What specific policy proposals will solve income inequality and poverty?

[Jacobtm]

Go back to Stormfront, racist.

Try to actually address the point instead of just calling me a name and shutting down your thought.

Mexicans are our biggest immigrant group. Their country is poor, has been, and will be. We are getting their uneducated lower classes, many of whom are illiterate in their own language.

Then they come here and are poor and don't get good jobs and people act surprised that we have growing poverty in the U.S. It's the simplest thing in the world to solve, don't let any more come here, send the illegal ones back.

Fyck off fascist.

My positions are the ones most Americans agree with.

Again try actually engaging the ideas instead of calling names and shutting down your brain.

[muon2]

Try to actually address the point instead of just calling me a name and shutting down your thought.

Mexicans are our biggest immigrant group. Their country is poor, has been, and will be. We are getting their uneducated lower classes, many of whom are illiterate in their own language.

Then they come here and are poor and don't get good jobs and people act surprised that we have growing poverty in the U.S. It's the simplest thing in the world to solve, don't let any more come here, send the illegal ones back.

This will reduce poverty in the U.S. and allow us to focus any welfare spending and social programs on U.S. citizens who need it. It will also open up jobs at the lower rungs of the economic ladder to actual U.S. citizens.

Working in construction used to be a decent way for someone to make a living without an education, but now it's flooded with illegal labor more and more every year.

To address the bolded part of your post, consider my family a bit over 100 years ago. They came from a part of Europe that was poor and continues to be poor to this day. They spoke a dialect that made them less than fully literate in their language. They crowded into big city tenements and took low-paying jobs replacing those who arrived in the 1800's, and by all measures contributed to an increase in US poverty.

Within three generations their great-grandchildren were firmly in mainstream America and included owners of successful small businesses, leaders in large US corporations, and professionals in science and engineering. Should my ancestors have been barred from the US?

If you think things are different today, I can only add that I have many neighbors whose families immigrated from Mexico in the mid to latter half of the 20th century. I see their children (and grandchildren) going through the same steps of achievement as my family did a couple of generations before them.

[Hydera]

Go back to Stormfront, racist.

Try to actually address the point instead of just calling me a name and shutting down your thought.

Mexicans are our biggest immigrant group. Their country is poor, has been, and will be. We are getting their uneducated lower classes, many of whom are illiterate in their own language.

Then they come here and are poor and don't get good jobs and people act surprised that we have growing poverty in the U.S. It's the simplest thing in the world to solve, don't let any more come here, send the illegal ones back.

This will reduce poverty in the U.S. and allow us to focus any welfare spending and social programs on U.S. citizens who need it. It will also open up jobs at the lower rungs of the economic ladder to actual U.S. citizens.

Working in construction used to be a decent way for someone to make a living without an education, but now it's flooded with illegal labor more and more every year.

Its going to get worse in the future.

The future kids of illegal immigrants will blame their poverty, not on their parent's illegal status and lack of skills. But on "capitalism and AmeriKKKa" and vote for policies to give themselves welfare money by claiming that "we deserve it because were poor!!"

[Antonio the Sixth]

The belief that people need to be "encouraged" to work (or that it is even a desirable policy goal to force the poor into misery jobs that pay them little to nothing) is one of the biggest reasons why poverty exists in the first place. If people on welfare make more than they would by working, that doesn't mean benefits are too high. It means wages are too low.

Greece raised wages and raised government spending that led to a short economic boom in the early to mid-2000's. It didn't last so long did it?

LOL, now Greece is going to become the new strawman country brought up every time someone mentions any vaguely left-wing proposal, the way USSR used to be back in the days?

Also, for God's sake please change your avatar color.

[Jacobtm]

Try to actually address the point instead of just calling me a name and shutting down your thought.

Mexicans are our biggest immigrant group. Their country is poor, has been, and will be. We are getting their uneducated lower classes, many of whom are illiterate in their own language.

Then they come here and are poor and don't get good jobs and people act surprised that we have growing poverty in the U.S. It's the simplest thing in the world to solve, don't let any more come here, send the illegal ones back.

This will reduce poverty in the U.S. and allow us to focus any welfare spending and social programs on U.S. citizens who need it. It will also open up jobs at the lower rungs of the economic ladder to actual U.S. citizens.

Working in construction used to be a decent way for someone to make a living without an education, but now it's flooded with illegal labor more and more every year.

To address the bolded part of your post, consider my family a bit over 100 years ago. They came from a part of Europe that was poor and continues to be poor to this day. They spoke a dialect that made them less than fully literate in their language. They crowded into big city tenements and took low-paying jobs replacing those who arrived in the 1800's, and by all measures contributed to an increase in US poverty.

Within three generations their great-grandchildren were firmly in mainstream America and included owners of successful small businesses, leaders in large US corporations, and professionals in science and engineering. Should my ancestors have been barred from the US?

