Europe-Middle East-Africa Refugee Crisis General Thread

[DavidB.]

i don't know if you've noticed, but hungary isn't exactly a great place for outsiders right now...

Could you elaborate on the war that's going on in Hungary?

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

i don't know if you've noticed, but hungary isn't exactly a great place for outsiders right now...

Could you elaborate on the war that's going on in Hungary?

who said anything about a war? there's no war in north korea right now either, but you sure as hell wouldn't expect refugees to accept that as their new home.

[DavidB.]

i don't know if you've noticed, but hungary isn't exactly a great place for outsiders right now...

Could you elaborate on the war that's going on in Hungary?

who said anything about a war? there's no war in north korea right now either, but you sure as hell wouldn't expect refugees to accept that as their new home.

A war of a regime against its people called 'communism in practice' definitely qualifies as a war, according to me.

[dead0man]

in other news, dead0 is literally referring to refugees from the worst humanitarian crisis of the century as "spoiled children". surprising? not really. disgusting? very.

this just in, lefty uses emotions instead of brain.  More at a 11.

[Beezer]

Let's mention some facts here. Refugees have no inherent right to pick and choose the place they want to flee to. It's all about safety. The moment they say "safe country A isn't good enough, I want to move to safe country B", they turn into economic migrants. By the time Syrians have reached Germany, they've crossed six rather safe countries, a few of them with arguably better job prospects than what they will encounter in Germany. So while I feel bad for Syrians having to flee their homeland, I do think Syrians throwing bottled water onto the tracks in Hungary can be referred to as spoiled, seeing as many people would give a lot to live in an advanced economy like Hungary.

[SUSAN CRUSHBONE]

in other news, dead0 is literally referring to refugees from the worst humanitarian crisis of the century as "spoiled children". surprising? not really. disgusting? very.

this just in, lefty uses emotions instead of brain.  More at a 11.

as opposed to you, who are using none of the above?

[DavidB.]

Let's mention some facts here. Refugees have no inherent right to pick and choose the place they want to flee to. It's all about safety. The moment they say "safe country A isn't good enough, I want to move to safe country B", they turn into economic migrants. By the time Syrians have reached Germany, they've crossed six rather safe countries, a few of them with arguably better job prospects than what they will encounter in Germany. So while I feel bad for Syrians having to flee their homeland, I do think Syrians throwing bottled water onto the tracks in Hungary can be referred to as spoiled, seeing as many people would give a lot to live in an advanced economy like Hungary.

Exactly.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Except that the Hungarian government has made it pretty clear that refugees are not welcome. And while its true that a refugee does not have an inherent right to pick where they end up, its entirely understandable that there's an overwhelming towards trying to get to somewhere where they assume they will be safest/most welcome/etc.

[rob in cal]

    I wonder if all the arguments about quotas for each country will encourage some countries to think about leaving the Schengen border agreement, which would, correct me if I'm wrong, give such countries more latitude in opting in or out of such quota agreements.

[ingemann]

Except that the Hungarian government has made it pretty clear that refugees are not welcome. And while its true that a refugee does not have an inherent right to pick where they end up, its entirely understandable that there's an overwhelming towards trying to get to somewhere where they assume they will be safest/most welcome/etc.

Of course it's understandable, but it doesn't change the fact that the refugees reaching Greece, Hungary, Germany etc. are already safe before. This is not Volkdeutsches fleeing ahead of pillaging army, it's not Jews fleeing a genocidal regime. It's people seeking a better way of life and there's nothing wrong with that, just as there's nothing wrong with saying no to them.

[Helsinkian]

In the LOL category: the supposedly 17-year old refugee from Iraqi Kurdistan who appeared in an emotional television interview with Finnish Prime Minister Juha Sipilä - leading Sipilä to open one of his houses for refugees - turns out to be 20 years old in reality. What's more, he's been in jail in the past and is posting hateful comments toward Finns on his Facebook page.

I rest my case...

That's him on the right:



"Child war refugee 1939 & child war refugee 2015". This is in reference to the leftists who argue that because Sweden took in Finnish child refugees during the Winter War, Finland has the obligation to take in Syrians and Iraqis...

[DavidB.]

The saddest thing about him is that he skipped leg day so often He should pay more attention to that.

In Iraq.

[Beezer]

Except that the Hungarian government has made it pretty clear that refugees are not welcome. And while its true that a refugee does not have an inherent right to pick where they end up, its entirely understandable that there's an overwhelming towards trying to get to somewhere where they assume they will be safest/most welcome/etc.

