AOC says migrants forced to drink toilet water after tense border visit

[GeorgiaModerate]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

[Progressive Pessimist]

Well shucks, one small detail may have been found to be contradictory. I guess that makes these facilities the equivalent of the Four Seasons now!

[Co-Chair Bagel23]

Well shucks, one small detail may have been found to be contradictory. I guess that makes these facilities the equivalent of the Four Seasons now!

It’s not and it should not be.

[NOVA Green]

Apparently someone else experienced different conditions: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/immigration-border-facility-aoc-hispanic

“We found no soiled diapers, no deplorable conditions and no lack of basic necessities,” Rodriguez remarked, adding he specifically asked border agents if they staged the facility in response to the negative press. “They unequivocally denied it — we were witnessing the identical conditions the attorneys saw when they toured the facility days earlier."

In fact, some told him the sources from whom the negative coverage originated “never toured the areas of the facility that we toured” and speculated they might have had political motivations.

Fox News called up the facility: "Hey guys, can we send some blindly faithful Republican pastors to you in a day or two to say the Democrats are liars, and can you clean the place up real good between now and then? We can own the libs while you get the media off your back. Win win."

All the liberal representatives from the first trip collectively lied as a political conspiracy? Some of these women are Bernie progressives, not Republican swamp monsters. They actually have integrity. This conspiracy theory is laughable and sad.

Nowhere does it say that they are Republicans. Also this is a pastor who's battled with Trump over immigration. He also advised Obama on immigration reform.

“I read the reports, saw the news clips. I just wanted to see what was actually happening in order to better enable our efforts to find a fair and a just solution to our broken immigration system," Rodriguez, who has advised President Trump and both Presidents Barack Obama and George W. Bush on immigration reform, noted. “To my surprise, I saw something drastically different from the stories I’ve been hearing in our national discourse. Even as a veteran of immigration advocacy in the U.S., I was shocked at the misinformation of the crisis at the border."

The pastors left encouraged by the commitment and dedication of America’s Border Patrol and immigration officers, “many of which are Latinos, by the way.” He said one emotional Border Patrol agent turned to him and said, referring to the vilification: “Pastor Sam, what they’re saying about us is completely false. We care about these kids and have a passion for our calling.”

Pastor Carlos Moran, NHCLC board member and immigrant, said, “we, as evangelical leaders that serve in different segments, are very committed to helping children regardless of their status and we commend those officers that are trying their very best to serve and fulfill their duty at the border. However, we do call on our political leaders to set aside their personal agendas and begin focusing on resolving this immigration crisis.”

“What's heart-wrenching is that we have both Republicans and Democrats alike in Congress, who can't come together for the purpose of doing the right thing and finding a solution to our immigration crisis,” he said. “Please, President Trump, please White House, work with the Republicans and the Democrats [and] please, please, please, please, Nancy Pelosi, Kevin McCarthy, Mitch McConnell, Chuck Schumer, please come together to solve this crisis, immediately.”

Also it's hilarious that you think any current politician has integrity.

Bolded relevant quote:

Yes it is absolutely correct that many of the Border Patrol Officers on the Rio Grande border are Latino and not necessarily huge fans of what they see in these "detention facilities".

Decent paying jobs are hard to find in South Tejas border areas, let alone Federal Union jobs with all of the attendant perks when it comes to Federal retirement benefits and the like.

We are not talking about a privatized prison in Texas, and the vast majority of those working at these facilities are not racist KKK members, let alone sadists that deliberately torture and hurt others.

We are talking about a workforce that is heavily Mexican-American, many of whom with US Military service records, largely Catholic frequently drawn from local communities with deep roots in the Rio Grande Valley when the "Borderlands" was simply a place where families would visit each other on both sides of the border without any walls or passport controls.

This is a *political crisis* caused by decades of US Foreign Policy decisions in Central America by Democratic and Republican political leaders alike, combined with slashing funding for asylum seekers starting under Reagan.

It is no wonder that the Faith based community, including many evangelicals are starting to speak up on this issue..... Evangelical Protestant missionary activity in Central America has shifted the composition of Central American immigration to the US, where now some of highest % of Protestant immigrants from the countries where the "push-pull" factor is most evident.

Why do people leave their native land and family network?      (Push)

Why do people choose to seek a better opportunity?                (Pull)

Obviously one must ask the question as to why US Immigration quotas are still set by Country, rather than by the status of the asylum seeker's case?

