Republican Presidential Debate

[StevenNick]

I support reforming affirmative action so that instead of giving extra credit to people based on their race, it would give breaks to people based on what they have had to overcome.  We should give preference to those who are less advantaged economically.  I had a lot of advantages growing up that others don't have, I'd like to see an income based affirmative action replace the current race based affirmative action.

That's actually a position I agree with.  Presumably most of the beneficiaries of an economic-based preferences system would be minorities, but preferences would only be given to those qualified in their own rite.  Unlike current affirmative action policies, the economic-based affirmative action wouldn't produce racism and failure as the current state of affirmative action seems to do.

But under your reading of the 14th Amendment, income does not justify special treatment.  How do you reconcile this inconsistency?

But merit would be the key factor in determining who received affirmative action benefits.  A poor person who was just as qualified for a job or for admission to a college would have to be just as qualified as the rich competetors to even be considered for hiring or admission, even under affirmative action.  So I don't know if that qualifies as giving 'special treatment' to the poor.

On the other hand, maybe you're right.  Maybe I spoke too soon when I said I agreed with you on the subject.  

[The Duke]

Mr. Ford, I have a question that many are tired of hearing and wondering. Who do you have in mind if you get the nomination, and what do you look for in a running mate?

I won't be making a decision until the Convention probably, if I am the nominee (let's not get ahead of ourselves).

What am I looking for?  Someone who could take over if something happenned to me and someone who would add something to both the ticket and the administration.

[StevenNick]

Mr. Ford, I have a question that many are tired of hearing and wondering. Who do you have in mind if you get the nomination, and what do you look for in a running mate?

I won't be making a decision until the Convention probably, if I am the nominee (let's not get ahead of ourselves).

What am I looking for?  Someone who could take over if something happenned to me and someone who would add something to both the ticket and the administration.

I think Reaganfan wanted you to say you were looking for somebody just like him.

[The Duke]

I figured as much.  He is on the short list, and he'll probably be in the cabinet if I pick someone else for VP.

[StevenNick]

Shall we move on to a different topic?

[The Duke]

Sure, how about Education.

[StevenNick]

I favor vouchers and charter schools.  I think every state should move to increase school choice.

I'm opposed to the No Child Left Behind Act because it federalizes an issue that shouldn't be federalized.

Those are just two very basic opinions I have on education.

[StevenNick]

I think I'm going to take a break for a while.  I'll be back sometime soon.

[The Duke]

Let me state my position.

Lets start with college education.  I have friends who work 40+ hours each week and also maintain a full class schedule.  College costs too damn much.  I propose that if a student works 15 hours a week, the government will pay 25% of theri tuition.  If they work 20 hours a week, the government will pay 35% of their tuition.  Also, I have a program called Citizen's Trust, it is a trust fund for regular people provided by the federal government.  You get a $10,000 savings bond when you are born that will be put in the stock market, and accessible at when you graduate high school.  This will help students pay for college.  This would also help out parents who have to worry about whether they will be able to pay for their kids education.  Americans should never have to worry about whether their kids will have a future.

For secondary and primary education, I support No Child Left Behind.  We have seen an improvement in test scores since the act took effect, and I expect to see more of this as time goes on.  I favor local control; for example, I think that a Principal should be able to fire a bad teacher.  Right now, you can't fire a teacher because they have too many protections from the unions.  The Principals know who the good and bad teachers are, and they can make that decision.  Of course the decision could be brought to an arbitration board, to ensure that no one is fired unjustly, but the Principals should have that power.  I also favor experimenting with vouchers in the inner cities, we should start with Washington D.C., the worst system in America.  They are 51st in results but at $20,000 per student they are #1 in spending.  If those kid's parents had a choice of where to send their kids, they'd have a much better future ahead of them.

One final point is that education starts in the home.  It starts with strong families, and the way to make sure that families are strong is to make sure that we don't take too much of their paycheck in taxes and we make sure we fix this mess we have in social security so the can retire when they get to 65 and not have to worry.  We need to make sure the economy is strong so there are good jobs and a person can make a living wage.

