Spanish elections and politics
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
March 28, 2024, 06:41:57 PM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  Other Elections - Analysis and Discussion
  International Elections (Moderators: afleitch, Hash)
  Spanish elections and politics
« previous next »
Pages: 1 ... 23 24 25 26 27 [28] 29 30 31 32 33 ... 93
Author Topic: Spanish elections and politics  (Read 370774 times)
Vosem
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,624
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.13, S: -6.09

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #675 on: January 19, 2016, 12:29:19 PM »

So have the parties reached a deal about general government yet? I haven't been following lately

PP, PSOE, and Ciudadanos did reach a deal to elect a Speaker (Patxi Lopez, from the PSOE) so that the new Parliament can convene, but I don't believe they've agreed to anything else so far.
Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #676 on: January 19, 2016, 12:55:45 PM »

So have the parties reached a deal about general government yet? I haven't been following lately

No. This week, the King has convoked the parties (note: the parties, not the groups) so that they may give him their opinion on the situation and on whom to appoint as formateur. There is nod deadline for when he can propose one, but it is likely he will held a second round of talks next week  or so before appointing the first formateur.

Spain has no tradition in this regard, since traditionally this role of the King was symbolic, now it is not so we'll see what he proposes. Since there are no limits to whom he could appoint, the King may propose anyone, independent of partisan, MP, senator or neither.
Logged
🦀🎂🦀🎂
CrabCake
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,192
Kiribati


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #677 on: January 19, 2016, 01:13:04 PM »

Lol, imagine if Juan Carlos was still on the throne now
Logged
Grand Wizard Lizard of the Klan
kataak
Jr. Member
***
Posts: 1,922
Vatican City State


Political Matrix
E: -4.52, S: 5.39

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #678 on: January 19, 2016, 01:19:40 PM »

Eh, imagine if Sixtus Henry would be on the throne. I do not understand why Spanish people do not support Carlism : (( You even have that funny Maoist-Carlist party, for all those lefties who votes on PSOE or Podemos.
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #679 on: January 20, 2016, 10:10:01 AM »

Podemos and PSOE overcome key differences, says El País

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/01/20/inenglish/1453278643_742610.html

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

The Compromís-Podemos coalition won 9 seats in the general election (4 Compromís, 4 Podemos and 1 independent).

By the moment the Board of Congress has approved 7 parliamentary groups in the Lower House, rejecting the request of Compromís and a proposal for a ERC-Bildu-IU 'instrumental group' :

PP: 119 seats*

PSOE: 89 seats**

Podemos-En Comú Podem-En Marea: 65 seats

Ciudadanos: 40 seats

Democràcia i Llibertat: 8 seats

Basque Nationalist Party: 6 seats

Non ascribed: ERC 9 (?), Compromís 4, IU-UP 2, EH Bildu 2, UPN 2, CC 1, NC 1, Foro 1 and Gómez de la Serna (ex-PP)

* UPN and Foro MPs. as well Pedro Gómez de la Serna (MP for Segovia involved in a corruption scandal) will join the Mixed Group.
** The New Canaries MP elected in Las Palmas in coalition with PSOE will join the Mixed Group.
Logged
🦀🎂🦀🎂
CrabCake
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,192
Kiribati


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #680 on: January 20, 2016, 10:19:23 AM »

ERC didn't get a group?
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #681 on: January 20, 2016, 10:23:03 AM »


I guess they'll get a group later. ERC, Bildu and IU requested a joint group that was rejected.

On paper, IU and Compromís could reach a deal in order to create another group.
Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #682 on: January 20, 2016, 11:35:35 AM »


I guess they'll get a group later. ERC, Bildu and IU requested a joint group that was rejected.

On paper, IU and Compromís could reach a deal in order to create another group.

Is there enough time, though? The time for making groups is closed, isn't it? I think the only possible thing now is for the deputies to move to already-existing groups.

It is nice to see Podemos facing the realities of parliamentary life. I was getting tired of the utopian 'assaulting the skies' rhetoric, truth be told.
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #683 on: January 20, 2016, 03:53:51 PM »
« Edited: January 20, 2016, 04:41:37 PM by Velasco »

Is there enough time, though? The time for making groups is closed, isn't it? I think the only possible thing now is for the deputies to move to already-existing groups.

It is nice to see Podemos facing the realities of parliamentary life. I was getting tired of the utopian 'assaulting the skies' rhetoric, truth be told.


I don't know, honestly
EDIT: Parties have three days to appeal the decision of the Board and submit alternative proposals. Next week the Board will reach a final decision.

It'd be a shame that ERC can't get a group when they have the numbers. To begin with, I see no reason for the deal between PSOE, PP and C's that gave the right a majority in the Board when PP and C's don't have a majority of seats. Why shouldn't En Comú Podem, Compromís-Podem and En Marea be allowed to get a group when they have enough votes and seats and appeared separately from Podemos in the results at the Interior website? Are those regional alliances the same thing as Podemos or not? It's a bit of an inconsistency.
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #684 on: January 21, 2016, 10:25:56 AM »
« Edited: January 21, 2016, 10:55:09 AM by Velasco »

PSOE 'barons' concerned by the possibility of a deal with Podemos and peripheral nationalists. Enric Juliana, a brilliant political analyst who writes in La Vanguardia calls PSOE regional leaders 'the socialconservatives' and Podemos the 'democratic plebeian party' Cheesy

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/01/21/inenglish/1453365880_664499.html

