New Charlottesville 'white civil rights rally' in DC (Unite the Right 2)

[Atlas Has Shrugged]

That hilarious moment when people seriously think some dumb, edgy "Nazis" shouting ignorant stuff is the same thing as real Nazis that actually invaded other countries, murdered millions of people, and tortured many more.

If "resistance" morons stopped giving them the time of day, they'd mostly fade away back into irrelevance and continue to be some radical fringe group with no real voice.

As other have pointed out, this post demonstrates total ignorance of history. The Nazi movement didn’t begin by invading Poland, it was the culmination of a pattern of escalating violence which began with, yes, street marches of violent young thugs

Nazism started when the Imperialist entante powers attempted to chain down Germany once and for all. Those harsh terms resulted in many good people joining an unsavory movement. In that sense, there is at least a slight comparison to your prior arguments.

But ftaghan is right. People argue its "ok to punch Nazis" because they'd persecute them should they ever come to power. This is stupid. Do you guys think all 10,000 or so Neo-Nazis are going to somehow organize and take over the government? Are you really that fearful of the world around you?

Let the Nazis march. All they are doing is destroying their own brand. And now that it is considered acceptable to punch fascists, what is going to stop them from bunching you?

It was nice seeing Sanchez again. Nice weather, and mosquito-free as usual.

Pics or it didn't happen.

[Panda Express]

Today's Neo-Confederates are pussies.

White nationalists dwarfed by crowds of counterprotesters in Washington

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[Izzyeviel]

That hilarious moment when people seriously think some dumb, edgy "Nazis" shouting ignorant stuff is the same thing as real Nazis that actually invaded other countries, murdered millions of people, and tortured many more.

If "resistance" morons stopped giving them the time of day, they'd mostly fade away back into irrelevance and continue to be some radical fringe group with no real voice.

As other have pointed out, this post demonstrates total ignorance of history. The Nazi movement didn’t begin by invading Poland, it was the culmination of a pattern of escalating violence which began with, yes, street marches of violent young thugs

Nazism started when the Imperialist entante powers attempted to chain down Germany once and for all. Those harsh terms resulted in many good people joining an unsavory movement. In that sense, there is at least a slight comparison to your prior arguments.

But ftaghan is right. People argue its "ok to punch Nazis" because they'd persecute them should they ever come to power. This is stupid. Do you guys think all 10,000 or so Neo-Nazis are going to somehow organize and take over the government? Are you really that fearful of the world around you?

Let the Nazis march. All they are doing is destroying their own brand. And now that it is considered acceptable to punch fascists, what is going to stop them from bunching you?

It was nice seeing Sanchez again. Nice weather, and mosquito-free as usual.

Pics or it didn't happen.

Nazism started when someone realised if he blamed minorites for Germany's problems and called every news story that was negative towards him 'fake news' he could get enough people to support his movement and maybe squeeze into power.

[💥💥 brandon bro (he/him/his)]

That hilarious moment when people seriously think some dumb, edgy "Nazis" shouting ignorant stuff is the same thing as real Nazis that actually invaded other countries, murdered millions of people, and tortured many more.

If "resistance" morons stopped giving them the time of day, they'd mostly fade away back into irrelevance and continue to be some radical fringe group with no real voice.

Yes, the existence of a white supremacy movement in this country is totally "the Resistance"'s fault.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Rally was an epic fail anyway: https://www.vox.com/identities/2018/8/12/17681444/unite-the-right-rally-dc-charlottesville-failure

[Statilius the Epicurean]

Nazism started when the Imperialist entante powers attempted to chain down Germany once and for all. Those harsh terms resulted in many good people joining an unsavory movement. In that sense, there is at least a slight comparison to your prior arguments.

In the 1928 Reichstag election, held a decade after this supposed "chaining down" by the "entante" which the good people of Germany apparently revolted against, the Nazis won 2.6% of the popular vote and became the 9th largest party. When the far right parties called a referendum on war reparations in Dec 1929 less than 15% of the electorate bothered to vote. What actually drove support to the Nazis was the collapse of the right of centre parties in the face of the economic collapse of the Great Depression.

