France 2017: Results Thread

[JA]

If Le Pen doesn't make it, I'm going to put a hole through my wall

That's an odd way to celebrate

[JA]

In election after election across the West, the Left has collapsed and the Right has either collapsed or adapted itself to the Far-Right. Each election has shown the "new left" being composed of white collar and minority, neoliberal, globalists against working and middle class nationalists. This does not bode well for those of us who support a Left detached from neoliberalism.

[JA]

In election after election across the West, the Left has collapsed and the Right has either collapsed or adapted itself to the Far-Right. Each election has shown the "new left" being composed of white collar and minority, neoliberal, globalists against working and middle class nationalists. This does not bode well for those of us who support a Left detached from neoliberalism.

If it helps, the left here in Spain went from around 35% to about 42% (PSOE dropped 5 points, but Podemos/IU tripled their share). Plus our voting patterns do not resemble what you say at all. (either that or everyone is part of the "new left")

The Iberian Peninsula really defies this overarching downfall of the left narrative. Portugal more than Spain but still.  

The same applies to Greece, in many ways. Which raises the question of what potential factor(s) might set those countries apart politically from the rest of the "West"? But even with that stated, the mainstream left in those countries have been severely disrupted with the rise of new or alternative left-wing parties (that aren't neoliberal).

[JA]

In election after election across the West, the Left has collapsed and the Right has either collapsed or adapted itself to the Far-Right. Each election has shown the "new left" being composed of white collar and minority, neoliberal, globalists against working and middle class nationalists. This does not bode well for those of us who support a Left detached from neoliberalism.

And what about Corbyn? He's certainly not neoliberal, but he'll get demolished.

That's part of my point. With Corbyn at its head, the Labour Party is crashing. This is not solely his fault; there are multiple factors at play causing this dramatic decline. But he has been unable to unify the anti-Brexit vote in the same way that Conservatives have unified the pro-Brexit vote; if Labour could accomplish this, they'd be performing considerably better today.

[JA]

In election after election across the West, the Left has collapsed and the Right has either collapsed or adapted itself to the Far-Right. Each election has shown the "new left" being composed of white collar and minority, neoliberal, globalists against working and middle class nationalists. This does not bode well for those of us who support a Left detached from neoliberalism.

If it helps, the left here in Spain went from around 35% to about 42% (PSOE dropped 5 points, but Podemos/IU tripled their share). Plus our voting patterns do not resemble what you say at all. (either that or everyone is part of the "new left")

The Iberian Peninsula really defies this overarching downfall of the left narrative. Portugal more than Spain but still.  

The same applies to Greece, in many ways. Which raises the question of what potential factor(s) might set those countries apart politically from the rest of the "West"? But even with that stated, the mainstream left in those countries have been severely disrupted with the rise of new or alternative left-wing parties (that aren't neoliberal).

Probably because those countries were affected by military juntas a few decades ago. Their political story developed differently from other countries in Europe.

That's what I was thinking as well. That seems to be the only unifying factor of all three countries.

[JA]

In election after election across the West, the Left has collapsed and the Right has either collapsed or adapted itself to the Far-Right. Each election has shown the "new left" being composed of white collar and minority, neoliberal, globalists against working and middle class nationalists. This does not bode well for those of us who support a Left detached from neoliberalism.

I understand your frustration I really do.

But just remember that this wave of populism had been 30-35 years in the making. Rright now it's more centered towards the right wing; but plenty of left wing populist movements are either forming or thriving. If the right wing populists either fail to win power or enact serious positive change then you'll see the next global phase be geared towards populist leftism.

No, that won't happen, unless these populist leftists oppose multiculturalism and immigration. The "economic anxiety" nonsense isn't worth much. People just don't want to live in a multicultural country.

I'm afraid you're correct. Our current thinking is still stuck in a 20th century left/right political dichotomy, whereas the new left/right is emerging before our very eyes without us seeing it clearly. Bernie is the last gasp of a dying era, not the dawn of a new one. The future is a battle between globalization and nationalism in the world's most multicultural, globalized countries. Whether you're left or right depends on your position on this new spectrum.

[JA]

Found this humorous...

You must be logged in to read this quote.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_58feec89e4b0b6f6014a54b6

[JA]

Far from a Macron fan, but it's beautiful to see Le Pen go down in flames.

[JA]

If the exit polls hold, Le Pen has a legitimate claim that the former president of the US illegally interfered in the French election

The Eiffel Tower will become a minaret in 5 years.

You are going to have to step on the backs of millions of flip flopping Muslims in Paris Streets 5 times a day to get to your job - France is Gone.

Add France to that travel ban just keep it over there. No terrorists allowed here in TRUMP COUNTRY

Au revoir France. See you in a few years when you need America to come to your rescue again.

Have fun with your little muslim friends, France. We'll just be over here locking them up and kicking them out. You're welcome to cone over here to the US where it's safe though

Anti-white pro-islam globalists are being (re)elected all over Europe. Rutte in the Netherlands, Van der Bellen in Austria, the French just elected Macron over Le Pen and the Germans either will be reelecting Merkel, or Schulz, who is even worse than Merkel.

