Justice PiT should resign

[fhtagn]

It should be surprising the extent to which people are ignoring that a member of the Supreme Court believes women's bodies should be controlled by men for the passing on of genes. That's a disgusting thing to believe, and I wish anybody would address it like Secretary Peebs has.

All he's saying is that men should be able to procreate with women and then make the decision not to have an abortion. Did he word that terribly yes, but that's all he's saying and it's a view that other people have to. In fact I know several women who believe that.

Thank you for actually addressing the issue, unlike many of our colleagues. I believe his message speaks for itself, and he said "we men need to control reproductive access to one or more females to pass on our genes." That has nothing to do with responsible family planning, that's called a concubine.

You are literally basing what you think he meant on out of context screenshots that were very clearly selectively cropped.

[Associate Justice PiT]

It should be surprising the extent to which people are ignoring that a member of the Supreme Court believes women's bodies should be controlled by men for the passing on of genes. That's a disgusting thing to believe, and I wish anybody would address it like Secretary Peebs has.

All he's saying is that men should be able to procreate with women and then make the decision not to have an abortion. Did he word that terribly yes, but that's all he's saying and it's a view that other people have to. In fact I know several women who believe that.

     I was actually speaking to the importance of paternal certainty. There is a reason why monogamy and fidelity is important and polyamory is a patently unworkable system. The major problem that the left faces today is that they have devalued the biological final cause of the organism, that is, reproduction. Monogamy has evolved as a reproductive strategy for the reason that it works towards achieving that final cause.

     What I said about controlling access is nothing that you wouldn't hear in the Biological Anthropology course at UC Berkeley. The left claims to be pro-science, and then they freak out when you voice scientific consensus. I suppose people have to get outraged over non-issues these days.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I invite Representatives Fhtagn and Reagan Clinton, as well as Senators North Carolina Yankee and Coastal Elitist, to join me in calling for the resignation of every single member of the Supreme Court who believes women should be controlled by men for purposes of reproduction.

If you are uncomfortable with the only conservative on the Court losing his position, I would join you in encouraging Governor Leinad to appoint a replacement we can all agree on. A man with PiT's beliefs about women has no place in polite society, much less on our Supreme Court.

I am somewhat biased on this because PiT recruited me into the game and I have known him for ten years. Therefore, since he did so for me when the shoe was on the other foot ten years ago (when I was very angry and dumb), I would be inclined to prefer he apologize and be given a second chance.

[Pragmatic Conservative]

Former Governor AZ, I will join you in supporting a unity-type candidate for Supreme Court to replace PiT. I truly just want to remove a Supreme Court Justice who believes that women's bodies should be his property. That is the issue here. The partisan makeup of the Supreme Court should not trump the morality of beliefs like that.

Sorry but it’s hard for me to take these types of petitions seriously especially when the left has proven they will stop at nothing for more power. PiT clarified his remarks and it seems clear he didn’t mean anything offensive by them. 

[The Dowager Mod]

I know i'm not exactly relevant around here anymore, But i was chief justice and i'm a woman that being said, I don't think PiT should resign just for for having an opinion some don't agree with.

[Devout Centrist]

This is a very difficult topic for me to discuss. In the past, I looked up to Justice PiT as a example of leadership and thoughtful deliberation. I was not a member of the Labor Party back then; indeed, I voted for Federalists a good deal of the time. But even as my political views changed, my respect and admiration for PiT continued.

Even when his political views shifted further right, we managed to have frank discussions on a variety of topics. I fondly remember talking about the housing crisis in the Bay Area with him, as we both had personal experience with the region and with the issue.

These comments are shocking, not in the least of which because they indict an entire system of beliefs as a 'suicide cult', but because the PiT of two or three years ago would be appalled at someone who made these remarks. They are the product of a political environment that has rotted the brains of all of us, but this cannot excuse the rash nature of these comments nor the vitriol they contain.

I would be a lot more willing to forgive and forget had PiT lashed out at individuals within Atlasia. We have all been frustrated with people in the game before, and such sentiment is understandable. But this pattern of unacceptable remarks is simply far worse than that, and I cannot in good faith ignore them.

I hope that PiT can take a break from the online world, which has corrupted and distorted political dialogue into a twisted caricature of the real world. These sort of comments are not indicative of a healthy relationship with politics.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I know i'm not exactly relevant around here anymore,

You are more than welcome to change that anytime.

[Yellowhammer]

I invite Representatives Fhtagn and Reagan Clinton, as well as Senators North Carolina Yankee and Coastal Elitist, to join me in calling for the resignation of every single member of the Supreme Court who believes women should be controlled by men for purposes of reproduction.