These plans are, of course, subject to budgetary concerns, and would not be implemented until the deficit is under control.

I am also taking a break.  I have to eat dinner and do some work, but I thank you all for a excitng debate and I hope to continue it.

[The Duke]

I think that it is important to train an Iraqi military ASAP. If their own people are defending the country and there will be less resistance. None the less, we need to stay the course in the war on terror. National security is the most important issue.

Second is the economy. As president, I will cut taxes. The more money in your pocket, the more likely you are to spend it and help the economy grow.

I agree wholeheartedly.  Cutting taxes across the board should be a priority.  I also agree with training a New Iraq Army, but like I said, I oppose ressurecting Saddam's old Army.

[StevenNick]

Lets start with college education.  I have friends who work 40+ hours each week and also maintain a full class schedule.  College costs too damn much.  I propose that if a student works 15 hours a week, the government will pay 25% of theri tuition.  If they work 20 hours a week, the government will pay 35% of their tuition.  Also, I have a program called Citizen's Trust, it is a trust fund for regular people provided by the federal government.  You get a $10,000 savings bond when you are born that will be put in the stock market, and accessible at when you graduate high school.  This will help students pay for college.  This would also help out parents who have to worry about whether they will be able to pay for their kids education.  Americans should never have to worry about whether their kids will have a future.

I agree that college is, for the most part, too expensive.  My only question is, what government is going to be paying for people to go to college?  Is it going to be the federal government or the state governments.  For issues of federalism, I oppose any federal funds going to pay for college education for anyone.

I just recently read that Colorado is going to become the first state to institute college vouchers.  It'll be interesting to see what kind of effect these have on college tuition, but if successful this could be a really effective way of lowering the cost of college for everyone.

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I'm sure that the No Child Left Behind Act is improving test scores nation-wide.  I just think that's beside the point.  The question to me is whether or not the federal government has the right to limit a state's jurisdiction over public education.  Amendment 9 says the following:  The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.  Amendment 10 says this:  The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.  Considering that education is never outlined as an area over which the federal government has jurisdiction, I do not believe the federal government has any right to regulate the educational policy of state and local governments.

We're in complete agreement on firing teachers.  The teachers unions have held education hostage in this country.  They protect their jobs and their seniority at the cost of the education of America's youth.  I agree that individual principals need to have more, if not total control over what teachers are hired and fired at each school.  I agree with you on vouchers as well.  Our only difference on the subject is that I don't think we should just experiment with vouchers, I think they should be instituted everywhere.  But again, federalism is an issue.  The only school district over which the U.S. Congress rightfully has jurisdiction is the Washington D.C. school district.  I say give them vouchers and let state legislatures deal with vouchers for other school districts.

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I agree completely.  Get the government out of our lives.  

However, I get a little nervous when you talk about a living wage.    What do you mean when you say 'living wage'?

[StevenNick]

To be entirely honest, I don't have too many ideas on higher education.  I'm only in high school, so I don't have many educational ideas for schools beyond that level.

From my high school experience, I've become increasingly conservative, almost libertarian on education.  For one thing, vouchers need to be instituted at the state level everywhere.  I'm convinced that this would go a long way toward reviving the education system in America.  In addition, I've come to think that the one-size-fits-all high school education is a failure.  Why not take a more European approach to education where at some point kids take a test to determine whether or not they will continue with academics or move on to vocational education.  I also think statewide requirements should be loosened to allow individual students more leeway in designing a coarse load that fits their plans for future employment.  Perhaps states could create multiple sets of requirements.  There could be a math/science diploma, a history/english diploma, a fine arts diploma, a vocational diploma, etc.  Basically I think we should strive to make high schools operate more like colleges.

Vouchers would make public and private schools compete for money.  Charter schools would add an element of competition within the public school system.  In time, if schools were allowed to set their own graduation standards, within certain boundaries, some schools would gain a better reputation that others.  One school might be the math/science magnate.  Another school would be the fine arts magnate.  