[Yellowhammer]

As you have indicated, the vast majority of Confederate monuments were erected in the 1910's & 20's when Southern states were enacting Jim Crow laws.
There was also a significant, yet smaller spike in the 1950's & 60's during the Civil Rights movement.

See this graphic on this website (link below), showing the numbers and distribution of monuments over time. The article also points out that:
The chart illustrates upticks in the construction of Confederate monuments on courthouse grounds after the landmark Plessy v. Ferguson case in 1896 upheld state segregation laws. The construction of monuments outside of schools jumped after the 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education ruling, in which the Supreme Court deemed state laws segregating public schools to be unconstitutional.

So you can drop your "leftists want to abolish place and history" shtick.
All the evidence above shows that Southerners weren't really concerned about "history" when erecting these monuments. But instead, it was about using them as symbols of hate and intimidation.

http://theweek.com/speedreads/718507/striking-graphic-reveals-construction-confederate-monuments-peaked-during-jim-crow-civil-rights-eras

Southern states started enacting Jim Crow laws in the late 19th century, though. Plus, as your graph indicates, the largest spike in public Confederate commemoration was already on the decline when the Klan was reformed in the 1910s. If anything, the strongest correlation is with the aging of Civil War veterans and the passage of the Civil War from people's living memory. Which makes perfect sense.

It "makes perfect sense" to Neo-Nazis, Klansmen and white supremacists.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers bore the brunt of the most destructive war in the history of the United States.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers' main purpose of fighting was to preserve the act of enslaving other human beings (for money). The fact that they (the South) "bore the brunt" of the American Civil War (versus the North) was both justified and a grace to all humanity.

The vast majority of monuments are depicting their leaders, and not the sheep the leaders employed (and fooled) to fight for them. Their leaders were intelligent (and rich) and knew exactly what their true cause was (and not "State's rights" bulls**t).

Do you call the kidnapping and/or raping by soldiers of thousands of girls and women a "grace to all humanity?" Do you call decapitating teenage boys and mounting their heads on pikes a "grace to all humanity?" Would you also call the burnings of thousands of homes and farmsteads occupied by innocent women, children, and elderly a "grace to humanity?" Do you call the starvation of civilians to the point of death a "grace to humanity?" These are just a small selection of things that Southerners, seeking nothing more than self-determination, suffered. Think twice before you celebrate and cheer the slaughter and suffering of millions of innocent people. There was nothing graceful about the Civil War.

While some good things did come out of it in the end, the acts of sheer evil that psychopaths such as Sherman and Lincoln carried out to empower themselves can never be forgotten nor forgiven.

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

[Calthrina950]

As you have indicated, the vast majority of Confederate monuments were erected in the 1910's & 20's when Southern states were enacting Jim Crow laws.
There was also a significant, yet smaller spike in the 1950's & 60's during the Civil Rights movement.

See this graphic on this website (link below), showing the numbers and distribution of monuments over time. The article also points out that:
The chart illustrates upticks in the construction of Confederate monuments on courthouse grounds after the landmark Plessy v. Ferguson case in 1896 upheld state segregation laws. The construction of monuments outside of schools jumped after the 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education ruling, in which the Supreme Court deemed state laws segregating public schools to be unconstitutional.

So you can drop your "leftists want to abolish place and history" shtick.
All the evidence above shows that Southerners weren't really concerned about "history" when erecting these monuments. But instead, it was about using them as symbols of hate and intimidation.

http://theweek.com/speedreads/718507/striking-graphic-reveals-construction-confederate-monuments-peaked-during-jim-crow-civil-rights-eras

Southern states started enacting Jim Crow laws in the late 19th century, though. Plus, as your graph indicates, the largest spike in public Confederate commemoration was already on the decline when the Klan was reformed in the 1910s. If anything, the strongest correlation is with the aging of Civil War veterans and the passage of the Civil War from people's living memory. Which makes perfect sense.