If you are uncomfortable with the only conservative on the Court losing his position, I would join you in encouraging Governor Leinad to appoint a replacement we can all agree on. A man with PiT's beliefs about women has no place in polite society, much less on our Supreme Court.

I am somewhat biased on this because PiT recruited me into the game and I have known him for ten years. Therefore, since he did so for me when the shoe was on the other foot ten years ago (when I was very angry and dumb), I would be inclined to prefer he apologize and be given a second chance.

PiT did nothing to apologize for. Every human being is entitled to his or her private beliefs. Maybe the leaker should apologize and deregister?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I invite Representatives Fhtagn and Reagan Clinton, as well as Senators North Carolina Yankee and Coastal Elitist, to join me in calling for the resignation of every single member of the Supreme Court who believes women should be controlled by men for purposes of reproduction.

If you are uncomfortable with the only conservative on the Court losing his position, I would join you in encouraging Governor Leinad to appoint a replacement we can all agree on. A man with PiT's beliefs about women has no place in polite society, much less on our Supreme Court.

I am somewhat biased on this because PiT recruited me into the game and I have known him for ten years. Therefore, since he did so for me when the shoe was on the other foot ten years ago (when I was very angry and dumb), I would be inclined to prefer he apologize and be given a second chance.

PiT did nothing to apologize for. Every human being is entitled to his or her private beliefs. Maybe the leaker should apologize and deregister?

He is entitle to his own opinions, but a justice would be held to a higher standard. At the very least he could have worded his pro-life views better.

[JGibson]

x JGibson

[Former President tack50]

     I was actually speaking to the importance of paternal certainty. There is a reason why monogamy and fidelity is important and polyamory is a patently unworkable system. The major problem that the left faces today is that they have devalued the biological final cause of the organism, that is, reproduction. Monogamy has evolved as a reproductive strategy for the reason that it works towards achieving that final cause.

     What I said about controlling access is nothing that you wouldn't hear in the Biological Anthropology course at UC Berkeley. The left claims to be pro-science, and then they freak out when you voice scientific consensus. I suppose people have to get outraged over non-issues these days.

Yes indeed some of that is anthropology, albeit in very badly worded terms. I am most definitely not a believer in polyamory. However, the screenshot combined with this makes me think that in your view the world should ideally return to the social circumstances of the 1940s, at least in terms of marriages, relationships and families.

And in the end, that is a position that would go against the individual liberties of men and women. Going with a very simple example, I think most people would agree that cheating on one's significant other is an immoral offence. But it is not something that should be prosecuted or controlled in any way.

Also, that explanation does nothing for me at least with regards to the second screenshot. It is very reminiscent of similar statements by Yellowhammer in another thread. As you may or may not know, the place I live in RL has a centre-left government. Up and down the ballot; from my local mayor to the prime minister.

Do I live in a place ran by a suicide cult? Is society going to be torn apart until my own home town is reduced to a pile of rubble? Why on Earth should I start plans to flee somewhere unspecified? Those are at the very least very hyperbolic statements.

You are literally basing what you think he meant on out of context screenshots that were very clearly selectively cropped.

If you believe the screenshots are out of context and selectively cropped, could you illuminate us their full context through more screenshots or some sort of transcript then?

[windjammer]

Seriously, I oppose this effort.
These comments are extremely weird to say the least and inappropriate but this has nothing to with his job as Supreme Court Justice.

Pit is actually a very active, fair Supreme Court Justice, he has worked well with all his other colleagues and I stand by my action of having recommended him for this job last year (or two years ago I don't remember)

[Yellowhammer]

I invite Representatives Fhtagn and Reagan Clinton, as well as Senators North Carolina Yankee and Coastal Elitist, to join me in calling for the resignation of every single member of the Supreme Court who believes women should be controlled by men for purposes of reproduction.

If you are uncomfortable with the only conservative on the Court losing his position, I would join you in encouraging Governor Leinad to appoint a replacement we can all agree on. A man with PiT's beliefs about women has no place in polite society, much less on our Supreme Court.

I am somewhat biased on this because PiT recruited me into the game and I have known him for ten years. Therefore, since he did so for me when the shoe was on the other foot ten years ago (when I was very angry and dumb), I would be inclined to prefer he apologize and be given a second chance.

PiT did nothing to apologize for. Every human being is entitled to his or her private beliefs. Maybe the leaker should apologize and deregister?

He is entitle to his own opinions, but a justice would be held to a higher standard. At the very least he could have worded his pro-life views better.