One thing that doesn't get much attention, but I feel is important anyway is the issue of discipline in schools.  I firmly believe that state laws should make it easier for school administrators to expel problem students from their schools.  Administrators of other schools should be able to turn away students who've been expelled from other schools.

I guess my entire education policy can be condensed down to two words:  Think local.

[The Duke]

However, I get a little nervous when you talk about a living wage.    What do you mean when you say 'living wage'?

All I mean is I want the economy to create good jobs so a person can go to work in the morning and make enough money to provide for themselves and their family.  A good economy goes a long way towards strengthening the family, and therefore education.

[StevenNick]

However, I get a little nervous when you talk about a living wage.    What do you mean when you say 'living wage'?

All I mean is I want the economy to create good jobs so a person can go to work in the morning and make enough money to provide for themselves and their family.  A good economy goes a long way towards strengthening the family, and therefore education.

Wonderful.  

I was afraid you might be talking about a minimum wage.

[The Duke]

I do support the minimum wage, but it should not be raised at this time.

[StevenNick]

I do support the minimum wage, but it should not be raised at this time.

Alright.

[The Duke]

I guess NixonNow doesn't want to be President.  He barely took part in this.

[StevenNick]

We'll continue this tomorrow.  Maybe he and John and whoever else can participate more fully then.

[Gustaf]

Like Steven, I was surprised at the high level of debate here. You're both doing great, keep it up!

And John seems to be the only GOP candidate who wants to RAISE taxes...I guess he's trying to get the moderate voters...

[The Duke]

I was just reading over the transcript here, and I realize why Steven and I couldn't see eye to eye on the constitutionality of the tax code.  He didn't seem to realize that everyone does in fact pay the same rate on the first $26,000 or so in income (15%) and the same rate on the next x number of dollars.  The rich pay more because they are the only ones that earn in the highest brackets.  I may be wrong, he may know this (and he should say so if he does), but if he didn't, it might explain why he doesn't accept the constitutionality of the income tax.

[StevenNick]

I reject the entire notion of tax brackets.  If the income tax is kept, there should be one flat rate for everybody who earns an income above the poverty line.  I don't know the details of the U.S. tax code (hell, nobody does), but I know for a fact that different tax brackets pay a different total percentage of their income in federal income taxes.  I think this is wrong.

I stand by my statements about the current income tax and the 14th amendment.

[King]

Another bump for my good friend (and hopefully yours) hillarity.

[KEmperor]

Bumped so that all the newer members can understand the "money plan" meme.  It all started on page 2.

[Small Business Owner of Any Repute]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say, yeah, at 3 years and 4 months later, it's too late.

[Hash]

Back when I was moderator, and not a candidate, these were the topics everyone agreed to, as they appered originally, on the Republican board.

"1.) Iraq- I will ask what you would do to deal with the ongoing problems in Iraq.  How do you see the insurgency?  Is it a broad based movement?  How would you deal with them?  What would you like Iraq to look like when we are done?

2.) Social Security- Social Security is on the verge of bankruptcy, what will you do?  From you posts here, some of you already know what you want to do.  That's good, be prepared to answer questions on the topic.

3.) Education- This is another one where you guys already have some good ideas.  I will ask about vouchers.  I will ask about technology in the classroom.  I will ask about local vs. federal control and whether you support Bush's NCLB (no Child Left Behind).

4.) The Budget- We have a deficit.  Do you think this is a problem?  If so, how will you fix it?  If not, why aren't you concerned?  Will you raise taxes to cut the deficit?  That last one is important, you better have a good answer.

5.) I will ask about outsourcing.  Everyone else is, so I have to.  Is it good, bad, or a little of both?  What kind of trade policies do you support?  I will specifically ask about keeping NAFTA and China trade, so have an answer."

There they are, so we have some structure to this thing.

I'll start by talking about topic 1 in a moment.

Job Outsourcing. I believe that we should trade with other countries. I especially believe that we should continue the China trade. The chinese people have a lot of goods to offer us as we do them.

Thank you.

We're talking about outsourcing, not trade and your opinion of Chinese products.