In Cold War Policy, there were only a handful of "asylum seekers" allowed from Salvador / Guatemala, and Honduras (Fascist strong-men Juntas) vs many more from countries such as Cuba / Nicaragua  (Fleeing Communist oppression!).

I don't blame the workers involved.... most of whom are likely trying to do the best job they can with limited resources that still have to go home to their family when they got off-shift and talk to their spouse and kids and answer the question: "Daddy how was work today?"

I blame a broken system, and these types of topics remind me of some 30-35 Years ago when the Central American Solidarity Movement was at it's peak....

My 3rd Generation Grandparents on my Fathers side would turn over in their grave watching stories like this treatment of immigrants leaving the "Old Country" from humble means to seek opportunity in America....

Here is a snippet from one of my favorite bands The Pogues---- Song "Thousands Are Sailing", which I own multiple versions of.....

The island, it is silent now
But the ghosts still haunt the waves
And the torch lights up a famished man
Who fortune could not save
Did you work upon the railroads?
Did you rid the streets of crime?
Were your dollars from the White House?
Were they from the five and dime?
Did the old songs taunt or cheer you
And did they still make you cry?
Did you count the months and years
Or did your teardrops quickly dry?
Ah, no, says he, 'twas not to be
On a coffin ship, I came here
And I never even got so far
That they could change my name
Thousands are sailing
Across the western ocean
To a land of opportunity
That some of them will never see
Fortune prevailing
Across the western ocean
Their bellies full, their spirits free
They'll break the chains of poverty

[Badger]

Apparently someone else experienced different conditions: https://www.foxnews.com/politics/immigration-border-facility-aoc-hispanic

“We found no soiled diapers, no deplorable conditions and no lack of basic necessities,” Rodriguez remarked, adding he specifically asked border agents if they staged the facility in response to the negative press. “They unequivocally denied it — we were witnessing the identical conditions the attorneys saw when they toured the facility days earlier."

In fact, some told him the sources from whom the negative coverage originated “never toured the areas of the facility that we toured” and speculated they might have had political motivations.

Fox News called up the facility: "Hey guys, can we send some blindly faithful Republican pastors to you in a day or two to say the Democrats are liars, and can you clean the place up real good between now and then? We can own the libs while you get the media off your back. Win win."

All the liberal representatives from the first trip collectively lied as a political conspiracy? Some of these women are Bernie progressives, not Republican swamp monsters. They actually have integrity. This conspiracy theory is laughable and sad.

Nowhere does it say that they are Republicans. Also this is a pastor who's battled with Trump over immigration. He also advised Obama on immigration reform.

“I read the reports, saw the news clips. I just wanted to see what was actually happening in order to better enable our efforts to find a fair and a just solution to our broken immigration system," Rodriguez, who has advised President Trump and both Presidents Barack Obama and George W. Bush on immigration reform, noted. “To my surprise, I saw something drastically different from the stories I’ve been hearing in our national discourse. Even as a veteran of immigration advocacy in the U.S., I was shocked at the misinformation of the crisis at the border."

The pastors left encouraged by the commitment and dedication of America’s Border Patrol and immigration officers, “many of which are Latinos, by the way.” He said one emotional Border Patrol agent turned to him and said, referring to the vilification: “Pastor Sam, what they’re saying about us is completely false. We care about these kids and have a passion for our calling.”

Pastor Carlos Moran, NHCLC board member and immigrant, said, “we, as evangelical leaders that serve in different segments, are very committed to helping children regardless of their status and we commend those officers that are trying their very best to serve and fulfill their duty at the border. However, we do call on our political leaders to set aside their personal agendas and begin focusing on resolving this immigration crisis.”

“What's heart-wrenching is that we have both Republicans and Democrats alike in Congress, who can't come together for the purpose of doing the right thing and finding a solution to our immigration crisis,” he said. “Please, President Trump, please White House, work with the Republicans and the Democrats [and] please, please, please, please, Nancy Pelosi, Kevin McCarthy, Mitch McConnell, Chuck Schumer, please come together to solve this crisis, immediately.”

Also it's hilarious that you think any current politician has integrity.

Even Fox News, deep deep buried past its bylines, advise that these pastors were advisers to former President W bush and to president Trump.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

What a Pediatrician Saw Inside a Border Patrol Warehouse

MCALLEN, Texas—Inside the Border Patrol warehouse on Ursula Avenue, Dolly Lucio Sevier saw a baby who’d been fed from the same unwashed bottle for days; children showing signs of malnutrition and dehydration; and several kids who, in her medical opinion, were exhibiting clear evidence of psychological trauma. More than 1,000 migrant children sat in the detention facility here, and Sevier, a local pediatrician, had been examining as many as she could, one at a time. But she wasn’t permitted to enter the area where they were being held, many of them in cages, and find the sickest kids to examine. Instead, in a nearby room, she manually reviewed a 50-page printout of that day’s detainees, and highlighted the names of children with a 2019 birth date—the babies—before moving on to the toddlers.

