Austrian Elections & Politics 2.0 (Presidential runoff re-vote: 4 Dec. 2016)

[BigSkyBob]

Van der Bellen posters also get destroyed:

And, these were criminal acts, by criminals, who were attacking the very basis of democracy whose acts ought not of been given an English voice.

[Omega21]

I am astonished at how little knowledge of the real world these people have, guess 70 years of prosperity and a high living standard makes them think everyone in the world is Polite, Educated and brought by Western standards..

Well, they certainly have never met you.

This is, actually, a very serious point. For 70 years Europe (and the West in general) had the immunity - after the horror of the last War, that generation did not need to learn history to know why liberalism is important. That generation is gone, and it turns out the immunity was temporary. Alas, given the trends it is quite likely the new innoculation will be happening spontaneously pretty soon. Every vote for Hofer and the like is a vote for a major European war. I am afraid, those kids - nor the rest of us - will have a chance to enjoy peace and prospertiy much longer.

And you think deleting every border in the World is a smart decision?

Do you really think letting in Radicals of all sorts will help the problem, because if that didn't happen in the first place I'm not sure we would be having 9/11, London, Brussels, Paris, Nice, Germany (the most recent attacks)

And that's just the top of the Iceberg. If you follow any sort of Austrian media, just search for Volk Fest. Seems that some nice Afghans and Syrians had a good time with Austrian women, without their consent of course.

So every vote for VdB will not make this worse (because presidents do sh**t all), but it would be a signal that the people still want more and more of this BS.

I assume you are from Mexico, 1.5% (about 150k) of the Austrian population are Asylum Seekers. 850 Euros/Month each, and most usually get more.

So, since Mexico has 119 Million Residents, 1.5% of that is  about 1.800.000.

So if you want to be as nice as Austria, please accept 1.800.000 Refugees and pay them out a Minimum of 850Euro (1000$) Monthly.

But I doubt that is ever going to happen, so stop pouring salt on the brains of Europeans who have given out more than Mexico will in 5 Centuries.

And you really have never been to Europe if you think "Big Bad Hofer" will cause a 3rd World War. FPO is Right Wing, but that's where it stops.

Look up NPD and Golden Dawn, those are one of the only neo-Nazi parties left in Europe. And guess what, they have close to no votes.


UPDATE:

Vdb says he hopes that the Vote will still be in 2016, but we can expect a delay of at least up to November, unless the government has some magic solution to the Glue problem.

http://www.krone.at/oesterreich/van-der-bellen-werden-klebstoffkrise-loesen-hoffentlich-2016-story-528887

[Tender Branson]

Why the  do you even need postal votes? If people are too lazy to vote IRL then that's no big loss.

Because it's good for people who are on vacation on election day, or people who have to work on Sundays.

The postal vote is not the problem really, it's the recent chain of unfortunate events in this single election which is the problem. If they used the right glue at the printing factory, all of this wouldn't be a problem now. That is a problem that the Ministry could have never seen coming. The postal vote option itself is just fine.

[Tender Branson]

Despite the fact that the election might be delayed by 1 or 2 months because of "glue-gate", the FPÖ and Norbert Hofer had their campaign kickoff event in Wels today, which was attended by 5000+ people, which held signs with Hofer-faces in their air to suggest they are all "Hofers" ...



Of course, the Interior Ministry was also attacked for not being able to handle the re-vote the correct way and the immigration policy of the government.

https://kurier.at/politik/inland/norbert-hofer-kritisiert-beim-wahlkampfauftakt-die-migrationspolitik-und-wahlbehoerde/220.462.675

[Tender Branson]

A delay of the election is now almost a certainty, with SPÖ/ÖVP/Greens/NEOS in favour and the FPÖ mixed (or against) it.

The FPÖ (and the TS) prefer the election still to be held on Oct. 2, they simply want the damaged ballots that were already sent to voters be replaced with new ballots. Hofer said he's OK with the delay, but Strache plays the attack dog - saying that the other parties deliberately want to delay the election because Hofer is doing so well in the polls ...

Of course, election law does not say anything about "delaying an election to a later date", except if a candidate dies.

Which means both chambers of parliament first have to draft and pass a new amended election law in the next weeks to delay the election ...

All regular ballots and all postal ballots have to be printed again (because the date on the ballot also changes), costing another 10-15 million € ...

[Tender Branson]

There were many meetings over the weekend between party officials, candidate representatives and the Interior Ministry and they are talking again in the evening and tomorrow morning.

Looks like the election delay is a done deal, which will be announced tomorrow at noon by the Interior Minister.

The law needs to be amended now, which takes some time and the FPÖ has said it will vote for the law as well.

