Italian Elections and Politics 2022 - Our Time to Schlein

[CumbrianLefty]

lol

France-Italy banter has reached heights not seen since Italy signed a pact with Prussia in the 19th century.

Mussolini trying and failing to claim some of France for himself in 1940 has to be up there.

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

lol

France-Italy banter has reached heights not seen since Italy signed a pact with Prussia in the 19th century.

Mussolini trying and failing to claim some of France for himself in 1940 has to be up there.

I see everyone here has forgotten Macron recalling his ambassador because Di Maio had met with a leader of the gilets jaunes...

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

Roberto Maroni, former Lega leader, Minister of the Interior in the first and fourth Berlusconi governments (and of Labour in the second and third), president of Lombardy from 2013 to 2018, often intra-party critic both of Bossi earlier and Salvini recently, just died of cancer.

One of the most important politicians of the last thirty years, and while his politics was not at all my cup of tea (or my cup of espresso), it could have been a lot worse. Either way this is sad, he was only 67.

[President Punxsutawney Phil]

lol

France-Italy banter has reached heights not seen since Italy signed a pact with Prussia in the 19th century.

Mussolini trying and failing to claim some of France for himself in 1940 has to be up there.

I see everyone here has forgotten Macron recalling his ambassador because Di Maio had met with a leader of the gilets jaunes...

Tbf, the yellow vests feels like an eternity ago.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

lol

Everything Meloni is saying is correct. I'm unsure why this is funny. Particularly to someone who should be 'anti-imperialist'.

[Antonio the Sixth]

lol

Everything Meloni is saying is correct. I'm unsure why this is funny. Particularly to someone who should be 'anti-imperialist'.

oh, we've got an international political economy expert in chat

Frankly the workings of the Franc CFA system are beyond me as they're beyond like 95% of this forum. I'm sure it's exploitative in some way (like almost all dealings between developed and developing countries are), but no, it doesn't work like Meloni says it does, and there are reasons why these countries (many of which are on pretty bad terms with France right now) find it preferable to having their own national currecy.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

lol

Everything Meloni is saying is correct. I'm unsure why this is funny. Particularly to someone who should be 'anti-imperialist'.

oh, we've got an international political economy expert in chat

Frankly the workings of the Franc CFA system are beyond me as they're beyond like 95% of this forum. I'm sure it's exploitative in some way (like almost all dealings between developed and developing countries are), but no, it doesn't work like Meloni says it does, and there are reasons why these countries (many of which are on pretty bad terms with France right now) find it preferable to having their own national currecy.

They find it preferable because France makes up a gargantuan amount of their trade. Really you are just proving my point. They can't stop using it because France has that much control.

[Antonio the Sixth]

lol

Everything Meloni is saying is correct. I'm unsure why this is funny. Particularly to someone who should be 'anti-imperialist'.

oh, we've got an international political economy expert in chat

Frankly the workings of the Franc CFA system are beyond me as they're beyond like 95% of this forum. I'm sure it's exploitative in some way (like almost all dealings between developed and developing countries are), but no, it doesn't work like Meloni says it does, and there are reasons why these countries (many of which are on pretty bad terms with France right now) find it preferable to having their own national currecy.

They find it preferable because France makes up a gargantuan amount of their trade. Really you are just proving my point. They can't stop using it because France has that much control.

Unequal trade relationships are a ubiquitous feature of the modern global economy. It's bad and it should change, but has nothing to do with a petty feud between two developed Western European countries. Also another important benefit is monetary stability - the same reason why countries used to be on the gold standards during the 19th century and why they tried to set up the Bretton Woods system until Nixon blew it up. It's especially important for developing countries since investors tend to be more sensitive to monetary risks.

Again, I'm not qualified enough to actually discuss the pros and cons here (unlike you, I've actually taken classes in international political economy before, but I'm sensible enough to realize that doesn't make me an expert). But evidently that doesn't stop cheap populist politicians and their moronic Atlas simps from bloviating on the subject.

[Kahane's Grave Is A Gender-Neutral Bathroom]

Why is Meloni going up in the polls? Her average has risen to nearly 30% (almost 1/6 an increase) after two months. I don't think she's done anything positive of note yet, although someone more well-versed on Italian politics can correct me if I'm wrong.

[Cassius]

Why is Meloni going up in the polls? Her average has risen to nearly 30% (almost 1/6 an increase) after two months. I don't think she's done anything positive of note yet, although someone more well-versed on Italian politics can correct me if I'm wrong.

Looks like she’s consolidating more of the right-wing vote behind her now that she’s clearly top dog on the right. Same thing happened for Salvini in the aftermath of 2018, where the Lega bounced very quickly from the 17% it received in the actual election into the low to mid 20s.

