Re: Swiss elections and referenda - New Federal Councilor(s) election 7 December

[Tender Branson]

This is today !



Will be interesting to watch, I guess the Greens and Green-Liberals will surge to some 15-20% combined (but more towards 20% if Vorarlberg is any indicator).

Also, turnout (which is historically low in Switzerland) should pass 50%. My estimate would be 54% (up from 48.5% in 2015), due to a surge of young voters - who are extremely lazy in Switzerland. Only 30% of 18-24 year olds voted last time, compared with 66% of those who are older than 65.

https://www.nzz.ch/schweiz/eidgenoessische-wahlen-2019/wahlen-2019-diese-sechs-fragen-sind-heute-entscheidend-ld.1503669

Question for parochial boy:

Do you know the number of eligible voters ? I found different sources, but it should be around 5.45 million people this time.

That's quite low, considering that Switzerland has 8.6 million people, but there are only 6.4 million with Swiss citizenship and Switzerland does not allow 16 year olds to vote. Which could be a reason why the Greens/Green-Liberals might not break 20% combined. The 16-18 year old crowd is the most ardent Green clientel right now.

Also, here are maps of historical results:

https://www.srf.ch/news/schweiz/wahlen-2019/wahlen-2019-so-haben-die-schweizer-gemeinden-in-den-letzten-40-jahren-gewaehlt

BTW: polls close at noon.

[Tender Branson]

Thanks again and for the map too, French TV is working but German isn't so I don't know what that says!

Also why do % vote movements in Swiss elections tend to be so small compared to most other countries?

The German-speaking SRF works for me.

I’m watching it right now.

As for vote changes: Swiss politics is very boring, they get things done, there’s hardly any scandals or controversy, that’s why changes are small.

[Tender Branson]

Is Europe Elect's classification of SVP in Reform Europe (= Liberals) a joke ?

[Tender Branson]

Turnout is much lower in the already-counted cantons:

https://www.wahlen.admin.ch/en/

Down 5% on average, from 48.5% in 2015.

[Tender Branson]

In St. Gallen for example (a very large canton), turnout dropped from 46.5% to 42% - which is kinda bad and surprising, because the Green surge would have suggested more (younger) voters today.

[Tender Branson]

In the biggest canton of Switzerland, Zürich (1.5 million people), the Greens and Green-Libs gain about 7% each.

Both have ca. 14%, so 28% in total. That would be more than the SVP there (27%, -3%).

Turnout in Zürich, with almost everything counted, is 3% down compared with 2015.

Roughly the same situation in the canton Bern, the 2nd largest (1 million people). Turnout down ca. 2-3%, with the two Green parties not gaining as much as in Zürich.

[Tender Branson]

The German areas are counting faster than the French ones:

https://www.wahlen.admin.ch/en/

[Tender Branson]

The share of women increases from 32% to 42% in the new National Council.

[Tender Branson]

The canton of St. Gallen has officially dismissed the idea of annexing the Austrian state of Vorarlberg, saying that such a move would only be possible if the Vorarlbergers "have their human rights violated in a serious manner".

https://www.derstandard.at/story/2000110623132/vorarlberg-als-schweizer-kanton-von-st-galler-regierung-abgelehnt

[Tender Branson]

Referendum exit polls:

Ending free movement of people between EU and Switzerland:

63% Oppose
37% Approve

Procurement of new warplanes:

50% Approve
50% Oppose

Introduction of two weeks of paternity leave (paternal leave for fathers):

61% Approve
39% Oppose

Revision of the "Swiss Federal Law on Hunting and the Protection of Indigenous Mammals and Birds":

51% Approve
49% Oppose

The "wolf hunting law" has actually been rejected by voters.

While there were no wolves in Switzerland in the 90s, there are now up to 80 in the country - who are killing a lot of sheep and cows of farmers in search for food. But not only for food, just because of their killing instinct. Such animals are very expensive for farmers, so the proponents wanted the law changed to shoot some "problem wolves". This is also controversial in Austria, where wolves made a comeback as well. Here, it's up to the states and my state (Salzburg) has decided to kill problem wolves if they repeatedly kill sheep.

Also, the purchase of new fighter jets was approved by 8.000 votes or by 50.1%-49.9%.

[Tender Branson]

parochial boy, did you vote as well today ?

What is your position on wolf hunting ?

[Tender Branson]

parochial boy, did you vote as well today ?

