UK General Discussion: 2019. Blackadder goes Brexit.

[cp]

Not in the UK...

In Germany that is the only way we call snap elections.

Leaving Europe now apparently includes bringing German customs and politics to Britain...

Anyway it didn't work out too well for Schröder when he pulled this stunt as the opponent he hoped to beat in that snap election has been the chancellor for 14 years, but I'm sure mastermind BoJo will be more successful.

I doubt even BoJo could cause Corbyn to stay in power that long.

Lol. Corbyn would be 84 after 14 years. Not sure even the most diehard fans would want to see him in office after that long.

[Silent Hunter]

Lords has passed Benn's bill without amendment, meaning it goes straight for Royal Assent. Prorogation has officially backfired.

[Omega21]

Lords has passed Benn's bill without amendment, meaning it goes straight for Royal Assent. Prorogation has officially backfired.

Do you think Boris will pull a Blair move now? (i.e. advising the Queen not to give assent)

[Silent Hunter]

Not without triggering an even bigger constitutional crisis... the bill was ruled not to require Queen's Consent and Royal Assent hasn't been refused since Queen Anne was on the throne.

[Omega21]

Not without triggering an even bigger constitutional crisis... the bill was ruled not to require Queen's Consent and Royal Assent hasn't been refused since Queen Anne was on the throne.

Yeah, I figured as much, I doubt the Queen would even follow his advice anyway.

Well, the best he can hope for is a no-confidence vote, on himself lol

[Hnv1]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

They can have a backbencher put it forward

[Silent Hunter]

Girly swot?!

[Tintrlvr]

Girly swot?!

Are we surprised that this is the way he thinks?

Although tbh I recall some Labourites making comparable statements in the 2009-2010 era.

[AndyHogan14]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

Do they even have a majority for this? It seems to me that the Conservative Party + the DUP do not have a majority in parliament and if the opposition parties really wanted to, they could vote against the no confidence resolution and deny a majority for that as well. I think it is pretty clear that there is no way Johnson is getting an extension without an extension to Article 50.

[DaWN]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

Do they even have a majority for this? It seems to me that the Conservative Party + the DUP do not have a majority in parliament and if the opposition parties really wanted to, they could vote against the no confidence resolution and deny a majority for that as well. I think it is pretty clear that there is no way Johnson is getting an extension without an extension to Article 50.

It would be the absolute most Brexit-era British politics thing to happen if the government voted against itself and the opposition voted for it in a motion of no confidence.

[AndyHogan14]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

Do they even have a majority for this? It seems to me that the Conservative Party + the DUP do not have a majority in parliament and if the opposition parties really wanted to, they could vote against the no confidence resolution and deny a majority for that as well. I think it is pretty clear that there is no way Johnson is getting an extension without an extension to Article 50.

It would be the absolute most Brexit-era British politics thing to happen if the government voted against itself and the opposition voted for it in a motion of no confidence.

The world has indeed been turned upside down.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Not without triggering an even bigger constitutional crisis... the bill was ruled not to require Queen's Consent and Royal Assent hasn't been refused since Queen Anne was on the throne.

Yeah, I figured as much, I doubt the Queen would even follow his advice anyway.

Well, the best he can hope for is a no-confidence vote, on himself lol

Here's an idea: if BoJo disregards the constitutional convention, the parliament should to the same by passing a bill of attainder and be done with him, in a very literal sense.

[CumbrianLefty]

Girly swot?!

Are we surprised that this is the way he thinks?

Although tbh I recall some Labourites making comparable statements in the 2009-2010 era.

I don't, do you have any actual sources?

[Tintrlvr]

Girly swot?!

Are we surprised that this is the way he thinks?

Although tbh I recall some Labourites making comparable statements in the 2009-2010 era.

I don't, do you have any actual sources?

To be clear, I didn't mean politicians specifically (nor to make a "both sides do it" comment), just that Cameron being called "girly" or equivalents is not something new, including from the left/Labour supporters on occasion. The following is from a left-wing journalist in 2012, a description of him as having an "overdeveloped feminine side", for example:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/sep/09/catherine-bennett-david-cameron-women

Also a funny one (not from a British figure):

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/8064541/Arnold-Schwarzenegger-tells-David-Cameron-Dont-be-an-economic-girlyman.html

This is a quick Google search; turning up old articles about off-hand comments that weren't really considered controversial at the time is difficult, of course.