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

Why is Meloni going up in the polls? Her average has risen to nearly 30% (almost 1/6 an increase) after two months. I don't think she's done anything positive of note yet, although someone more well-versed on Italian politics can correct me if I'm wrong.

Looks like she’s consolidating more of the right-wing vote behind her now that she’s clearly top dog on the right. Same thing happened for Salvini in the aftermath of 2018, where the Lega bounced very quickly from the 17% it received in the actual election into the low to mid 20s.

Of course, Lega soon started to make further gains by eating into the M5S vote in a way that for obvious reasons is not possible for FdI this time. But that was across a longer timespan (we must not forget that at this point in the legislature in 2018 we were still far from having a new government).

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

It is now official: the Lazio and Lombardy regional elections will be held on February 12th (with a probable extension to the following day in Lombardy), which also happens to be exactly one week before the PD primaries.

In Lazio the PD and allies will run regional minister for health Alessio D'Amato, who is also supported by A/IV, while the Right seems to be still undecided on their candidate and the M5S is in an unclear position but looks more and more likely to go alone despite having been coopted into the Zingaretti administration - the Rome waste-to-energy plant is said to be the big sticking point. In Lombardy the Right is obviously supporting the re-election of president Attilio Fontana, A/IV as said have embraced the candidacy of his former (until the other month) vice president Letizia Moratti, and in the centre-left PD MEP Pierfrancesco Majorino is trying hard to get the Five Stars on board but we still don't know if his will be the only other major candidacy.

The few polls of Lazio seem all over the place and I struggle to make a prediction, while Lombardy is pretty much safe for Fontana although he should only get a plurality.

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

Now that the deadline to present the official candidate lists for the Lazio and Lombardy regional elections has passed, I think it's time to make a recollection post.

LAZIO

Two-term regional president Nicola Zingaretti, best known for being PD secretary from 2019 to 2021 or for being the brother of actor Luca Zingaretti depending on who you ask, resigned a few months ago to take a seat in Parliament. He would not have been eligible to run again anyway. The main candidates are:

Alessio D'Amato, incumbent regional minister for Health. Supported by PD and allies plus A/IV.
Francesco Rocca, president of the Italian Red Cross. Supported by all the Right.
Donatella Bianchi, former president of WWF Italy. Supported by the M5S and a small left-wing list.

There are two minor candidates, Rosa Rinaldi (Unione Popolare) and Sonia Pecorilli (not sure which one of the many parties called "communist" but I think Rizzo's). There have been a few polls and Rocca enjoys a small but consistent lead over D'Amato while Bianchi is taking around 15% of the vote. Rocca would almost certainly lose a one vs one race but alas, apparently agreeing - one way or the other - on the waste-to-energy plant was too much to ask. Probable CDX flip.


LOMBARDY

One-term regional president Attilio Fontana (Lega) is running again with the the support of all the Right despite lackluster approval. His main opponents are:

Pierfrancesco Majorino, member of the EU Parliament for the Democratic Party. Supported by PD, AVS and M5S.
Letizia Moratti, previously Fontana's deputy. Supported by Azione/Italia Viva.

The only other candidate is Mara Ghidorzi (Unione Popolare, supported by various far-left lists). You may notice that More Europe chose not to run at all, displeased both by Moratti and by Majorino's successful courting of the M5S. This race has received I believe even more polling than Lazio, and most of them have Fontana ahead of Majorino but by surprisingly little for a traditional right-wing stronghold at a time when the centre-left is not exactly enjoying much success. Moratti is usually somewhat short of 20% of the vote. Still, I am going to say safe CDX hold.


In other news... The 2023 budget was approved but I didn't follow much because all the coverage seemed awful. I know the citizenship income has been restricted and the flat tax regime for self-employed people has been expanded. The PNRR is starting to be implemented too. Meanwhile, in the Democratic primaries Bonaccini is leading Schlein.
And finally to lift our spirits, Minister of Culture Gennaro Sangiuliano has established himself as this government's meme character, with his recent comments like saying that those who use Anglicisms are "snobbish" and "radical chic" [sic] and calling Dante Alighieri the forefather of the Italian right-wing.

[Logical]

Presented without comment.

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

Presented without comment.

I would be glad if someone helped me figure out why all of my region is Andrea Doria but Genoa is a Jewish man in a tallit (I have already seen the image).

[FrancoAgo]

tu lo sai

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

tu lo sai

Is it because Genoese are stingy (tirchi)? Now that's a big yikes...

[Antonio the Sixth]

In more serious news, the Meloni government is starting to hit its first speed bumps. The most notable one is a strike of gas station attendants that started yesterday (and may or may not continue until tomorrow) in protest against a series of regulation the government passed to curb "speculation" in gas prices. This came after prices rose sharply in the new year following the end of government subsidies that had been enacted in the middle of the oil crisis last year (whereas Meloni had previously promised she would keep those subsidies). Whatever the merits of the proposal, it sure came off like the government was trying to blame gas stations for the outcome of its own policy decisions. Anyway the government seems interested in bringing this to a quick resolution and has already made significant concessions. And while the prices are high, they are significantly down from their peak and likely to fall further, so I don't expect this to be an enormous deal, but it's at least a sign that the honeymoon is over.