It's like Europeans have lost the will to live

France conquered by Globalists. This was the last chance for a once great country, now the country is lost forever. The brave men and women who fought in the French resistance in WWII will be spinning in their graves

Time to get out the popcorn and watch the holocaust that is France.

Breitbart is a gold mine

[JA]

2nd round vote by 1st round voters:

Not surprising, large chunk of the left throwing a tantrum there. "Marcon and LePen are the sames!!1!1!1".

53% of Mélenchon voters supported FBM, but only 48% of Fillon's did, but of course a right-winger like you only takes issue with the former.

Generally the right always turns out, the left doesn't. It goes for far stricter purity tests so they'd prefer LePen winning than holding their nose and making sure it doesn't happen. White privilege at it's finest!

"Vote for our awful candidate who violates your values and convictions or else we'll invoke the White Privilege card against you!!!"

[JA]

2nd round vote by 1st round voters:

Not surprising, large chunk of the left throwing a tantrum there. "Marcon and LePen are the sames!!1!1!1".

53% of Mélenchon voters supported FBM, but only 48% of Fillon's did, but of course a right-winger like you only takes issue with the former.

Generally the right always turns out, the left doesn't. It goes for far stricter purity tests so they'd prefer LePen winning than holding their nose and making sure it doesn't happen. White privilege at it's finest!

"Vote for our awful candidate who violates your values and convictions or else we'll invoke the White Privilege card against you!!!"

Well you certainly don't see minorities doing that. They don't really have a choice, they know that one side wants them basically dead and the other doesn't, they may not like them but they'll still vote for him. You only see it with middle and well to do whites so I don't know how else you would describe it.

Ah yes, because there are zero non-Whites who voted third party or abstained in the American election or in the French election. And you know that how, exactly?

[JA]

2nd round vote by 1st round voters:

Not surprising, large chunk of the left throwing a tantrum there. "Marcon and LePen are the sames!!1!1!1".

53% of Mélenchon voters supported FBM, but only 48% of Fillon's did, but of course a right-winger like you only takes issue with the former.

Generally the right always turns out, the left doesn't. It goes for far stricter purity tests so they'd prefer LePen winning than holding their nose and making sure it doesn't happen. White privilege at it's finest!

"Vote for our awful candidate who violates your values and convictions or else we'll invoke the White Privilege card against you!!!"

I'd say there is a big difference - you can imagine some people voting Fillon would actually consider themselves more aligned with Le Pen than with Macron.

Melenchon voters on the other hand are just being silly when not backing Macron.

Why? What did Macron offer that would be attractive to Melenchon voters? And don't mention Le Pen in your response; I don't want to hear how Macron was better as a reason.

[JA]

Time to get rid of the myth that nationalist choices always have better polling results than polls show. It actually works both ways: Brexit and Trump on one side but Le Pen and Hofer on the other. It only creates unpredictibility.

59-41 for Macron, with over 6 million votes counted, of some about 35 million expected.

Not just Le Pen and Hofer; according to this tweet by Nate Silver, this is the sixth European election in a row where the nationalist candidate under-performed their poll numbers.

It's wonderful to see the far-right sputtering in Europe and unable to even win a plurality in the American Presidential Election. However, part of the reason seems to be the co-opting of far-right rhetoric and policies by more mainstream parties, such as the Dutch VVD, the Republicans with Fillon in France, the Tories in the UK, and almost all mainstream parties in Denmark.

[JA]

2nd round vote by 1st round voters:

Not surprising, large chunk of the left throwing a tantrum there. "Marcon and LePen are the sames!!1!1!1".

53% of Mélenchon voters supported FBM, but only 48% of Fillon's did, but of course a right-winger like you only takes issue with the former.

Generally the right always turns out, the left doesn't. It goes for far stricter purity tests so they'd prefer LePen winning than holding their nose and making sure it doesn't happen. White privilege at it's finest!

"Vote for our awful candidate who violates your values and convictions or else we'll invoke the White Privilege card against you!!!"

I'd say there is a big difference - you can imagine some people voting Fillon would actually consider themselves more aligned with Le Pen than with Macron.

Melenchon voters on the other hand are just being silly when not backing Macron.

Why? What did Macron offer that would be attractive to Melenchon voters? And don't mention Le Pen in your response; I don't want to hear how Macron was better as a reason.

If you're left you should prefer a liberal to a fascist. If you're a conservative it's plausible you might prefer a fascist. Also, my answer was quite literally tongue-in-cheek.

Sorry about that, it's a common argument made and the internet is a notoriously difficult place to detect sarcasm. But yes, in general a liberal is preferable to a fascist. I don't deny being very happy to see Le Pen routed like this. Unfortunately, it also means Macron, with his awful economic agenda, will become President. Time for the French left to turnout for the parliamentary elections.

[JA]

Haha so many leftists who claim Le Pen is a fascist. It's amazing how s*** like this continues

Can we just have a Brown avatar already?

We already have a maroon for Socialists.

Why would we need that when the R blue avatar is essentially that now anyway?