It "makes perfect sense" to Neo-Nazis, Klansmen and white supremacists.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers bore the brunt of the most destructive war in the history of the United States.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers' main purpose of fighting was to preserve the act of enslaving other human beings (for money). The fact that they (the South) "bore the brunt" of the American Civil War (versus the North) was both justified and a grace to all humanity.

The vast majority of monuments are depicting their leaders, and not the sheep the leaders employed (and fooled) to fight for them. Their leaders were intelligent (and rich) and knew exactly what their true cause was (and not "State's rights" bulls**t).

Do you call the kidnapping and/or raping by soldiers of thousands of girls and women a "grace to all humanity?" Do you call decapitating teenage boys and mounting their heads on pikes a "grace to all humanity?" Would you also call the burnings of thousands of homes and farmsteads occupied by innocent women, children, and elderly a "grace to humanity?" Do you call the starvation of civilians to the point of death a "grace to humanity?" These are just a small selection of things that Southerners, seeking nothing more than self-determination, suffered. Think twice before you celebrate and cheer the slaughter and suffering of millions of innocent people. There was nothing graceful about the Civil War.

While some good things did come out of it in the end, the acts of sheer evil that psychopaths such as Sherman and Lincoln went through to empower themselves can never be forgotten nor forgiven.

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

While I certainly don't wish to denigrate anyone who genuinely fought for their livelihoods during the Civil War, I also think that the role of slavery in causing the Civil War, and in its culmination, cannot be ignored. Whitewashing the fact that many state governments in the South declared their secession specifically over that issue, shouldn't be the course of action taken here. And in the eyes of many people, today's Confederate monuments are symbolic of a very dark stain upon this nation's history.

[DINGO Joe]

As you have indicated, the vast majority of Confederate monuments were erected in the 1910's & 20's when Southern states were enacting Jim Crow laws.
There was also a significant, yet smaller spike in the 1950's & 60's during the Civil Rights movement.

See this graphic on this website (link below), showing the numbers and distribution of monuments over time. The article also points out that:
The chart illustrates upticks in the construction of Confederate monuments on courthouse grounds after the landmark Plessy v. Ferguson case in 1896 upheld state segregation laws. The construction of monuments outside of schools jumped after the 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education ruling, in which the Supreme Court deemed state laws segregating public schools to be unconstitutional.

So you can drop your "leftists want to abolish place and history" shtick.
All the evidence above shows that Southerners weren't really concerned about "history" when erecting these monuments. But instead, it was about using them as symbols of hate and intimidation.

http://theweek.com/speedreads/718507/striking-graphic-reveals-construction-confederate-monuments-peaked-during-jim-crow-civil-rights-eras

Southern states started enacting Jim Crow laws in the late 19th century, though. Plus, as your graph indicates, the largest spike in public Confederate commemoration was already on the decline when the Klan was reformed in the 1910s. If anything, the strongest correlation is with the aging of Civil War veterans and the passage of the Civil War from people's living memory. Which makes perfect sense.

It "makes perfect sense" to Neo-Nazis, Klansmen and white supremacists.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers bore the brunt of the most destructive war in the history of the United States.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers' main purpose of fighting was to preserve the act of enslaving other human beings (for money). The fact that they (the South) "bore the brunt" of the American Civil War (versus the North) was both justified and a grace to all humanity.

The vast majority of monuments are depicting their leaders, and not the sheep the leaders employed (and fooled) to fight for them. Their leaders were intelligent (and rich) and knew exactly what their true cause was (and not "State's rights" bulls**t).

Do you call the kidnapping and/or raping by soldiers of thousands of girls and women a "grace to all humanity?" Do you call decapitating teenage boys and mounting their heads on pikes a "grace to all humanity?" Would you also call the burnings of thousands of homes and farmsteads occupied by innocent women, children, and elderly a "grace to humanity?" Do you call the starvation of civilians to the point of death a "grace to humanity?" These are just a small selection of things that Southerners, seeking nothing more than self-determination, suffered. Think twice before you celebrate and cheer the slaughter and suffering of millions of innocent people. There was nothing graceful about the Civil War.