If you think things are different today, I can only add that I have many neighbors whose families immigrated from Mexico in the mid to latter half of the 20th century. I see their children (and grandchildren) going through the same steps of achievement as my family did a couple of generations before them.

However, relative to other natives, second- and third-generation Mexican-Americans have much higher dropout rates. They also have much lower rates of college graduation than other natives. Perhaps even more troubling is that there is no evidence of progress between the second and third generation. About one-fourth of second- and third-generation Mexican-Americans have not completed high school. At the high end of the education distribution, there is some evidence of progress between the first, second, and third generations. But despite progress, even third-generation Mexican-Americans are much less likely than other natives to have completed a four-year college degree.

Turning to welfare use, the figure indicates that second-generation Mexican-Americans are somewhat less likely to use welfare than Mexican immigrants. However, there seems to be no progress in lowering their use of welfare between the second and third generation. In fact, welfare use rises in the third generation, making them as likely to use welfare as Mexican immigrants. Moreover, even the second generation is still much more likely to be on welfare than are natives in general. The rate of poverty/near poverty follows a very similar pattern. There is significant progress from the first to the second generation and then a deterioration among third-generation Mexican-Americans. As with welfare use, poverty seems to increase slightly between the second and third generations. And of course, in comparison to other natives, native-born Mexican-Americans, both second and third generation, lag far beyond.

http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/mexico/generations.html

In fact, the Mexican-American communities in the U.S. that have been here for generations continue to be poorer and less educated than the U.S. average.

The fact remains, removing illegal immigrants would reduce poverty in the U.S. today and in the future.

[muon2]

Try to actually address the point instead of just calling me a name and shutting down your thought.

Mexicans are our biggest immigrant group. Their country is poor, has been, and will be. We are getting their uneducated lower classes, many of whom are illiterate in their own language.

Then they come here and are poor and don't get good jobs and people act surprised that we have growing poverty in the U.S. It's the simplest thing in the world to solve, don't let any more come here, send the illegal ones back.

This will reduce poverty in the U.S. and allow us to focus any welfare spending and social programs on U.S. citizens who need it. It will also open up jobs at the lower rungs of the economic ladder to actual U.S. citizens.

Working in construction used to be a decent way for someone to make a living without an education, but now it's flooded with illegal labor more and more every year.

To address the bolded part of your post, consider my family a bit over 100 years ago. They came from a part of Europe that was poor and continues to be poor to this day. They spoke a dialect that made them less than fully literate in their language. They crowded into big city tenements and took low-paying jobs replacing those who arrived in the 1800's, and by all measures contributed to an increase in US poverty.

Within three generations their great-grandchildren were firmly in mainstream America and included owners of successful small businesses, leaders in large US corporations, and professionals in science and engineering. Should my ancestors have been barred from the US?

If you think things are different today, I can only add that I have many neighbors whose families immigrated from Mexico in the mid to latter half of the 20th century. I see their children (and grandchildren) going through the same steps of achievement as my family did a couple of generations before them.

However, relative to other natives, second- and third-generation Mexican-Americans have much higher dropout rates. They also have much lower rates of college graduation than other natives. Perhaps even more troubling is that there is no evidence of progress between the second and third generation. About one-fourth of second- and third-generation Mexican-Americans have not completed high school. At the high end of the education distribution, there is some evidence of progress between the first, second, and third generations. But despite progress, even third-generation Mexican-Americans are much less likely than other natives to have completed a four-year college degree.

Turning to welfare use, the figure indicates that second-generation Mexican-Americans are somewhat less likely to use welfare than Mexican immigrants. However, there seems to be no progress in lowering their use of welfare between the second and third generation. In fact, welfare use rises in the third generation, making them as likely to use welfare as Mexican immigrants. Moreover, even the second generation is still much more likely to be on welfare than are natives in general. The rate of poverty/near poverty follows a very similar pattern. There is significant progress from the first to the second generation and then a deterioration among third-generation Mexican-Americans. As with welfare use, poverty seems to increase slightly between the second and third generations. And of course, in comparison to other natives, native-born Mexican-Americans, both second and third generation, lag far beyond.

http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/mexico/generations.html

In fact, the Mexican-American communities in the U.S. that have been here for generations continue to be poorer and less educated than the U.S. average.

The fact remains, removing illegal immigrants would reduce poverty in the U.S. today and in the future.

That's a fairly old paper and the key footnote I see is a study of data from the 1970's and 1980's. They also don't disaggregate regions where mobility differs for all classes (compare rural TX to suburban Chicago). In my area of suburban Chicago there is a clear trend with each subsequent generation. The pockets of newcomers are easily distinguishable from later generations, even so far as hearing some of those 2nd and 3rd generation Mexicans lodge the same complaints against the newcomers as some Anglos would.