When it was almost time to leave, Sevier asked to see a 3-year-old girl, and then two other children. But by that point, the friendly and accommodating Border Patrol agent assisting her earlier in the day had been replaced by a dour guard, wearing a surgical mask, who claimed that he couldn’t find the toddler. “We can wait,” Sevier said, as she recalled to me in an interview. Her tone was polite but firm; she knew that she had the right under a federal court settlement to examine whomever she liked.

“She’s having a bath,” Sevier recalled the guard as saying, a luxury one official told her is available only to babies removed from their guardians. In the facility’s standard cages, there is no soap or showering for the kids. Though 72 hours is the longest a minor can be legally confined in such a facility, some had been there almost a month. Sevier waited.

[Grassroots]

These people chose this. We didn’t do this to them, they chose this for themselves. We are completely overwhelmed by the amount of people seeking asylum, we need to figure out why the rate is increasing so much.

[Decay]

These people chose this. We didn’t do this to them, they chose this for themselves. We are completely overwhelmed by the amount of people seeking asylum, we need to figure out why the rate is increasing so much.

Ignoring the first part if your statement, which is an obvious lie, we know why these people are coming at increasing rates.  The gang warfare in Central America is out of control and leaves these people with no choice but to seek refuge somewhere safe. If you study the migration of people throughout history, push factors are almost always the most consequential, far more relevant than pull factors. At least now we know for certain that "getting tough" on immigration is a complete and total failure as a policy.  Until those push factors are addressed the right wing will be stuck in an endless cycle of reacting to immigration and failing to control it.

[T'Chenka]

These people chose this. We didn’t do this to them, they chose this for themselves. We are completely overwhelmed by the amount of people seeking asylum, we need to figure out why the rate is increasing so much.

There is nothing that says you can't just tweak the asylum laws and fingerprint them and then release them back at the border (at a heavily fortified sector) and only detain repeat offenders. There's nothing saying you can't change the wording of the laws so they aren't forced to cross the border in order to apply for asylum.

The government is looking at the situation, clearly seeing that their facilities are beyond capacity, acknowledging it, and saying "f___ it, detain them anyways and make them live like animals". Wasn't Trump complainimg that you can't keep them longer than 21 days as well? Why keep them for long periods of time on the taxpayer's dime? Do you think being detained for 3 weeks isn't long enough to intimidate them into not coming back?

Now we're getting to the root of the problem here. Above the level of illegal immigration and asylum seekers where it's just flat out too much - which is a point of contention between liberals and conservatives - Democrats wants to simply keep the numbers down to a reasonable level, by their own definition of "reasonable". THAT'S IT. For Republicans, it's not just about removing them from America. There is a sick and twisted requirement to inflict fear and pain and humiliation and dehumanization upon the migrants. They're trying to apply for asylum because they're running from hell, and you put them into a different hell. This is approaching the levels of Moses and the Jews and the Egyptians, man. Jesus would be furious.

[Fuzzy Bear Loves Christian Missionaries]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

[T'Chenka]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

[Former President tack50]

I just want to remind the people who sleep at night okay that we're stopping only just short of committing genocide by telling themselves "oh these are criminals and lawbreakers, they deserve it": these are legal asylum seekers. US immigration and asylum laws state, very clear and in no uncertain terms, in order to seek asylum you must show up in person, and turn yourself in to immigration officials before you can apply--the overwhelming majority of those didn't even get the opportunity to voluntarily turn themselves in before they were snatched up and thrown in these camps--we are violating our own asylum laws by doing this and effectively luring people into a trap for God knows what reason, I guess so old rich white people can blame the scary browns so they can stay in power.

Doesn't Asylum require you to stop at the first safe country?

That means that really only Canadians, Mexicans and some Caribbean nations like Cuba for example would have the right to ask for asylum in the US. A Honduran or Salvadorean person would be instead required to stop in Mexico?

Also, don't something like 95% of Asylum requests get rejected?

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

[7,052,770]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

[Fuzzy Bear Loves Christian Missionaries]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

Then why did the Democrats vote against ICE Funding that would have alleviated this?

