Russia Likely Picked Our Secretary of State

[Don Vito Corleone]

https://twitter.com/thedemocrats/status/260497619862835201

who care

That post really does encapsulate the major criticisms of him for at least as long as I've been on the Atlas. Like, I get it. Obama criticized Romney for acting like Russia is a major enemy still. He was wrong. Obama also really dropped the ball by not realizing what was going on in 2016 and then acting too late, and ineffectively when he did. He let Republicans and Russia walk all over us (and Democrats). I can't emphasize that enough, and I'm pretty sure most users here are aware of these things...

...but why keep bringing it up? What does it add? jfern does this constantly, and with a number of other things. He brings up stuff that he feels are hypocritical or perhaps serve as a "gotcha" to the person in question (and with Hillary, often NOT the person in question...), and he'll do it even when it adds nothing to the thread and often has little to do with the subject at hand. This was always and still is my primary issue with jfern - it's like all that runs through his head is negativity and how persons x, y and z are hypocrites or liars or whatever. This constant score keeping where his sole reason for existing is to make sure people are aware of their transgressions or fumbles.

Anyway, I'll just end that rant here (or maybe not, seeing as I'm easy to prod into arguments). I'm just tired of seeing the same Obama: Russia is so 20th century thing constantly brought up in discussions where it serves no useful purpose. We get it. He screwed up!

If I had to guess, and I could be wrong, but Jfern doesn't think Russia hacked the election if I had to guess at this point, and thinks its hypocritical that Dems have gone from dovish to trying to create in what his view is a new Cold War, and also think it's hypocritical that we accuse Russia for interfering in our election when we interfere in other countries elections. I don't really agree because 1) Russia is trying to influence the democratic process, which isn't ok no matter the whataboutism and 2) Russia needs to pay some sort of price and you could do that without starting a war.

What about the Saudi princes who own billions of dollars worth of CNN? I bet a lot of Correct The Record employees were from India. There was some Ukrainian support for Hillary. The Israeli support for Trump was proven. There was China for Bill Clinton in 1996. I'm sure one can go on and on about foreign influence, but we only hear about Russia.

Oh, come on. You're fully aware of the fact that there's a huge difference between rooting for a certain candidate and actually working hard to get him elected by conning the people of the country where you're intervening. Russia was absolutely proven to be systematically using fake news and hacking to disparage Clinton and the Democratic Party. It's a fact, and their involvement goes much deeper than that.

All the fake news I saw was from Correct The Record. Were all of their employees Americans? I doubt it. There's certainly some talk of Ukraine being connected there, but I'll leave the crazy conspiracy theories for you guys.

I know you're not a big fan of U.S. security agencies like the FBI, but please. These agencies have all agreed that Russia was deeply involved in trying to turn the U.S. election, and with all due respect, each of them has much more tools and knowledge than you ever will.

In 2003, we heard about how all the intelligence agencies had confirmed that Iraq had WMD. Yeah, I'm not buying it. There's zero evidence that Russia was involved in the DNC leak. And the 13 Russians who were indicted were some serious small fry. And there's the irony that the Clinton administration bragged about influencing the re-election of the guy who picked Putin as his successor. Putin sucks, but Bill Clinton isn't exactly free of blame for him being in power. Also, your pal Bush said he looked into his soul and said he was a good person.

What you're saying here is no different to when Climate Change deniers say "Scientists were wrong about this one thing once, therefore we can ignore everything they say on a completely unrelated topic".

[○∙◄☻¥tπ[╪AV┼cVê└]

https://twitter.com/thedemocrats/status/260497619862835201

who care

That post really does encapsulate the major criticisms of him for at least as long as I've been on the Atlas. Like, I get it. Obama criticized Romney for acting like Russia is a major enemy still. He was wrong. Obama also really dropped the ball by not realizing what was going on in 2016 and then acting too late, and ineffectively when he did. He let Republicans and Russia walk all over us (and Democrats). I can't emphasize that enough, and I'm pretty sure most users here are aware of these things...

...but why keep bringing it up? What does it add? jfern does this constantly, and with a number of other things. He brings up stuff that he feels are hypocritical or perhaps serve as a "gotcha" to the person in question (and with Hillary, often NOT the person in question...), and he'll do it even when it adds nothing to the thread and often has little to do with the subject at hand. This was always and still is my primary issue with jfern - it's like all that runs through his head is negativity and how persons x, y and z are hypocrites or liars or whatever. This constant score keeping where his sole reason for existing is to make sure people are aware of their transgressions or fumbles.

Anyway, I'll just end that rant here (or maybe not, seeing as I'm easy to prod into arguments). I'm just tired of seeing the same Obama: Russia is so 20th century thing constantly brought up in discussions where it serves no useful purpose. We get it. He screwed up!

If I had to guess, and I could be wrong, but Jfern doesn't think Russia hacked the election if I had to guess at this point, and thinks its hypocritical that Dems have gone from dovish to trying to create in what his view is a new Cold War, and also think it's hypocritical that we accuse Russia for interfering in our election when we interfere in other countries elections. I don't really agree because 1) Russia is trying to influence the democratic process, which isn't ok no matter the whataboutism and 2) Russia needs to pay some sort of price and you could do that without starting a war.

What about the Saudi princes who own billions of dollars worth of CNN? I bet a lot of Correct The Record employees were from India. There was some Ukrainian support for Hillary. The Israeli support for Trump was proven. There was China for Bill Clinton in 1996. I'm sure one can go on and on about foreign influence, but we only hear about Russia.

Oh, come on. You're fully aware of the fact that there's a huge difference between rooting for a certain candidate and actually working hard to get him elected by conning the people of the country where you're intervening. Russia was absolutely proven to be systematically using fake news and hacking to disparage Clinton and the Democratic Party. It's a fact, and their involvement goes much deeper than that.

All the fake news I saw was from Correct The Record. Were all of their employees Americans? I doubt it. There's certainly some talk of Ukraine being connected there, but I'll leave the crazy conspiracy theories for you guys.

I know you're not a big fan of U.S. security agencies like the FBI, but please. These agencies have all agreed that Russia was deeply involved in trying to turn the U.S. election, and with all due respect, each of them has much more tools and knowledge than you ever will.

In 2003, we heard about how all the intelligence agencies had confirmed that Iraq had WMD. Yeah, I'm not buying it. There's zero evidence that Russia was involved in the DNC leak. And the 13 Russians who were indicted were some serious small fry. And there's the irony that the Clinton administration bragged about influencing the re-election of the guy who picked Putin as his successor. Putin sucks, but Bill Clinton isn't exactly free of blame for him being in power. Also, your pal Bush said he looked into his soul and said he was a good person.

What you're saying here is no different to when Climate Change deniers say "Scientists were wrong about this one thing once, therefore we can ignore everything they say on a completely unrelated topic".

LOL at trying to equate the propaganda machine for the military industrial complex to science.