[Hydera]

The belief that people need to be "encouraged" to work (or that it is even a desirable policy goal to force the poor into misery jobs that pay them little to nothing) is one of the biggest reasons why poverty exists in the first place. If people on welfare make more than they would by working, that doesn't mean benefits are too high. It means wages are too low.

Greece raised wages and raised government spending that led to a short economic boom in the early to mid-2000's. It didn't last so long did it?

LOL, now Greece is going to become the new strawman country brought up every time someone mentions any vaguely left-wing proposal, the way USSR used to be back in the days?

Also, for God's sake please change your avatar color.

Why? Im not using a maroon avatar.

Also fiscal responsibility is not something just of the center and right. After years of generous welfare, In Sweden 90's implemented balanced budget laws that are still in use today in order to prevent fiscal shocks that can arise from overspending and then a recession that results in tax revenue dropping. And this was implemented by the Swedish social democrats.

Also Greece isnt a strawman its a real live example of what happens if a country decides to blindly overspend for votes, as well as raising wages to be artificially high just for votes.

[Jacobtm]

That's a fairly old paper and the key footnote I see is a study of data from the 1970's and 1980's. They also don't disaggregate regions where mobility differs for all classes (compare rural TX to suburban Chicago). In my area of suburban Chicago there is a clear trend with each subsequent generation. The pockets of newcomers are easily distinguishable from later generations, even so far as hearing some of those 2nd and 3rd generation Mexicans lodge the same complaints against the newcomers as some Anglos would.

You can look at a lot of other data on Hispanics in the U.S., whether it's wealth, education, violence, in general they are "worse" than the average in our country.

You can look here for instance, a report on Hispanic poverty dropping slightly, and see that despite a small change in a positive direction, they're still doing pretty poorly overall, much worse than the average, and only slightly above African Americans.


http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/09/19/hispanics-only-group-to-see-its-poverty-rate-decline-and-incomes-rise/

Here we have a report on childhood poverty among Latinos. We see again that Latinos are far below the average, and only a slight amount above the average for African Americans:

 

http://www.pewhispanic.org/2011/09/28/childhood-poverty-among-hispanics-sets-record-leads-nation/

This general trend of Latino populations in the U.S. doing worse than average and only slightly better than African Americans in most measures is pretty consistent. Sure you may know some individuals who are doing well, and you may also know some individuals who are doing terribly.

The overall trend is what it is, Hispanic populations in the U.S. are poorer than average. As such, stopping further illegal immigration and removing current illegal immigrants would help reduce poverty in the U.S. and allow for us to focus on helping our own citizens, as well as freeing up jobs on the lower rungs of the economic ladder for our own poor people.

[muon2]

That seems like a misuse of the Pew report. They actually make the case that the Latino population is moving towards the white population in income because of the entry of second generation workers.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

This supports my position that if you remove new immigrants from the statistics, you will see a population moving towards US norms. For example 59% of the US over 25 population has some college education (2014 US Census), so the 51% achievement for US-born Hispanics is much closer than the 26% of the immigrant Hispanic population. This is the pattern that the US saw with immigrant groups a century ago, like my own ancestors.

[Jacobtm]

I'm sorry I've seen no evidence of 3rd generation Mexicans converging with whites. Sure someone raised here speaking English, a citizen, and literate, will have higher income than their illegal immigrant grandparents, but Mexican-American citizens still have much lower incomes than White Americans:

http://www.ppic.org/content/pubs/rb/RB_502JGRB.pdf

"Substantial education and wage deficits persist between
people of Mexican descent and other Americans. Thirdgeneration
Mexican Americans in California average a year
and a half less schooling and about 25 percent lower wages
than non-Hispanic whites. Observable indicators of skill—
in this case, age and especially years of schooling—explain
from one-half to three-quarters of the wage gap between
Mexican American and white workers. In contrast, observable
skill differences account for only about one-third of
black-white wage gap"

The point remains that removing illegal immigrants reduces poverty in the U.S.

[muon2]

PPIC agrees with my position as well. This is from their paper.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

PPIC is noting that once Mexican Americans gain comparable education they can be expected to achieve income at the same level as the white population. That's a problem in white populations (especially rural) that lack access to quality education, too.

[SWE]

Go back to Stormfront, racist.

Try to actually address the point instead of just calling me a name and shutting down your thought.

Mexicans are our biggest immigrant group. Their country is poor, has been, and will be. We are getting their uneducated lower classes, many of whom are illiterate in their own language.

Then they come here and are poor and don't get good jobs and people act surprised that we have growing poverty in the U.S. It's the simplest thing in the world to solve, don't let any more come here, send the illegal ones back.

This will reduce poverty in the U.S. and allow us to focus any welfare spending and social programs on U.S. citizens who need it. It will also open up jobs at the lower rungs of the economic ladder to actual U.S. citizens.

Working in construction used to be a decent way for someone to make a living without an education, but now it's flooded with illegal labor more and more every year.

Go back to Stormfront, racist.