The reason, obviously, is because they want to (A) abolish ICE (long term) and (B) keep their "concentration camp" narrative going (short term) to gain support for the abolition of ICE, an idea that does not have majority public support at present.

The Democrats also hope that conditions become so bad in these camps that a Federal Judge will order the release of large numbers of detainees on some sort of bond or release on their own recognizance prior to some sort of future Court action for their situations.  They won't say this, of course, but why else would they vote against funding designated to alleviate the conditions in ICE Detention Centers.

The reason for the problematic conditions is the overwhelming number of persons that have illegally entered America with the encouragement of the political left in America.  Our ICE Detention system was not problematic until the immigration issue became one where Democrats actively celebrated illegal immigrants.  (They had them on stage at the 2016 DNC; don't tell me that this isn't so.) 

[7,052,770]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

Then why did the Democrats vote against ICE Funding that would have alleviated this?

The reason, obviously, is because they want to (A) abolish ICE (long term) and (B) keep their "concentration camp" narrative going (short term) to gain support for the abolition of ICE, an idea that does not have majority public support at present.

The Democrats also hope that conditions become so bad in these camps that a Federal Judge will order the release of large numbers of detainees on some sort of bond or release on their own recognizance prior to some sort of future Court action for their situations.  They won't say this, of course, but why else would they vote against funding designated to alleviate the conditions in ICE Detention Centers.

The reason for the problematic conditions is the overwhelming number of persons that have illegally entered America with the encouragement of the political left in America.  Our ICE Detention system was not problematic until the immigration issue became one where Democrats actively celebrated illegal immigrants.  (They had them on stage at the 2016 DNC; don't tell me that this isn't so.) 

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

As you say, the horrible conditions in the Republicans' concentration camps are a feature, not a bug. We do not need to spend more money to end them - mass incarceration is the most expensive option here, and it is being chosen deliberately.

Reminder: Trump doesn’t need to keep migrants in detention camps

Requesting asylum is not against the law, so there’s no legal requirement to jail them like criminals. Under past administrations, the Department of Homeland Security has usually chosen to lock up both asylum seekers and those who cross the border without a visa, but the agency also created several effective alternatives to detention. The White House could prioritize these programs instead of keeping migrants in such inhumane conditions.

To understand just how expensive it is for DHS to house, shelter, and feed immigrants, all you have to do is look at the agency’s own numbers. In its budget request for fiscal year 2018, DHS said that it cost about $133.99 per day to hold an adult immigrant in detention and $319.37 for an individual in family detention. Meanwhile, the agency said the average cost of placing someone in an alternative program is $4.50 per day.

Recent estimates from the Department of Health and Human Services show that housing immigrants in tent cities would cost a whopping $775 a day per detainee, according to documents reviewed this summer by reporters at NBC News.

[Slander and/or Libel]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

Then why did the Democrats vote against ICE Funding that would have alleviated this?

The reason, obviously, is because they want to (A) abolish ICE (long term) and (B) keep their "concentration camp" narrative going (short term) to gain support for the abolition of ICE, an idea that does not have majority public support at present.

The Democrats also hope that conditions become so bad in these camps that a Federal Judge will order the release of large numbers of detainees on some sort of bond or release on their own recognizance prior to some sort of future Court action for their situations.  They won't say this, of course, but why else would they vote against funding designated to alleviate the conditions in ICE Detention Centers.

The reason for the problematic conditions is the overwhelming number of persons that have illegally entered America with the encouragement of the political left in America.  Our ICE Detention system was not problematic until the immigration issue became one where Democrats actively celebrated illegal immigrants.  (They had them on stage at the 2016 DNC; don't tell me that this isn't so.) 

Additional funding wouldn’t alleviate this because this is what the Trump administration WANTS TO DO.

He’s SAID THIS. EXPLICITLY.

[Xeuma]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

Then why did the Democrats vote against ICE Funding that would have alleviated this?

The reason, obviously, is because they want to (A) abolish ICE (long term) and (B) keep their "concentration camp" narrative going (short term) to gain support for the abolition of ICE, an idea that does not have majority public support at present.

The Democrats also hope that conditions become so bad in these camps that a Federal Judge will order the release of large numbers of detainees on some sort of bond or release on their own recognizance prior to some sort of future Court action for their situations.  They won't say this, of course, but why else would they vote against funding designated to alleviate the conditions in ICE Detention Centers.

The reason for the problematic conditions is the overwhelming number of persons that have illegally entered America with the encouragement of the political left in America.  Our ICE Detention system was not problematic until the immigration issue became one where Democrats actively celebrated illegal immigrants.  (They had them on stage at the 2016 DNC; don't tell me that this isn't so.) 