His opinion was worded badly, but if the sentiment behind it is what I think it is, then he merely stated privately an concept that humans, as well as many members of the animal kingdom, have operated by for all of their existence.
The idea is that most males want to have paternal certainty, and that males instinctively want to deny sexual advances from other males directed towards their partner. Males want to guarantee that their genes will be passed on. This really has only become "controversial" in western society in the last decade or so.
PiT can correct me if I have misrepresented the sentiments behind the statement in question.

And besides that, people should never have to apologize publicly for things said in leaked private conversations, which were never the public's business to know about.

[fhtagn]

You are literally basing what you think he meant on out of context screenshots that were very clearly selectively cropped.

If you believe the screenshots are out of context and selectively cropped, could you illuminate us their full context through more screenshots or some sort of transcript then?

You can literally see from the post where they came from that the screenshots were clearly selectively cropped. Someone doesn't have to be very smart to be able to notice that.

I'm no longer in the server, and even if I was, I wouldn't be willing to entertain the suggestions of people who clearly don't care even if they did have the full transcript.

I'd also like to point out, notice how most of the people who complained about this are men. You already have someone on this thread who is on the left, has served in the court (and most notably, as Chief Justice), and is a woman who has weighed in on this and has stated she doesn't think PiT should resign. Most people with sense will take that expert opinion over the opinion of someone who doesn't even adequately participate in the office he has been elected to.

(As I was posting this, the current Chief Justice has posted that he opposes what is going on in this thread).

[fhtagn]

These posts having been made, I think it's best that everyone signing this sits down and stops being so emotional over such a stupid "controversy", especially the OP. 

I know i'm not exactly relevant around here anymore, But i was chief justice and i'm a woman that being said, I don't think PiT should resign just for for having an opinion some don't agree with.

Seriously, I oppose this effort.
These comments are extremely weird to say the least and inappropriate but this has nothing to with his job as Supreme Court Justice.

Pit is actually a very active, fair Supreme Court Justice, he has worked well with all his other colleagues and I stand by my action of having recommended him for this job last year (or two years ago I don't remember)

[Terry the Fat Shark]

I do think this might be spiraling a bit out of control, it was really funny to see the right squirm for once for a few days, but we might be taking things a bit too far now

[Associate Justice PiT]

     I was actually speaking to the importance of paternal certainty. There is a reason why monogamy and fidelity is important and polyamory is a patently unworkable system. The major problem that the left faces today is that they have devalued the biological final cause of the organism, that is, reproduction. Monogamy has evolved as a reproductive strategy for the reason that it works towards achieving that final cause.

     What I said about controlling access is nothing that you wouldn't hear in the Biological Anthropology course at UC Berkeley. The left claims to be pro-science, and then they freak out when you voice scientific consensus. I suppose people have to get outraged over non-issues these days.

Yes indeed some of that is anthropology, albeit in very badly worded terms. I am most definitely not a believer in polyamory. However, the screenshot combined with this makes me think that in your view the world should ideally return to the social circumstances of the 1940s, at least in terms of marriages, relationships and families.

And in the end, that is a position that would go against the individual liberties of men and women. Going with a very simple example, I think most people would agree that cheating on one's significant other is an immoral offence. But it is not something that should be prosecuted or controlled in any way.

Also, that explanation does nothing for me at least with regards to the second screenshot. It is very reminiscent of similar statements by Yellowhammer in another thread. As you may or may not know, the place I live in RL has a centre-left government. Up and down the ballot; from my local mayor to the prime minister.

Do I live in a place ran by a suicide cult? Is society going to be torn apart until my own home town is reduced to a pile of rubble? Why on Earth should I start plans to flee somewhere unspecified? Those are at the very least very hyperbolic statements.

     I think that society would be better if monogamous, exclusive marriage was once again the standard family unit that was upheld as the ideal, so in that sense maybe it would be good to be like the 1940s. But I also understand that men were allowed broad latitude to abuse their wives and children, and that is clearly not acceptable. My mother was frequently beaten by her father growing up, and it grieves me greatly that nobody did anything about it because that was considered his right. In that sense I am happy that time is gone and I hope it never returns.

     I don't know about the government where you live, but I am speaking to a particular brand of progressivism that is gradually gaining traction in popular culture and academia. The second screenshot was related to the first, wherein I decry that these progressives are trying to push polyamory as a preferable way of doing things, even though it by its nature tends to interfere with evolved human modes of reproduction. I was hyperbolic by saying "the left is basically a suicide cult", and if there is one thing I will apologize for in all of this it is being histrionic about that.

     Anyway, I will post some context so people will see what I was talking about here:





     My rant there was prompted by this:



     I hope this clears things up.

[YE]

Thanks for the clarification, Pit.