While some good things did come out of it in the end, the acts of sheer evil that psychopaths such as Sherman and Lincoln carried out to empower themselves can never be forgotten nor forgiven.

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

You should unite with the blacks and Native Americans who are angry at the atrocities they suffered...oh wait.

[Izzyeviel]

What on earth are they teaching you in American schools about history??

[Statilius the Epicurean]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

The majority of southern men opposed secession and hundreds of thousands of them enlisted in the Union army. As for defending their homeland, the Confederacy invaded the parts of the south such as East Tennessee which opposed secession and crushed their governments . By the end of the war it was a police state with thousands of political prisoners imprisoned without trial and curfews and an internal passport system enforced by vigilante gangs with the central government 'requisitioning' property and conscripting people by force to keep the war effort going.

Literally the entire reason for the Confederacy was slavery. This is why the areas of the south away from the plantations and therefore with no stake in the slave economy opposed secession and heavily supported the Union.

[Yellowhammer]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

The majority of southern men opposed secession and hundreds of thousands of them enlisted in the Union army. As for defending their homeland, the Confederacy Union invaded the parts of the south such as East Tennessee  everywhere which opposed supported or opposed secession and crushed their governments . By the end of the war it was a police state with thousands of political prisoners imprisoned without trial and curfews and an internal passport system enforced by vigilante gangs with the central government 'requisitioning' property from people by force to keep the war effort going.

The bolded was carried out by the Union as well, and on a much larger scale. The government of both sides was generally terrible, but I am much more sympathetic to the poor farmers who were fighting to defend their state, their livelihoods, and their families than to the hordes of invaders who came to rape, plunder, and murder, and their sadistic psychopathic warlords like Sherman and Sheridan.

[Badger]

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers' main purpose of fighting was to preserve the act of enslaving other human beings (for money). The fact that they (the South) "bore the brunt" of the American Civil War (versus the North) was both justified and a grace to all humanity.

The average Southerner fought because he believed his home was being invaded, not because of slavery.

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Oh wait, sorry, I didn't expect you to contradict yourself already. I assumed that you would be able to maintain consistency at least long enough to make one whole post. I'll try to avoid making that mistake in the future.

Oh for God's sake just stop. Seriously, every one of your Confederate sucking up posts is proving the point of every other individual with Common Sense on this thread.

There is literally far too much inaccurate information, not to mention raw unadulterated stupidity, in your line of posts. I don't have time to take off of work tomorrow to answer them all, so please just go suck on a tide pod and stop posting your recycled moron fodder talking points.

But to summarize, the North won, slavery was abolished, and the UNITED S of A preserved. Score one for the good guys, no matter how many butt hurt Southerners want to rewrite history.

[Statilius the Epicurean]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

The majority of southern men opposed secession and hundreds of thousands of them enlisted in the Union army. As for defending their homeland, the Confederacy invaded the parts of the south such as East Tennessee which opposed secession and crushed their governments . By the end of the war it was a police state with thousands of political prisoners imprisoned without trial and curfews and an internal passport system enforced by vigilante gangs with the central government 'requisitioning' property from people by force to keep the war effort going.

The bolded was carried out by the Union as well, and on a much larger scale. The government of both sides was generally terrible, but I am much more sympathetic to the poor farmers who were fighting to defend their state, their livelihoods, and their families than to the barbarian hordes of invaders commanded by sadistic psychopathic warlords like Sherman and Sheridan.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shelton_Laurel_massacre
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Hanging_at_Gainesville

Confederate troops literally went around executing civilian southerners who were suspected of holding unionist tendencies.

[Badger]

That hilarious moment when people seriously think some dumb, edgy "Nazis" shouting ignorant stuff is the same thing as real Nazis that actually invaded other countries, murdered millions of people, and tortured many more.