It isn't the Democrats' fault when Trump does something bad. Its the Republicans' fault.

[T'Chenka]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

Then why did the Democrats vote against ICE Funding that would have alleviated this?

The reason, obviously, is because they want to (A) abolish ICE (long term) and (B) keep their "concentration camp" narrative going (short term) to gain support for the abolition of ICE, an idea that does not have majority public support at present.

The Democrats also hope that conditions become so bad in these camps that a Federal Judge will order the release of large numbers of detainees on some sort of bond or release on their own recognizance prior to some sort of future Court action for their situations.  They won't say this, of course, but why else would they vote against funding designated to alleviate the conditions in ICE Detention Centers.

The reason for the problematic conditions is the overwhelming number of persons that have illegally entered America with the encouragement of the political left in America.  Our ICE Detention system was not problematic until the immigration issue became one where Democrats actively celebrated illegal immigrants.  (They had them on stage at the 2016 DNC; don't tell me that this isn't so.) 

It isn't the Democrats' fault when Trump does something bad. Its the Republicans' fault.

Imagine having to explain this to an adult. Oh wait.

[Fuzzy Bear Loves Christian Missionaries]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/asylum-united-states

Not all asylum seekers are in detention.  Some have been released, and some have not appeared for court proceedings while at liberty. 

Our system was not built for this level of asylum seekers.  We have this present problem because the asylum system is being abused by people who are not true asylum seekers.

So do you support a massive expenditure of funding to increase and upgrade detention facilities, immigration courts, and ICE staff?  All of these things will improve the lot of detainees and reduce the time of their detention, will it not?

[T'Chenka]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/asylum-united-states

Not all asylum seekers are in detention.  Some have been released, and some have not appeared for court proceedings while at liberty.  

I agree with this, but this is not what you said earlier. You claimed that the ones locked up had had their claims "found not legitimate", when in actuality they are in a concentration camp because the system doesn't have time to properly process this many asylum seekers in a time-efficent manner (and Trump likes it that way and will not fix it).

Those are two totally different claims.

[Fuzzy Bear Loves Christian Missionaries]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/asylum-united-states

Not all asylum seekers are in detention.  Some have been released, and some have not appeared for court proceedings while at liberty.  

I agree with this, but this is not what you said earlier. You claimed that the ones locked up had had their claims "found not legitimate", when in actuality they are in a concentration camp because the system doesn't have time to properly process this many asylum seekers in a time-efficent manner (and Trump likes it that way and will not fix it).

Those are two totally different claims.

A percentage of people in detention are Asylum seekers who were not detained, whose claims were found wanting, and had to be retaken because they didn't show up for a court hearing.  They are in that mix.  But yes, that is not all the Asylum seekers by any means.

I would agree in principle that the issue of detaining Asylum Seekers is a legitimate one and should be discussed.  The idea of detaining folks legitimately seeking asylum is one that does not go down well, and should not go down well.  That has to be balanced against the overwhelming evidence that the asylum system is being abused by people who are not true asylum seekers, but people who just want a better situation.  I have a degree of empathy for people in that situation, but that isn't what asylum is.

[T'Chenka]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/asylum-united-states

Not all asylum seekers are in detention.  Some have been released, and some have not appeared for court proceedings while at liberty.  

I agree with this, but this is not what you said earlier. You claimed that the ones locked up had had their claims "found not legitimate", when in actuality they are in a concentration camp because the system doesn't have time to properly process this many asylum seekers in a time-efficent manner (and Trump likes it that way and will not fix it).

Those are two totally different claims.

A percentage of people in detention are Asylum seekers who were not detained, whose claims were found wanting, and had to be retaken because they didn't show up for a court hearing.  They are in that mix.  But yes, that is not all the Asylum seekers by any means.

I would agree in principle that the issue of detaining Asylum Seekers is a legitimate one and should be discussed.  The idea of detaining folks legitimately seeking asylum is one that does not go down well, and should not go down well.  That has to be balanced against the overwhelming evidence that the asylum system is being abused by people who are not true asylum seekers, but people who just want a better situation.  I have a degree of empathy for people in that situation, but that isn't what asylum is.

Can you share that evidence? Most things I've seen point to this being b___sh_t, but I am open-minded to changing or adjusting my stance if proven wrong.

[Badger]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

[Badger]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

Because your prior citation from a right-wing anti-immigration groups sucked. And in terms of some people not showing up for court, we are talking about less than 1 and 100 under Obama era Administration practice