What is your position on wolf hunting ?

Yep, well about two weeks ago in fact.

The hunting one was the only that I really had a hard time deciding on to be honest. I ended up voting No on the basis, well principally of one friend's intense lobbying but also because certain cantons (Valais, basically) have a pretty bad record when it comes to the hunting of protected species and I'm not sure I would trust them, not with wolves specifically, but other more harmless species like lynx or marmottes (Murmeltiere) that could also have been affected. Also the idea of being able to kill wolves before they had actually done something seemed a bit off.

Not sure it was the right decision, but it is what it is now - probably there needs to be big steps in areas like compensating farmers for attacks, or funding guard dogs. Right now, those laws are really quite unfair (and really should have been reformed anyway).

Swapping the results for the hunting and the fighter jets would have been ideal imo.

Hmm, the proposed change in the law was to preemptively kill the wolves ?

In that case I would have voted against it as well.

Not all newly arrived wolves in the area are killing herds of sheep and I support killing them only if they attack.

And they need to be killed.

Of course the farmers can be compensated by insurance, but it's not only that: the wolf will come back and kill again. And not only 1 sheep, but often a complete herd. And it sucks for a farmer if you have to collect the body parts of 30 sheep all over the mountain areas, with the intestines, stomachs, head, feet and bones etc. distributed all over 100s of meters ...

[Tender Branson]

Why does a neutral nation even need fighter jets?

In the case of Austria and Switzerland, it's in their constitution.

It says, literally, that "the country's military needs to provide for measures to protect its airspace from unidentified aircraft at any time and everywhere quicky".

That's not possible with helicopters for example, because of the country size and speed of the incoming, unidentified aircraft.

Therefore, Austria and Switzerland need for example a minimum of some 10-15 supersonic fighter jets for its territories.

If an unidentified aircraft enters our airspace, there will be an "alarm start" of 2 armed jets, who will approach the aircraft in 5-10 minutes from anywhere in the country to identify it and escort it abroad (or in case of terrorism, shoot it down).

The other fighter jets are used mostly for constant pilot training and repairs.

[Tender Branson]

„Burqa ban referendum“

This is so 2014-16 ...

[Tender Branson]

6-7 years is about normal for how it takes to get from petition starting to actual vote as far as initiatives are concerned - so they're always going to be lagging as far as that is concerned. I am looking forward to a series of pointless covid related ones being voted on in 2028-30.

I... what?

Exeggerating somewhat, not a lot - but as an example with the multinationals:

Signature collection starts - April 2015
Signature collections deadline - 18 months later so October 2016
Initiative submitted - October 2016
Federal Council review and parliamentary submission  - September 2017
Parliamentary conclusion - June 2020
Vote - September 2020

Total time  - 5.5 years

For the face covering initiative - the signature collections started in Spring 2016, so a similar 5 year time frame.

(and of course, lets not forget the gay marriage bill, which will probably go to referendum in September or November *checks notes* 8 years after the bill was originally submitted to parliament)

You might be aware of this already, but there is a stereotype that the Swiss are slow. It's not totally inaccurate because things do not happen quickly in this country.

Things may not happen fast in Switzerland, but at least they happen in an efficient manner.

[Tender Branson]

The facial veil ban seems to be approved with 54% by Swiss voters, after 16 cantons are counted.

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss--burka-ban--vote-too-close-to-call/46420534

[Tender Branson]

Results from all 3 referendums today:

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/vote-results--march-7--2021/46380436

# face veil ban will be approved (I wonder how many Swiss voted for it because they cannot stand wearing masks any longer, not because of Muslims ...)

# electronic ID will be soundly rejected (out of big data privacy concerns)

# free-trade agreement with Indonesia will be slightly approved (there are concerns about palm oil imports and the resulting destruction of biosphere in Indonesia)

[Tender Branson]

Graubünden in opposition wtf

No big deal.

Like Zell am See, where I live, there are some Swiss tourism towns there which are flooded by Arab/Gulf tourists in the 100.000s every summer before Covid.

We have become used to them. You cannot enforce these bans anyway, because they are moneyed tourists who pay the fines when police stop them and ask the women to remove their niqabs. Then they briefly remove the face veil until the police is gone and minutes later they are fully veiled again ... that’s why voters in tourist towns actually voted no, while the French areas outside Genf voted mostly yes because they are intimidated by the French Muslims and recent terror there.