If "resistance" morons stopped giving them the time of day, they'd mostly fade away back into irrelevance and continue to be some radical fringe group with no real voice.

How did they rise to prominence in the first place? Surely it must be because of Hillary.

They weren't talked about as nearly as much until Charlottesville. Had people just let them protest and make fools of themselves, they'd have eventually just moved on, at most becoming some joke on a late night tv show. Counterprotesters are absolutely what caused it to get as bad as it did, and inspired them to go bigger and bolder with their sh*tty demonstrations.

Yes, neo-nazis and the far-right truly were a mere Spectre in American life until Charlottesville.

[Badger]

That hilarious moment when people seriously think some dumb, edgy "Nazis" shouting ignorant stuff is the same thing as real Nazis that actually invaded other countries, murdered millions of people, and tortured many more.

You already repeated this a week or two ago (and you lost that argument). Why go there again?

If "resistance" morons stopped giving them the time of day, they'd mostly fade away back into irrelevance and continue to be some radical fringe group with no real voice.

And what about Orange Morons? Should King Orange Moron stop giving them the time of day, by referring to them as "very fine people?"
When the President of the United States gives them name, recognition and cover, that is by far the worst "power" to give these freaks.

To be fair, you think any response to me is me "losing" an argument, so your statement there means absolutely nothing.  

I guess if we are gonna talk about morons, I shouldn't forget the Lime Green fake moderate Californian one, sorry for forgetting to include that one.  

WTF does this even mean? Genuine question. I probably don't care and we'll point and laugh if it's explain to me, but my curiosity can't contain itself because you are being far more obtuse and even more poor at communicating than normal.

So to summarize, WTF?

[Badger]

That hilarious moment when people seriously think some dumb, edgy "Nazis" shouting ignorant stuff is the same thing as real Nazis that actually invaded other countries, murdered millions of people, and tortured many more.

If "resistance" morons stopped giving them the time of day, they'd mostly fade away back into irrelevance and continue to be some radical fringe group with no real voice.

As other have pointed out, this post demonstrates total ignorance of history. The Nazi movement didn’t begin by invading Poland, it was the culmination of a pattern of escalating violence which began with, yes, street marches of violent young thugs

Nazism started when the Imperialist entante powers attempted to chain down Germany once and for all. Those harsh terms resulted in many good people joining an unsavory movement. In that sense, there is at least a slight comparison to your prior arguments.

But ftaghan is right. People argue its "ok to punch Nazis" because they'd persecute them should they ever come to power. This is stupid. Do you guys think all 10,000 or so Neo-Nazis are going to somehow organize and take over the government? Are you really that fearful of the world around you?

Let the Nazis march. All they are doing is destroying their own brand. And now that it is considered acceptable to punch fascists, what is going to stop them from bunching you?

It was nice seeing Sanchez again. Nice weather, and mosquito-free as usual.

Pics or it didn't happen.

You are such a rat bastard for making me laugh at that.

[Badger]

As you have indicated, the vast majority of Confederate monuments were erected in the 1910's & 20's when Southern states were enacting Jim Crow laws.
There was also a significant, yet smaller spike in the 1950's & 60's during the Civil Rights movement.

See this graphic on this website (link below), showing the numbers and distribution of monuments over time. The article also points out that:
The chart illustrates upticks in the construction of Confederate monuments on courthouse grounds after the landmark Plessy v. Ferguson case in 1896 upheld state segregation laws. The construction of monuments outside of schools jumped after the 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education ruling, in which the Supreme Court deemed state laws segregating public schools to be unconstitutional.

So you can drop your "leftists want to abolish place and history" shtick.
All the evidence above shows that Southerners weren't really concerned about "history" when erecting these monuments. But instead, it was about using them as symbols of hate and intimidation.

http://theweek.com/speedreads/718507/striking-graphic-reveals-construction-confederate-monuments-peaked-during-jim-crow-civil-rights-eras

Southern states started enacting Jim Crow laws in the late 19th century, though. Plus, as your graph indicates, the largest spike in public Confederate commemoration was already on the decline when the Klan was reformed in the 1910s. If anything, the strongest correlation is with the aging of Civil War veterans and the passage of the Civil War from people's living memory. Which makes perfect sense.

