Which side are you on?

[Clarko95 📚💰📈]

Greece, because while their government(s) are/have been dishonest and got themselves into this mess, I don't believe in gutting a government's basic services to appease banks/creditors in a way that only makes the problem worse by putting the country back in the Great Depression.

The Greek healthcare system has completely imploded. Diseases that haven't been a problem since for 50+ years are coming back hard. Poverty and unemployment are through the roof.

I am no fan of the Eurozone, but I don't know how Greece is supposed to repay its debts by destroying its economy (tax base, y'know, where the money to pay those debts is supposed to come from) and enabling radical reactionary politics.

If SYRIZA fails, that probably means the rise of Golden Dawn, which I'm sure the vast majority of people desperately want to keep out of power, because they're literally a fascist, neo-Nazi party.

Yes, painful economic reforms and restructuring will have to happen across the southern tier of the Eurozone, but austerity is not the way to do it. Greece should not be allowed to become the Argentina of Europe with the way it doesn't honor its debts, but punishing average people accomplishes nothing except making the problem worse. You're not only ruining their lives, but embittering them for the rest of their lives. Making enemies of whole countries is not something you want to do. The only people truly benefitting from this are Euroskeptics and thier political parties, which doesn't help the pro-austerity crowd one bit.

I don't really have a solution (personally I'd like to the see the Eurozone just break up), but the measures being demanded by Germany and the Eurozone elite have failed. Contracting the money supply/fiscal policy didn't help in the Great Depression, it didn't help during any recession, so why the hell is it supposed to work now??

If the ECB and the various European governments had chosen fiscal stimulus in 2008-2010 when the recession was happening and bottoming out, these countries could be growing again and then you could enact milder austerity to get the money back without ruining everyone's lives and causing this political backlash in Greece, Italy, Spain, etc. The U.S., the UK, and Germany all chose stimulus during that time, and are growing again. The U.S. enacted austerity through the sequester and tax hikes starting in 2013 and it didn't wreck the economy but still closed the deficit (though the sequester could've been handled better), and balancing our budget is a pretty easy goal if it weren't for vested interests. Obviously the differences between the U.S. and the troubled Eurozone nations are pretty vast (we can manipulate our own currency, our debt was not as large compared to GDP, our political system still works, we don't have deep structural problems, etc.), but the point is still the same: austerity is counterproductive to the goal of paying off debts.

I don't know what the endgame of austerity is supposed to be, other than a Grexit and a possible domino effect across southern Europe. In all seriousness: can anyone tell me where this is supposed to end? I have yet to hear a concrete answer that has positive results for all involved.

Extreme austerity isn't working, so I reluctantly vote Greece.

[Maxwell]

Obviously Team Germany.

[Mr. Smith]

Leider, nicht Deutschland.

Austerity is just not a good idea. Never seems to work out.

[© tweed]

a few people say "all the money going to Greece".  it doesn't go "to Greece".  98% of these emergency loan packages are funneled back out to foreign creditors.  all Greece gets out of the deal is a technically functioning state, alongside permanent economic depression and humiliation.  

eventually they will say "no more".  either Syriza will do it, in coalition with the Latin American pink tide states, and hopefully Podemos and the Pirate Party, whatever they can do; or the far right will do it.  (or the West will mobilize the military in partnership with the far right to resurrect a 'European' Greece post-Grexit).  all scenarios will be very ugly in their own special way.

all of this could be avoided with "just a slight change in priorities" (to borrow an Obama term) from the Troika, but they will not allow the "threat of a good example" (to borrow a Chomsky term) or else Spain, Ireland, Italy, etc. will get the same idea, elect these now institutionalized center-left parties, build alliances, and start asking for more...

[Phony Moderate]

The one that doesn't seek to dominate and bully an entire continent.

[Sol]

Giving lots of money to states in poor financial circumstances is a necessary part of a currency union, and it's ridiculous to expect otherwise. It works that way in the U.S., but you don't get CT forcing AL to implement massive austerity cuts or something (Alabama does that of its own accord )

[Deus Naturae]

Giving lots of money to states in poor financial circumstances is a necessary part of a currency union, and it's ridiculous to expect otherwise. It works that way in the U.S., but you don't get CT forcing AL to implement massive austerity cuts or something (Alabama does that of its own accord )

That's a good argument for breaking up the U.S.