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  Number of Regions/Regional Governments (DEBATE CLOSED) (search mode)
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Author Topic: Number of Regions/Regional Governments (DEBATE CLOSED)  (Read 39604 times)
ilikeverin
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« on: October 18, 2015, 09:56:18 pm »

I vote Grin on the amendment.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2015, 07:34:07 am »

Yup! Grin
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2015, 08:46:16 am »

Friends,

*hughughug*

I come before you today on a matter of grave importance.  I come before you worried about the future of Atlasia.  Never in my 11 years in Atlasia have I seen so many important decisions rushed to completion.  Now we are asked, in the next 48 hours, to take a vote on an issue of utmost importance.  I stand before you asking you to vote for five regions, or to vote for none.

In the past year or so, a coterie of opinionated Atlasians has managed to influence public opinion in this country.  They promise a quick fix.  All will be right in Atlasia, they say, if we just pare down the number of regions.  Kill the Midwest on the sacrificial altar, and the destruction of its beating heart will allow our nation prosperity.

But, I ask you: why?  What purpose does this serve?  They tell us that the regions are dying, and they tell us that it is because these regions are unsustainable in population.  They are "too small".  But, as the oldest continuously-registered Atlasian, I tell you today that this is false.  I have been involved in Midwestern politics since the very start.  I was Atlasia's first elected governor.  My region has always been proud, but small.  It has sometimes been the least active region, but sometimes the most - in fact, it was both during my many stints as Governor.  It was active not despite its size, but sometimes because of it.  Having a small region allowed us to communicate much more effectively. The idea that the size of a region determines its activity is, quite simply, wrong.

What do we gain, then, by decreasing the number of regions to a value like four, three, or two?  Nothing.  We simply lose a critical part of Atlasia's history, all for the sake of packing more people into a frame of government that actively conspires against making Atlasia a more interesting place.

The problem with the regions is not the number of people in them.  The problem with the regions is that, as currently formulated, they serve no purpose.  What is the point of the regional governments as they are currently designed?  In the past, they were seen as gateways to national service.  But since when have we evaluated candidates in this country based on their past peformance in office, rather than their policy positions?  We have seen Presidents with a wide, wide range of experience before they have come into the Presidency.  Do we really care about past experience?  Do you really need to have worked your way up through the ranks to be a good Atlasian officeholder?

Nay, but I go further: regions, as they currently are, are injurious to Atlasia as a whole.  For they silo activity into separate quadrants (well,  pentants?).  I, as a Midwesterner, have essentially been without a competent government for quite some time (although I appreciate the efforts of governor tmth recently for setting that at least partially right, although we obviously disagree quite sharply on the idea of abolishing regional governments).  I hear rumors that the Northeast is contemplating secession(? back in my day, that was the Southeast), that the Pacific might be a mess or something... I haven't the faintest clue what is occurring in the Mideast or the Southeast, to be quite honest.  But what is the point of me paying any attention to the governments that aren't mine?  I cannot influence their policies.  I gain nothing from trying to do so, or trying to stay informed at all.

Let us say that a brilliant white knight rides in to the State of Mirth tomorrow and leads the Midwest into a boom period.  For the first time in a long time, we have interesting policy debates, competitive elections, and citizens who are motivated to contribute as a result of his contributions.  What would that mean to the average citizen of Ohio?  California?  Puerto Rico?  Nothing, nothing, and nothing.

To my mind, there are two solutions to this dilemma.  The first is to vote for zero regions.  Doing so would eliminate this sclerotic part of Atlasia's history.  Yes, yes, of course: we would lose an important part of our history.  I agree.  I would miss the Midwest.  You would miss some other region, I'm sure.  But, unlike what reducing the number of regions would do, this would not be the sacrifice of one to the detriment of all.  This would liberate Atlasia from the shackles of a failed regional system.  It would destroy the silos of the regions.  All would be free to contribute to Atlasia in a way that improves the nation as a whole, rather than a group of states.  We could contemplate bicameralism.  We could certainly have more competitive elections, featuring a national roster of candidates.  We could forge a new nation, and one that returns to the historical roots of our country: elections, not government.

The second is to vote for five, but only if we then do something unexpected: abolish the federal government.  I laid out the problems for regions as they are.  But what about regions as they could be?  Imagine an Atlasia full of foreign policy, as each region is forced to make treaties, alliances, or war with the others.  Imagine an Atlasia with immigrants, not just re-registrants.  Imagine an Atlasia where your state of registration actually matters.  This is an Atlasia without the federal government.  Regions would gain new life because they would be the life of Atlasia.

I ask that you take these comments into guidance, friends, and tell me: do you want to throw the Mideast into the bog in the hopes of appeasing angry Woden?  Will putting more passengers into fewer staterooms on a sinking Titanic really fix things?  Or should we embark on a new journey for Atlasia, in the hopes that we find somewhere ultimately more fulfilling and more useful?

Thank you for your time.  May Dave *hughughug* Atlasia.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2015, 08:46:52 am »

I vote:

[1] 5
[2] 0
[3] 4
[4] 3
[5] 2
[6] 1 (wtf)
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2015, 01:25:14 pm »

I think there's a place for regions in the game. Eliminating regions, or the federal government, would be a terrible mistake.

Why?  Provide positive evidence for your assertion that such a system is a good idea.  You have provided evidence against your idea, which is an intriguing rhetorical angle:

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ilikeverin
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« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2015, 03:27:21 pm »

If we insist on naming the regions after historical figures, why not pick Atlasian ones rather than ones from the fictional entity of "America"?  The first three presidents were Nym, Gustaf, and John F. Kennedy.  Demrepdan was the author of the First Constitution.  We also have one late Atlas Forum member, Cheesewhiz, who was active in Atlasia for some time.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2015, 09:21:00 am »

because historically, Minnesota and Iowa have been more closely aligned with the culture and politics of Wisconsin than of the Dakotas.

No; in Atlasian history, Minnesota and Iowa have been more closely aligned with the rest of the Midwestern region, both culturally and politically.

I'm not sure why the CARCA is being considered a reliable source of information about what Atlasians would prefer out of a three-region system.  Presumably, the only people who participated were people in support of regional consolidation; those of us who opposed regional consolidation had no reason to support a process whose end goal was something we disagreed with.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2015, 09:04:50 am »

Nope Angry
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2015, 09:11:07 am »

Yup
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2015, 02:47:48 pm »

Grin  This is absolutely necessary to our democracy.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2015, 04:51:57 pm »

Yup - I don't know what more there is to be said.
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ilikeverin
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« Reply #11 on: December 22, 2015, 10:04:54 am »

Option 1: Nope
Option 2: Yup

Also, at some point (because I feel like I will forget to do this unless I write it up now), I'd like to introduce an amendment as follows:

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ilikeverin
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« Reply #12 on: December 29, 2015, 09:20:35 am »

I'm entirely fine with allowing the old names to be used for official purposes, voter registration, and so on, so as to make newbies' transition to Atlasia simpler; however, although the Most Serene Republic does have names that it prefers over the antiquated ones of the past, the Atlasian government has repeatedly and frequently refused to acknowledge our preferred names, which this amendment is seeking to redress.  Here's updated language for section v that I hope will rectify peoples' concerns:

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ilikeverin
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« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2016, 02:21:44 pm »

Yup
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