It "makes perfect sense" to Neo-Nazis, Klansmen and white supremacists.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers bore the brunt of the most destructive war in the history of the United States.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers' main purpose of fighting was to preserve the act of enslaving other human beings (for money). The fact that they (the South) "bore the brunt" of the American Civil War (versus the North) was both justified and a grace to all humanity.

The vast majority of monuments are depicting their leaders, and not the sheep the leaders employed (and fooled) to fight for them. Their leaders were intelligent (and rich) and knew exactly what their true cause was (and not "State's rights" bulls**t).

Do you call the kidnapping and/or raping by soldiers of thousands of girls and women a "grace to all humanity?" Do you call decapitating teenage boys and mounting their heads on pikes a "grace to all humanity?" Would you also call the burnings of thousands of homes and farmsteads occupied by innocent women, children, and elderly a "grace to humanity?" Do you call the starvation of civilians to the point of death a "grace to humanity?" These are just a small selection of things that Southerners, seeking nothing more than self-determination, suffered. Think twice before you celebrate and cheer the slaughter and suffering of millions of innocent people. There was nothing graceful about the Civil War.

While some good things did come out of it in the end, the acts of sheer evil that psychopaths such as Sherman and Lincoln carried out to empower themselves can never be forgotten nor forgiven.

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Most of the b******* you described is exactly that. B*******. Heads on pikes? What the hell have you been reading, son? I'm obviously not going to say that no rapes occurred throughout the Civil War, including during Lee's marches North into Antietam and Gettysburg. However, by every reasonable historical account, Sherman's March to the Sea committed incredible, but almost entirely, economic damage rather than human atrocities. Yes, some slaveholders must have been just heartbroken at seeing Tara being burned down and all their dear little pickaninnies whom they loved "like family" being" stolen away by the Yankees", but by and large Miss Scarlet and her ilk remained unscathed, and no one went about putting Ashley's head on a pike.

Seeing that you believe in this type of crap really puts the atrocious quality of your other posts into perspective.

To quote another fine Southern lady, stupid is as stupid does.

[AtorBoltox]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

The majority of southern men opposed secession and hundreds of thousands of them enlisted in the Union army. As for defending their homeland, the Confederacy Union invaded the parts of the south such as East Tennessee  everywhere which opposed supported or opposed secession and crushed their governments . By the end of the war it was a police state with thousands of political prisoners imprisoned without trial and curfews and an internal passport system enforced by vigilante gangs with the central government 'requisitioning' property from people by force to keep the war effort going.

The bolded was carried out by the Union as well, and on a much larger scale. The government of both sides was generally terrible, but I am much more sympathetic to the poor farmers who were fighting to defend their state, their livelihoods, and their families than to the hordes of invaders who came to rape, plunder, and murder, and their sadistic psychopathic warlords like Sherman and Sheridan.

Your sympathies should be with the millions of people who were kept as chattel

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Your ancestors fought to keep millions of men, women and children in bondage, pain and suffering, for the economic benefit of the society in which they lived. I don't care what other excuses they had. Nothing justifies that. Their war, which they began, was unjust. And the biggest tragedy is that, for all the price in blood and death and pain that was paid, their descendents in blood or ideology did not learn that they were wrong.

[ProudModerate2]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Your ancestors fought to keep millions of men, women and children in bondage, pain and suffering, for the economic benefit of the society in which they lived. I don't care what other excuses they had. Nothing justifies that. Their war, which they began, was unjust. And the biggest tragedy is that, for all the price in blood and death and pain that was paid, their descendents in blood or ideology did not learn that they were wrong.

