey in the late 1800s. West Surrey voted Tory back to an 1870 by-election where they gained a seat in West Surrey from the Liberals, and Mid Surrey never voted Liberal but was created from East Surrey in 1885, and East Surrey appears to have elected a Liberal in an 1871 by-election who lost in 1874. Cities of London and Westminster goes back pretty far, too: City of London last elected a Liberal in 1880, and Westminster last elected a Liberal in 1868 (who was in office until 1874, so later than the West Surrey by-election referenced above). All of them have been only Conservative since then (other than the Speaker in Cities of London and Westminster in the 1950s). The modern seats of Windsor and Maidenhead also appear to have a Conservative history going back to the same period, electing a Liberal in 1868 who lost in 1874.

There was a major Tory wipe-out in 1906, so if there are others older than the above, it's very few.
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CumbrianLeftie
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« Reply #1737 on: February 21, 2020, 05:54:55 am »


Of constituencies which voted Labour in 1906, I think Ince (now Makerfield), Leeds East (South East in 1931) and West Ham South (Plaistow in 1931, now West Ham) have areas which have been always Labour since.  Also, Chester-le-Street (now North Durham) was Independent Labour in 1906 then Labour in 1910 then Labour.

Didn't WHS also vote Labour/Lib-Lab before then, so can be said to hold the "record"?
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EastAnglianLefty
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« Reply #1738 on: February 21, 2020, 06:38:07 am »

It was Conservative-held from 1895-1906.
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CumbrianLeftie
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« Reply #1739 on: February 21, 2020, 06:56:34 am »

Yes, but Keir Hardie won it as Lib-Lab in 1892 - which is what I was thinking of.

Do any of the other areas listed have a similar history?
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EastAnglianLefty
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« Reply #1740 on: February 21, 2020, 07:26:50 am »

Ince was Lib-Lab 1892-1895. Merthyr was won by the LRC in 1900, but both the successor constituencies were won by coupon candidates in 1918 and you've also got S. O. Davies to factor in.
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CumbrianLeftie
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« Reply #1741 on: February 21, 2020, 07:41:19 am »

So I suppose the areas formerly in Ince and WHS are the joint "winners"?
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EastAnglianLefty
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« Reply #1742 on: February 21, 2020, 08:55:05 am »

If you're including Lib-Lab candidates, then the winner would be Rhondda. Lib-Lab 1874-1918, always been Labour since.
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