[CumbrianLefty]

Catherine Bennett is "left wing", you say. Hmmm.......

(her recent partner - a certain John Humphrys - would certainly struggle to be described as such)

[Tintrlvr]

Catherine Bennett is "left wing", you say. Hmmm.......

(her recent partner - a certain John Humphrys - would certainly struggle to be described as such)

Perhaps one shouldn't be judged by their choice of partners - but read through this series of bylines and tell me she's not a left-winger.

https://www.theguardian.com/profile/catherinebennett

Anyway, stupid argument. Unacceptable attitude for Johnson. He's the only one talking about David Cameron in 2019 regardless. And, while Cameron was certainly criticized in the past for being "girly" also by some political opponents, that doesn't make criticism today by other political opponents better.

[Antonio the Sixth]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

There is nothing they won't pull to cause more dither and delay until the 31st of October so they can leave with their prized no deal

The opposition should pull a Di Maio/Zingaretti and take the opportunity to put forward their own government. It would of course only be a temporary and precarious arrangement, but it would allow the UK to get an extension from the EU and then hold an election that isn't on BoJo's terms.

[OSR stands with Israel]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

There is nothing they won't pull to cause more dither and delay until the 31st of October so they can leave with their prized no deal

The opposition should pull a Di Maio/Zingaretti and take the opportunity to put forward their own government. It would of course only be a temporary and precarious arrangement, but it would allow the UK to get an extension from the EU and then hold an election that isn't on BoJo's terms.

no would they opposition agree to making Jeremy Corbyn PM. If the opposition doesnt want Johnson  to actually have the power to lead the nation through brexit then they should pass a motion of no confidence and  if they win the election they will still have time to call for an extension.

[Middle-aged Europe]

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Like the Black Rod he has the door slammed in his face by the Commissioners and must kiss the handle three times before they let him in.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913

Is there any precedent for this?

There is nothing they won't pull to cause more dither and delay until the 31st of October so they can leave with their prized no deal

The opposition should pull a Di Maio/Zingaretti and take the opportunity to put forward their own government. It would of course only be a temporary and precarious arrangement, but it would allow the UK to get an extension from the EU and then hold an election that isn't on BoJo's terms.

no would they opposition agree to making Jeremy Corbyn PM. If the opposition doesnt want Johnson  to actually have the power to lead the nation through brexit then they should pass a motion of no confidence and  if they win the election they will still have time to call for an extension.

Thankfully, there are MPs other than Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn.

[GeorgiaModerate]

https://twitter.com/MattGarrahan/status/1169720609095462913
Is there any precedent for this?

There is nothing they won't pull to cause more dither and delay until the 31st of October so they can leave with their prized no deal

The opposition should pull a Di Maio/Zingaretti and take the opportunity to put forward their own government. It would of course only be a temporary and precarious arrangement, but it would allow the UK to get an extension from the EU and then hold an election that isn't on BoJo's terms.

no would they opposition agree to making Jeremy Corbyn PM. If the opposition doesnt want Johnson  to actually have the power to lead the nation through brexit then they should pass a motion of no confidence and  if they win the election they will still have time to call for an extension.

Thankfully, there are MPs other than Boris Johnson and Jeremy Corbyn.

Based on most American coverage of UK politics, this isn't at all obvious.

[Antonio the Sixth]

if they win the election they will still have time to call for an extension.

Except they won't. It's logistically and legally impossible to hold an election and have the new parliament convene before Oct 31.

And as Nathan said, the PM of such a caretaker government wouldn't be Corbyn. I don't understand why he'd even want to Ramsay McDonald himself into such a position.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Boris is broken. | We have an opportunity
To bring down Boris, | to break Boris,
And to bring down Brexit | --and we must take that.

Worthy of W.H. Auden tbh.

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

if they win the election they will still have time to call for an extension.

Except they won't. It's logistically and legally impossible to hold an election and have the new parliament convene before Oct 31.

And as Nathan said, the PM of such a caretaker government wouldn't be Corbyn. I don't understand why he'd even want to Ramsay McDonald himself into such a position.

Would Kenneth Clarke be the most likely caretaker PM?