Poorly Understood Distinction- Social Conservatism vs. Cultural Conservatism

[100% pro-life no matter what]

No one understands the difference between these two groups, but they come from extremely different philosophies.  That's not to say that a lot of social conservatives don't believe parts of cultural conservatism (though, it would be difficult to believe all and be logically consistent) and vice versa, but they come from different places.  I've been thinking about making this thread for a while, but the Stewart election really made me pull the trigger on this:

Social Conservatism- Rooted in support for traditional moral values, often through Christianity (or some sects of Judaism/Islam).  The issues that they care about are issues of the moral majority.  Abortion and gay/transgender issues get the most attention, but most of these voters are also opposed to secularism in general and to specific things like casual sex and pornography, at least on a personal basis.

Cultural Conservatism- This is based in a desire to conserve a type of culture.  This often manifests itself in opposing immigration and Islam, as well as some other race-based controversies.  It is not always explicitly racist, but it can get there on the fringe.  The alt-right and alt-light are extreme examples of cultural conservatism, but not all cultural conservatives go that far.  Still, its motivations are diametrically opposed to the motivations of social conservatism and people in this group are relatively secular in outlook.  Most don't care about abortion or if they do, it's only because SJW feminists support it.  Likewise, they may support pornography because some feminists don't like it.  It's all about getting back at any group trying to change the culture.

The two groups, while neither on board completely, would say very different things about the #MeToo movement, for example:

Social Conservatives: "None of this would be happening if it weren't for the sexual revolution and the acceptance of meaningless sex and lack of family values"

Cultural Conservatives: "Who cares about the allegations.  They're all from SJW feminazis anyway.  Ignore them."

[Dr. MB]

Yeah, there is an important distinction.

Someone like you I'd definitely classify as a social conservative, someone like Trump is more of a cultural conservative.

[darklordoftech]

So the people who opposed the hippies in the 1960s were social conservatives while the Know-Nothings were cultural conservatives?

[支持核绿派 (Greens4Nuclear)]

So basically social conservatism = black and Latino people voting Yes on Proposition 8, cultural conservatism = Chinese immigrants complaining about sanctuary cities/affirmative action/“political correctness”.

[DC Al Fine]

No one understands the difference between these two groups, but they come from extremely different philosophies.  That's not to say that a lot of social conservatives don't believe parts of cultural conservatism (though, it would be difficult to believe all and be logically consistent) and vice versa, but they come from different places.  I've been thinking about making this thread for a while, but the Stewart election really made me pull the trigger on this:

Social Conservatism- Rooted in support for traditional moral values, often through Christianity (or some sects of Judaism/Islam).  The issues that they care about are issues of the moral majority.  Abortion and gay/transgender issues get the most attention, but most of these voters are also opposed to secularism in general and to specific things like casual sex and pornography, at least on a personal basis.

Cultural Conservatism- This is based in a desire to conserve a type of culture.  This often manifests itself in opposing immigration and Islam, as well as some other race-based controversies.  It is not always explicitly racist, but it can get there on the fringe.  The alt-right and alt-light are extreme examples of cultural conservatism, but not all cultural conservatives go that far.  Still, its motivations are diametrically opposed to the motivations of social conservatism and people in this group are relatively secular in outlook.  Most don't care about abortion or if they do, it's only because SJW feminists support it.  Likewise, they may support pornography because some feminists don't like it.  It's all about getting back at any group trying to change the culture.

The two groups, while neither on board completely, would say very different things about the #MeToo movement, for example:

Social Conservatives: "None of this would be happening if it weren't for the sexual revolution and the acceptance of meaningless sex and lack of family values"

Cultural Conservatives: "Who cares about the allegations.  They're all from SJW feminazis anyway.  Ignore them."

It's an important distinction to make. It helps explain things like why Donald Trump did so poorly in the GOP primaries among churchgoers and why relatively secular Chinese voters are flocking to the Tories en masse.

[Del Tachi]

There certainly is an important distinction between the two, but I think we'd be remiss to define "cultural conservatism" by its more radical alt-right/neo-nazi fringes.  Mainline "Protestant work ethic" type voters would be more representative of cultural conservatism to me, and those voters have historically been the GOP's base in the non-Evangelical Midwest and Northeast.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

By this standard, social conservatism is the defeated, uncool; whereas cultural conservatives are the ones who get to have fun on twitter and appeal to teenagers.

Well yes. You get your premarital sex and your hatred of immigrants!

Dropping the sarcasm and character assassination though, it would be fair to say that I know at least a few people that would fall under ER’s umbrella of “cultural conservatism” while lacking, let’s say, spirituality. If you want to paint with a broad brush, there are a number of younger, secular males who find current fads among gender theory ridiculous and associate it with “the left” in general. The other type are far more easily identified as being in the “churchy” crowd.

[darklordoftech]

Would it be acccurate to say that the Clintons angered the social conservatives more while Obama angered the cultural conservatives more?

[RINO Tom]

Would it be acccurate to say that the Clintons angered the social conservatives more while Obama angered the cultural conservatives more?

Probably, as exit polls and county results suggest that a decent chunk of "cultural conservatives" (I'm thinking, for example, a very nationalistic, somewhat xenophobic blue collar worker in New Jersey who prefers traditional aspects of daily life, for example) voted for Clinton.

[All Along The Watchtower]

I sometimes consider myself an adherent to the latter (not in every respect, mind you), but certainly not the former, although I recognize that connotations and definitions of these terms are vague, broad, muddled, or just plain varied in The Discourse.

[TPIG]

I completely agree with your analysis and have noticed this distinction a lot in recent years. I, myself, am a social conservative who's also a cultural moderate; I have no issue with legal immigration or cultural diversity but tend to be more conservative on things like respecting the flag, the Pledge of Allegiance, and the national anthem.

[PSOL]

If a divide exists it overlaps heavily more often then not.

[darklordoftech]

Dubya would be an example of someone who is a social conservative but isn't a cultural conservative. People who talk about "the regressive left" are cultural conservatives but might not be social conservatives.

[Saint Milei]

social con: bachmann huckabee ben carson ted cruz

cultural con: russell kirk, pat buchanan, ron paul (slightly) etc


to put it in perspective, cultural conservatives tend to be paleoconservatives and are more aligned with the "Old Right".

[Kingpoleon]

Rooted in support for traditional moral values, often through Christianity (or some sects of Judaism/Islam).  The issues that they care about are issues of the moral majority.  Abortion and gay/transgender issues get the most attention, but most of these voters are also opposed to secularism in general and to specific things like casual sex and pornography, at least on a personal basis.

Speaking as someone who personally disapproves of premarital sex, I tend to understand this kind of thinking far more. What I don’t understand is opposing secularism - separating the state and the church.

“During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution. Enquire of the Teachers of Christianity for the ages in which it appeared in its greatest lustre; those of every sect, point to the ages prior to its incorporation with Civil policy.” - James Madison

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https://www.intellectualtakeout.org/blog/james-madison-separation-church-and-state

[Santander]

Nihilist Christians are the best.