Well, it seems that you got to him before me, Runeghost (Ghost of Ruin), but you have responded exactly as I would have (so thank you).
To just read his (Paulite Hick's) responses is astonishing; it's all about me, my family, my ancestors. Nothing about the horrific blight of people's lives who were enslaved.
It's so pro-Confederate and that "his people" were angles and the North (leaders and soldiers) were all devils, that you almost pass-out in shock to the drivel (or maybe it's very well disguised trolling). Is this the kind of historic garbage that they teach kids in the South?
Wow, just wow.

[IceAgeComing]

Also the reasons that individual people may have fought for the Confederacy are entirely irrelevant when you're talking about the reasons behind the war itself.

To go to another example for a minute: not everyone who fought for Germany in World War 2 was a dedicated Nazi; many of them believed the same things that many are claiming that their Confederate ancestors fought for - indeed the same things that many in every war ever have believed that they are fighting for.  However that clearly wasn't the reason for the war; they were fighting on behalf of an evil government who used them to try (and thankfully fail) to install their poisonous ideology around the world.  Its the same thing for the Confederacy; just because individual people fought for whatever reasons they were still fighting on behalf of a country set up explicitly to protect slavery and the incredibly wealthy landed interests who significantly benefitted from that evil institution.  Many good people sometimes are misled to work on behalf of evil things; and just because they are misled doesn't give us an excuse to mislead future generations about what the origins of the Confederacy were.

[Cold War Liberal]

These two posts, along with the general sentiment that heritage and hate are far from mutually exclusive, sum up my opinions on the Civil War.

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

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Your ancestors fought to keep millions of men, women and children in bondage, pain and suffering, for the economic benefit of the society in which they lived. I don't care what other excuses they had. Nothing justifies that. Their war, which they began, was unjust. And the biggest tragedy is that, for all the price in blood and death and pain that was paid, their descendents in blood or ideology did not learn that they were wrong.

Also the reasons that individual people may have fought for the Confederacy are entirely irrelevant when you're talking about the reasons behind the war itself.

To go to another example for a minute: not everyone who fought for Germany in World War 2 was a dedicated Nazi; many of them believed the same things that many are claiming that their Confederate ancestors fought for - indeed the same things that many in every war ever have believed that they are fighting for.  However that clearly wasn't the reason for the war; they were fighting on behalf of an evil government who used them to try (and thankfully fail) to install their poisonous ideology around the world.  Its the same thing for the Confederacy; just because individual people fought for whatever reasons they were still fighting on behalf of a country set up explicitly to protect slavery and the incredibly wealthy landed interests who significantly benefitted from that evil institution.  Many good people sometimes are misled to work on behalf of evil things; and just because they are misled doesn't give us an excuse to mislead future generations about what the origins of the Confederacy were.

I would love it if all monuments to the human filth who fought for one of the worst "countries" and most despicable causes in human history would be destroyed, though I suppose moving some of them to a museum could be an acceptable compromise. And I say this as someone living in Harford County, Maryland, which wanted to secede and held Confederate sympathies long after the end of the war. I can't go five miles in my own county without seeing the rebel flag or meeting someone who thinks the "south will rise again."  It's disgusting, and anything we can do to educate people on how horrific the CSA and their ideals were is a good thing. We can start by ending the glorification of their leaders.

[Yellowhammer]

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Your ancestors fought to keep millions of men, women and children in bondage, pain and suffering, for the economic benefit of the society in which they lived. I don't care what other excuses they had. Nothing justifies that. Their war, which they began, was unjust. And the biggest tragedy is that, for all the price in blood and death and pain that was paid, their descendents in blood or ideology did not learn that they were wrong.

My ancestors never had any economic benefits from slavery, hell, they lived rougher lives than most slaves did. They fought to defend their homeland against an invading army, and revisionist history will never change that fact.The South did not begin the war, and we will never be wrong for having wanted nothing more than self-determination and sovereignty.

[Stranger in a strange land]

As you have indicated, the vast majority of Confederate monuments were erected in the 1910's & 20's when Southern states were enacting Jim Crow laws.
There was also a significant, yet smaller spike in the 1950's & 60's during the Civil Rights movement.