See story below...refugees have refused to get off a train in Lübeck to apply for asylum in Germany, instead demanding to be allowed to travel on to Denmark. Police eventually allowed them to continue on their way. I suppose Germany isn't good enough either now.

http://www.shz.de/schleswig-holstein/panorama/nach-protesten-fluechtlinge-duerfen-von-luebeck-nach-daenemark-weiterreisen-id10658176.html

[politicus]

Except that the Hungarian government has made it pretty clear that refugees are not welcome. And while its true that a refugee does not have an inherent right to pick where they end up, its entirely understandable that there's an overwhelming towards trying to get to somewhere where they assume they will be safest/most welcome/etc.

See story below...refugees have refused to get off a train in Lübeck to apply for asylum in Germany, instead demanding to be allowed to travel on to Denmark. Police eventually allowed them to continue on their way. I suppose Germany isn't good enough either now.

http://www.shz.de/schleswig-holstein/panorama/nach-protesten-fluechtlinge-duerfen-von-luebeck-nach-daenemark-weiterreisen-id10658176.html

They are aiming for Sweden. There are so many Syrians in Sweden by now, that many have relatives there they want to join.

[DavidB.]

I suppose Germany isn't good enough either now.

I hope you'll still be able to sleep tonight and won't feel too sad

[Beezer]

We've tried so hard to make them love us. Why won't they love us?!

[Beezer]

They are aiming for Sweden. There are so many Syrians in Sweden by now, that many have relatives there they want to join.

Which once again also illustrates what a waste of time and effort any EU quotas will be.

[DavidB.]

Well, as long as they're in an asylum seeker procedure in one country, they cannot just go to another country if they're EU-assigned to a country - at least theoretically. But yeah, once they have been given residency, they will obviously all move to the preferred countries. They're not really going to stay in Hungary, Croatia, or Slovakia.

[ingemann]

Well, as long as they're in an asylum seeker procedure in one country, they cannot just go to another country if they're EU-assigned to a country - at least theoretically. But yeah, once they have been given residency, they will obviously all move to the preferred countries. They're not really going to stay in Hungary, Croatia, or Slovakia.

The free movement of labour is only for EU citizens.

[rob in cal]

So now the German government says it can accept 500,000 per year for several years.  I wonder how this will be received, and whether this step toward ethnic, cultural transformation of Germany will be supported by Germans.  Would love to see an actual Swiss style referendum on the issue.

[politicus]

So now the German government says it can accept 500,000 per year for several years. I wonder how this will be received, and whether this step toward ethnic, cultural transformation of Germany will be supported by Germans.  Would love to see an actual Swiss style referendum on the issue.

Link?

I think it is obvious large parts of the population will be against this level of non-European immigration.

As for political consequences: Would anyone prominent in CDU be likely to split off on this and form a National Conservative party? Is the first thing that comes to mind.

(but lets take that in the German politics thread)

[Gunnar Larsson]

So now the German government says it can accept 500,000 per year for several years. I wonder how this will be received, and whether this step toward ethnic, cultural transformation of Germany will be supported by Germans.  Would love to see an actual Swiss style referendum on the issue.

Link?

I think it is obvious large parts of the population will be against this level of non-European immigration.

As for political consequences: Would anyone prominent in CDU be likely to split off on this and form a National Conservative party? Is the first thing that comes to mind.

(but lets take that in the German politics thread)

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/08/germany-500000-refugees-a-year-clashes-lesbos

Remember, not all countries are like Denmark..

[Beezer]

500,000 a year. A city the size of Stuttgart. Every year. This is genuinely crazy.

Refugees trying to escape the war torn country of Denmark, hoping to make their way to Sweden:

[politicus]

So now the German government says it can accept 500,000 per year for several years. I wonder how this will be received, and whether this step toward ethnic, cultural transformation of Germany will be supported by Germans.  Would love to see an actual Swiss style referendum on the issue.

Link?

I think it is obvious large parts of the population will be against this level of non-European immigration.

As for political consequences: Would anyone prominent in CDU be likely to split off on this and form a National Conservative party? Is the first thing that comes to mind.

(but lets take that in the German politics thread)

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/08/germany-500000-refugees-a-year-clashes-lesbos

Remember, not all countries are like Denmark..

I am not basing this on any comparison with Denmark, but on how German national identity is constructed.

[ingemann]

Politicus let's ignore Mr. Larson comment and discuss the number, 500 000 are fewer people than you think. By Danish standards it would be around 30-35 000. It's a high number of people, but less than it sounds like at first.