The other bubbling controversy is that the government is gearing up for yet another judicial reform that is likely to draw the ire of PD and M5S as well as of the judiciary itself. I don't know why they're so obsessed with relitigating this sh*t all the time, especially now that Berlusconi is close to politically irrelevant, but here we are again. Coming off the heels of the arrest of Messina Denaro, it also doesn't seem like the best optics to talk about reining in overzealous magistrates, but what do I know.

[FrancoAgo]

tu lo sai

Is it because Genoese are stingy (tirchi)? Now that's a big yikes...

sorry i've missed your reply, and actually i don't understand the second part

and yes, are actual stingy is not important all it's the "nomina"

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

tu lo sai

Is it because Genoese are stingy (tirchi)? Now that's a big yikes...

sorry i've missed your reply, and actually i don't understand the second part

and yes, are actual stingy is not important all it's the "nomina"

Oh I just meant it's pretty bad, and it ruins the map for me.

[omar04]

Italy's pandemic recovery plan must halt demographic "tsunami" in south - ISTAT

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/italys-pandemic-recovery-plan-must-halt-demographic-tsunami-south-istat-2023-01-25/

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

The regional president of the Aosta Valley Erik Lavévaz (Union Valdôtaine) resigned last month, as part of a political crisis caused by growing suggestions inside his party to switch sides and go with the right. UV is a regionalist party which is very much an institution in the Valley, and while it currently isn't the largest party in the regional council it is widely understood to be the kingmaker. The party council of UV met yesterday and they narrowly approved a motion that urges a reconsolidation of the previous centre-left majority to elect Lavévaz's successor and to reconvene the party council as soon as possible to discuss the outcome, whereas the minority proposed to automatically start dealing with the right in case the first negotiations fail (without a new council meeting). However, out of those who sit as regional councillors, six out of seven voted for the latter motion, showcasing the split inside the party.

[𝕭𝖆𝖕𝖙𝖎𝖘𝖙𝖆 𝕸𝖎𝖓𝖔𝖑𝖆]

In other news:

The government is involved in its biggest controversy yet. FdI Deputy Giovanni Donzelli made a fiery parliamentary speech where he accused the PD of siding with the Mafia and terrorism (because some of them met in jail with Alfredo Cospito, an anarchist terrorist who's been on hunger strike to protest against the 41bis hard prison regime to which he - and for the most part various Mafia bosses - is subjected) and referenced 'sensitive' information about Cospito, which he later explained he obtained from fellow FdI Deputy Andrea Delmastro Delle Vedove, who is the undesecretary to the ministry of Justice but also happens to be Donzelli's flatmate. Donzelli is also the vice-president of the parliamentary committee on national security... The oppositions have asked for the resignation of both of them, and even Minister of Justice Carlo Nordio (also from FdI) was visibly frustrated at first although he later asserted that none of the information in question was secret. Nordio also "washed his hands" of the matter and said he'll wait for the outcome of an investigation that has been opened by the prosecutor's office in Rome. Regarding the personal accusations, a parliamentary jury of honour has been convened to decide the matter, although I am not sure what its powers are (I had no idea this was even a thing). In all this, Meloni's silence has been very loud.

Roberto Calderoli of Lega has presented the (in)famous differential autonomy bill, also known as Northern supremacism with a human face. The good news is that this announcement may be a ploy for the Lombard regional election and the bill will later be shot down by FdI (or FI).

[Mike88]

Meloni seems to be becoming like your average Premier who promisses a lot of "change" but then... nothing. Actually nothing, neither radical or moderate, just managing daily affairs.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Meloni seems to be becoming like your average Premier who promisses a lot of "change" but then... nothing. Actually nothing, neither radical or moderate, just managing daily affairs.

There are in fact some relatively substantive reforms underway. However, instead of being about the kitchen-table concerns Italians have in their daily lives (and that drove Meloni to power in the first place) they are about the longstanding ideological obsessions of the right. One is judicial reform, always in the direction of sticking it to the judges/prosecutors who are accused of being too hard on politicians (and to be fair there is also a lot of corruption in the Italian judiciary, though not more than in other branches of government). The other is the law on "regional autonomy", which promises to let regions keep a higher share of their tax revenue. Of course that's good news for wealthy regions like the right-wing bastions of Lombardy and Veneto, and less good news for the South which is a lot more dependent on state support. So Meloni is definitely getting busy in government - but her priorities aren't exactly those of ordinary Italians.