See this graphic on this website (link below), showing the numbers and distribution of monuments over time. The article also points out that:
The chart illustrates upticks in the construction of Confederate monuments on courthouse grounds after the landmark Plessy v. Ferguson case in 1896 upheld state segregation laws. The construction of monuments outside of schools jumped after the 1954 Brown vs. Board of Education ruling, in which the Supreme Court deemed state laws segregating public schools to be unconstitutional.

So you can drop your "leftists want to abolish place and history" shtick.
All the evidence above shows that Southerners weren't really concerned about "history" when erecting these monuments. But instead, it was about using them as symbols of hate and intimidation.

http://theweek.com/speedreads/718507/striking-graphic-reveals-construction-confederate-monuments-peaked-during-jim-crow-civil-rights-eras

Southern states started enacting Jim Crow laws in the late 19th century, though. Plus, as your graph indicates, the largest spike in public Confederate commemoration was already on the decline when the Klan was reformed in the 1910s. If anything, the strongest correlation is with the aging of Civil War veterans and the passage of the Civil War from people's living memory. Which makes perfect sense.

It "makes perfect sense" to Neo-Nazis, Klansmen and white supremacists.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers bore the brunt of the most destructive war in the history of the United States.

It makes sense to the people whose forefathers' main purpose of fighting was to preserve the act of enslaving other human beings (for money). The fact that they (the South) "bore the brunt" of the American Civil War (versus the North) was both justified and a grace to all humanity.

The vast majority of monuments are depicting their leaders, and not the sheep the leaders employed (and fooled) to fight for them. Their leaders were intelligent (and rich) and knew exactly what their true cause was (and not "State's rights" bulls**t).

Do you call the kidnapping and/or raping by soldiers of thousands of girls and women a "grace to all humanity?" Do you call decapitating teenage boys and mounting their heads on pikes a "grace to all humanity?" Would you also call the burnings of thousands of homes and farmsteads occupied by innocent women, children, and elderly a "grace to humanity?" Do you call the starvation of civilians to the point of death a "grace to humanity?" These are just a small selection of things that Southerners, seeking nothing more than self-determination, suffered. Think twice before you celebrate and cheer the slaughter and suffering of millions of innocent people. There was nothing graceful about the Civil War.

While some good things did come out of it in the end, the acts of sheer evil that psychopaths such as Sherman and Lincoln carried out to empower themselves can never be forgotten nor forgiven.

My ancestors fought to secure freedom and independence for their homeland, and to defend their homes and their families against hostile, pillaging invaders. They went through hell to do it.
They hardly had as much as two coins to rub together, asserting that they were fighting and sacrificing their lives "for money" or to defend some rich peoples' wealth is not so much laughable as it is a horrible distortion of the truth.

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Most of the b******* you described is exactly that. B*******. Heads on pikes? What the hell have you been reading, son? I'm obviously not going to say that no rapes occurred throughout the Civil War, including during Lee's marches North into Antietam and Gettysburg. However, by every reasonable historical account, Sherman's March to the Sea committed incredible, but almost entirely, economic damage rather than human atrocities. Yes, some slaveholders must have been just heartbroken at seeing Tara being burned down and all their dear little pickaninnies whom they loved "like family" being" stolen away by the Yankees", but by and large Miss Scarlet and her ilk remained unscathed, and no one went about putting Ashley's head on a pike.

Seeing that you believe in this type of crap really puts the atrocious quality of your other posts into perspective.

To quote another fine Southern lady, stupid is as stupid does.

Having grown up in Texas during the period that the Lost Cause Ideology was winding down but still influential, I can assure you that if this sort of thing had really happened on any large scale (not saying it didn't happen at all; I wouldn't be surprised if a Union Soldier did put a Confederate Bushwhacker's head on a pike, and there certainly were war rapes, but probably no worse than what happened in any other conflict of the period), I can assure you that every single White Southern Child would have learned about it in school and then sworn undying hatred for the Yankees upon the Altar of Jackson and Lee.