The delayed election will now most likely take place in late November, in December or in January.

http://derstandard.at/2000044190295/Krisenstab-im-Innenministerium-tagt-zur-Verschiebung-der-Stichwahl

[PresidentSamTilden]

There were many meetings over the weekend between party officials, candidate representatives and the Interior Ministry and they are talking again in the evening and tomorrow morning.

Looks like the election delay is a done deal, which will be announced tomorrow at noon by the Interior Minister.

The law needs to be amended now, which takes some time and the FPÖ has said it will vote for the law as well.

The delayed election will now most likely take place in late November, in December or in January.

http://derstandard.at/2000044190295/Krisenstab-im-Innenministerium-tagt-zur-Verschiebung-der-Stichwahl

You guys might as well just make your current guy president for life. If every little problem is gonna postpone the election or cause a recount you're never gonna get this done. lol.

[Tender Branson]

There were many meetings over the weekend between party officials, candidate representatives and the Interior Ministry and they are talking again in the evening and tomorrow morning.

Looks like the election delay is a done deal, which will be announced tomorrow at noon by the Interior Minister.

The law needs to be amended now, which takes some time and the FPÖ has said it will vote for the law as well.

The delayed election will now most likely take place in late November, in December or in January.

http://derstandard.at/2000044190295/Krisenstab-im-Innenministerium-tagt-zur-Verschiebung-der-Stichwahl

You guys might as well just make your current guy president for life. If every little problem is gonna postpone the election or cause a recount you're never gonna get this done. lol.

Voters have every right to have a clean election and that each and every of their votes are counted. If the glue comes off from postal ballots, which are then falling apart - it's a huge problem.

Of course it's a nasty thing and a bad chain of idiotic fu**ups, but if it means that the re-vote will be clean with the new ballots printed, I'm all for it. As are most voters I guess.

[Tender Branson]

Interesting:

SPÖ and ÖVP want to update the number of voters, if the election is delayed to a later date.

Since the original April election, about 35.000 people have died - but 35.000 people also reached voting age. These new voters would have been not allowed to vote, because of the cutoff date in April. Because the new election could take place in 2017, about 50.000 young voters would be unable to vote, despite reaching voting age. The major parties now want to fix this.

This is also good news for VdB, because first-time-voters tend to vote for VdB over Hofer.

[ag]

Voters have every right ... that each and every of their votes are counted.

It is impossible. Never happened in history in any country in the world. Not even possible theoretically. The only way to achieve it is to abolish voting completely.

[DavidB.]

Interesting:

SPÖ and ÖVP want to update the number of voters, if the election is delayed to a later date.

Since the original April election, about 35.000 people have died - but 35.000 people also reached voting age. These new voters would have been not allowed to vote, because of the cutoff date in April. Because the new election could take place in 2017, about 50.000 young voters would be unable to vote, despite reaching voting age. The major parties now want to fix this.

This is also good news for VdB, because first-time-voters tend to vote for VdB over Hofer.

Which, of course, is exactly why SPÖ and ÖVP want it.

[President Johnson]

BREAKING: (German) Tagesschau now reports that election will be delayed. LOL!

[aross]

Confirmed. Will now be held either on the 27th November or 4th December. Sobotka also asks parliament to pass a constitutional amendment (lol, as usual) to add newly enfranchised voters to the rolls. Jesus, this country.

Don't tell me you don't miss him.

[President Johnson]

Confirmed. Will now be held either on the 27th November or 4th December. Sobotka also asks parliament to pass a constitutional amendment (lol, as usual) to add newly enfranchised voters to the rolls. Jesus, this country.

Don't tell me you don't miss him.

Don't you want be part of Germany again? I suggest we take Christian Kern as chancellor and get rid of Merkel. I think that would be a good idea...

[aross]

Confirmed. Will now be held either on the 27th November or 4th December. Sobotka also asks parliament to pass a constitutional amendment (lol, as usual) to add newly enfranchised voters to the rolls. Jesus, this country.

Don't tell me you don't miss him.

Don't you want be part of Germany again? I suggest we take Christian Kern as chancellor and get rid of Merkel. I think that would be a good idea...

But donchanow Merkel is the German left now because muh refugees. At least that's what my Facebook feed tells me.

I wouldn't want to impose either Kern or Team Proporz on you, nor do I wish to be burdened with the hive of evil that is the CSU or have to pretend to like the descending hordes of Piefkes.  I'll settle for Vienna as the capital and Chancellor Gregor Gysi.

[Tender Branson]

Update:

The re-vote will take place on December 4 now. This was just recently confirmed.