Can we avoid being like the RL Dems and getting carried away with stuff like this? We’ve been good at this for a while let’s not blow it now.

[Former President tack50]

     I was actually speaking to the importance of paternal certainty. There is a reason why monogamy and fidelity is important and polyamory is a patently unworkable system. The major problem that the left faces today is that they have devalued the biological final cause of the organism, that is, reproduction. Monogamy has evolved as a reproductive strategy for the reason that it works towards achieving that final cause.

     What I said about controlling access is nothing that you wouldn't hear in the Biological Anthropology course at UC Berkeley. The left claims to be pro-science, and then they freak out when you voice scientific consensus. I suppose people have to get outraged over non-issues these days.

Yes indeed some of that is anthropology, albeit in very badly worded terms. I am most definitely not a believer in polyamory. However, the screenshot combined with this makes me think that in your view the world should ideally return to the social circumstances of the 1940s, at least in terms of marriages, relationships and families.

And in the end, that is a position that would go against the individual liberties of men and women. Going with a very simple example, I think most people would agree that cheating on one's significant other is an immoral offence. But it is not something that should be prosecuted or controlled in any way.

Also, that explanation does nothing for me at least with regards to the second screenshot. It is very reminiscent of similar statements by Yellowhammer in another thread. As you may or may not know, the place I live in RL has a centre-left government. Up and down the ballot; from my local mayor to the prime minister.

Do I live in a place ran by a suicide cult? Is society going to be torn apart until my own home town is reduced to a pile of rubble? Why on Earth should I start plans to flee somewhere unspecified? Those are at the very least very hyperbolic statements.

     I think that society would be better if monogamous, exclusive marriage was once again the standard family unit that was upheld as the ideal, so in that sense maybe it would be good to be like the 1940s. But I also understand that men were allowed broad latitude to abuse their wives and children, and that is clearly not acceptable. My mother was frequently beaten by her father growing up, and it grieves me greatly that nobody did anything about it because that was considered his right. In that sense I am happy that time is gone and I hope it never returns.

     I don't know about the government where you live, but I am speaking to a particular brand of progressivism that is gradually gaining traction in popular culture and academia. The second screenshot was related to the first, wherein I decry that these progressives are trying to push polyamory as a preferable way of doing things, even though it by its nature tends to interfere with evolved human modes of reproduction. I was hyperbolic by saying "the left is basically a suicide cult", and if there is one thing I will apologize for in all of this it is being histrionic about that.

     Anyway, I will post some context so people will see what I was talking about here:

(Pictures)

     I hope this clears things up.

Yes it does clear things up a lot. As others said, people got carried away so I guess it's time to close this and move forward.

[Attorney General & PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Every judge brings their own views, opinions, style, and experience into their decisions - if they didn't, there would never be a dissent. Many cases are not easily decidable by "reading the text" or "applying the precedent" due to ambiguous or situation dependent text. Anyone who is suggesting PiT's personal views are irrelevant to his fitness for the job is just being silly.

Further, Judges should be held to a higher standard, which should include not referring to political movements as suicide cults, regardless of specifics and context. However, I do accept PiT's apology on that point, and considering the expressed views of the leftist chief justice, I withdraw my support for PiT's resignation.  That being said, I would encourage his court colleagues to reprimand him internally and ensure there is not a repeat occurrence of such "suicide cult" language.

[DeSantis4Prez]

As a citzien of Atlasia, I feel Justice PiT should not resign. There has been no evidence of him using his position as a Justice to promote his personal views.

[afleitch]

Ugh.

[You don't see any blue avatars now]

Guess I'll withdraw my signature too.

[Blair]

I find it incredibly curious that the left wants PiT to resign that they have the ability to appoint one of their own as SC justice and thus have the ability to stack the deck in favour of their ideology and party. This is nothing but a partisan coup designed to give leftists more power.

As for the comments themselves it seems clear that the left is not interested in diversity of opinion. While surface level diversity is welcome diversity of thought and speech is stifled. Once again we see an attempt to bully and marginalize pro lifers. Many in this game on the left just want more power and more control to the point where you “own the cons”.  I ask Atlasians to see what this is and stand up for Justice PiT who deserves to remain on the SC bench.

This is a slur on the integrity of the court; I’ve sat across the table from Windjammer (the ex chair of my own party) and disagreed and ruled in different ways on an issue relating to Labor. The idea that the left is further stacking the court implies it was stacked for party political grounds; which it never was.

[Terry the Fat Shark]

I don't think PiT meant women are for men to control and have babies with, it seems to be an instance of awkward wording, at least that is what I am hoping and giving the benefit of the doubt on.