Also, the private printing company (which produced the crappy postal ballots) was dumped and the new postal ballots will now be printed by the State Printery, using regular envelopes (like those used before 2009) and not glued-together envelopes.

All postal ballots that were requested and sent back until now are ruled invalid. Everyone needs to request the new postal ballots ...

[Tender Branson]

Also, like aross already said:

SPÖ, ÖVP, Greens and NEOS have agreed to update the voter list for the delayed election.

This will add the roughly 50.000 new voters who reached voting age between April and December.

Since SPÖ, ÖVP, Greens and NEOS have a 2/3 majority in parliament to pass it - the support of the FPÖ and TS is meaningless on this issue. According to "exit polls", first-time voters lean to VdB, but the margin of error is high. It would be foolish for the FPÖ to vote against updating the voter list.

[Tender Branson]

Also, like aross already said:

SPÖ, ÖVP, Greens and NEOS have agreed to update the voter list for the delayed election.

This will add the roughly 50.000 new voters who reached voting age between April and December.

Since SPÖ, ÖVP, Greens and NEOS have a 2/3 majority in parliament to pass it - the support of the FPÖ and TS is meaningless on this issue. According to "exit polls", first-time voters lean to VdB, but the margin of error is high. It would be foolish for the FPÖ to vote against updating the voter list.

Update:

FPÖ General Secretary Kickl says the FPÖ will vote for the inclusion of the new first-time voters.

[aross]

Also, like aross already said:

SPÖ, ÖVP, Greens and NEOS have agreed to update the voter list for the delayed election.

This will add the roughly 50.000 new voters who reached voting age between April and December.

Since SPÖ, ÖVP, Greens and NEOS have a 2/3 majority in parliament to pass it - the support of the FPÖ and TS is meaniningless on this issue. According to "exit polls", first-time voters lean to VdB, but the margin of error is high. It would be foolish for the FPÖ to vote against updating the voter list.

Now, a sub-50k margin, another bullsh**t line of reasoning (this time probably involving the ECHR so as not to go ultra vires) and a Constitutional Court that continues to annoyingly excel at trolling and we're all set for Round 4: PCC by-election turnout Boogaloo.

[ag]

All this, frankly, is because of the fundamental intellectual dishonesty "of counting the very last vote". The honest thing would be to acknowledge, that every measurement has an error - and that includes vote counting. When elections are these close, really, it is called a tie. It would be much more honest to simply choose by tossing a coin. Which is, in fact, is what pretty much happens anyway.

[Tender Branson]

Update:

All party representatives and the Interior Ministry task force have agreed to amend the law to count all postal votes on election night already, not the Monday after the election.



Good news. Previously, they wanted to amend the law after the election was held, now we already get the final result on Dec. 4 !

[Tender Branson]

This is also interesting:

The Interior Ministry outsourced the printing of the postal ballots about a decade ago to a private company, because of an EU directive - which opened the bidding process to private companies. Before that, the state printery had a monopoly status on such things (like printing passports etc.)

So, you can also blame the EU for the f**k up ...

Anyway, there's an investigation going on right now about the glue-issue in the private company, also in the direction of deliberate manipulation by unknown people ...

Thank goodness the state printery takes this over again. Better print official state documents by the state-owned company rather than private companies.

[aross]

Update:

All party representatives and the Interior Ministry task force have agreed to amend the law to count all postal votes on election night already, not the Monday after the election.



Good news. Previously, they wanted to amend the law after the election was held, now we already get the final result on Dec. 4 !

So something sensible has come of all this faff. Never thought I'd see the day.

[Tender Branson]

Update:

All party representatives and the Interior Ministry task force have agreed to amend the law to count all postal votes on election night already, not the Monday after the election.



Good news. Previously, they wanted to amend the law after the election was held, now we already get the final result on Dec. 4 !

So something sensible has come of all this faff. Never thought I'd see the day.

Yeah, this was long overdue anyway.

If they would just set universal poll opening and closing times too for each precinct, now that would be awesome.

But that's just a pipe dream ...

[Zanas]

If I were an Austrian constitutional lawyer right now, I would already be starting writing my appeal on the Dec 4th election for, you know, the fact that some people will apparently be voting in a runoff produced by a first round where they were not qualified to vote. It makes absolutely no sense.

Oh, and also just to keep on trollin' baby.

And I'm 100% with ag, exceptionally : you can't count all the votes nationwide anywhere. Irregularities happen. It's a human process. The Dec 4th election will also produce irregularities, it's bound to. What will happen next ? Appeal ? Revote ? I've rarely seen so much electoral insanity, and it's absolutely hilarious. Well, apart from the waste of tens of million euros who could rather help refugees settle in. (#triggered)