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

At this moment Pedro Sánchez has more chances than Mariano Rajoy (who lacks of support outside his own party) to become in the next PM. PP officials feared that King Felipe VI would put Sánchez in charge of the government's formation instead of the acting PM. However, PSOE leader is far from having reached a deal with Podemos, its peripheral associates and the PNV. Sánchez could count with the abstention of Catalan separatists (ERC and DiL got parliamentary groups in the Senate because socialists borrowed a couple of seats to each). In any case, Pedro Sánchez is determined to make his attempt once Rajoy fails. This morning Felipe told the Compromís representative that he's going to follow the 'natural order' and put Rajoy in charge first, unless PP leader quits his attempt given that he has no chances at all. Even Albert Rivera (who is going to meet the king this evening) is complaining because Rajoy hasn't talked with him. People at PP think the investiture session will be an 'ordeal'.

Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #685 on: January 21, 2016, 12:24:41 PM »

You can have an agreement with Podemos as the PSOE without giving in to the referendum, after all, there are more priority social issues to deal with (and honestly Podemos beyond Catalonia probably care more about it than En Comú) and even then, just say, "well, look, its impossible because the PP would block in the Senate" and blah. Red lines are to be crossed.
Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #686 on: January 22, 2016, 06:59:19 AM »
« Edited: January 22, 2016, 07:10:22 AM by Nanwe »

In other news, Iglesias just told the King and the press his desire to be Sánchez's VP. The ministries would be divided in a proportional manner ot the vote difference (not seats!) between the two parties and give one ministry to IU. Potential ministers: Irene Montero, Victoria Rosell, Íñigo Errejón, Carolina Bescansa, Xavier Domènech and Julio Rodríguez.

And he just proposed a magnificent manner to coerce the PP into constitutional reform. Use article 92 to call a consultative referendum on the mater of 'do you want constitutional reform?' and then if and when the 'Yes' wins, the PP couldn't say no. Or at least that's his argument.

And now there are no red line anymore. And Iglesias wants a government that defends the unity of Spain respecting the plurinational character of the State, no mention of the referendum.

I wonder if the fact that IU and Compromís are so pro-PSOE, as well as En Marea could make them look bad? Although they keep insisting on the big coalition ev0l plot, when I'm not sure how many times Sánchez has to say otherwise. The problem isn't Sánchez, its the barons, who seem keen on losing and on not governing. I thought parties wanted power?
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #687 on: January 22, 2016, 10:20:14 AM »

Pablo Iglesias told the king that he's ready to join a "government of change" with PSOE and IU whose goal would be to advance the social agenda and undo the budget cuts effected by the conservative administration of Mariano Rajoy. Also, he said he has asked Pedro Sánchez to be deputy PM in a cabinet headed by the latter. Iglesias decided that the king would be the first person to learn about his plans:

"We have decided to take the initiative and take a step forward." "Either you stand on the side of change or you stand on the side of stagnation and gridlock".

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/01/22/inenglish/1453462772_074425.html

This move has been received with "surprise" and "astonishment" at PSOE HQs. El País quotes some regional official saying the offer has caught them off guard and that the Iglesias' idea of the "plurinational nature" of Spain "is not going to fly with the PSOE's Federal Commitee". PSOE officials were displeased with some Iglesias' statements, particularly with the one saying that "the historic possibility to be prime minister now afforded Pedro Sánchez is a smile of fate that he will have to thank me for".

Pedro Sánchez thanked the offer and said he's ready to talk with Iglesias once Rajoy fails, because there are "deadlines and procedures".

On a separate issue, Enric Juliana writes about "crossed international efforts" on Spain. According to Juliana, Mariano Rajoy comissioned some people in his inner circle to contact key individuals at SPD and PS -namely Martin Schulz and Pierre Moscovici- in order they approach Pedro Sánchez and convince PSOE leader that a Grand Coalition is the best option for Spain's stability. In the opposite direction, Podemos leader Pablo Iglesias received calls from Athens  and Lisbon in order to convince him to join a leftist coalition government. Tsipras phoned Iglesias earlier this year and pondered the convenience of a leftist turn in Spain that reinforces the block of critical governments in the south of Europe, as well avoiding the isolation of the new Portuguese government. Iglesias' friends at the Bloco de Esquerda sent him messages in favour of a deal between progressive parties in Spain.

http://www.lavanguardia.com/politica/20160122/301581106107/moncloa-berlin-paris-lisboa-atenas-iglesias.html   

With all this mess, there's too little mention to an extremely important issue. European Commision is waiting to the formation of a new government in Spain to demand additional cuts.
Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #688 on: January 22, 2016, 01:22:17 PM »

Iglesias as always could save himself some phrases.

As we speak, Patxi López is heading to Zarzuela to know whom the King proposes as candidate for the Premiership to be invested by the Parliament.

But, anyways... Possible ministries and such:

PSOE: Premiership and 7 ministers
Podemos: Deputy Premiership and 2 ministers (perhaps Economy and Defence)
En Comú-Podem: 1 minister (Domenech, Ministry of 'Plurinationality')
Compromís: 1 minister
En Marea: 1 minister
IU: 1 minister (Garzón, Ministry of 'We Purple heart Anguita')

As VP, btw, and unless Sánchez appoints a different spokesperson or a Minister for the Presidency, Iglesias would be the government's spokesperson. That would permit him to keep a high profile, usually complicated for junior coalition partners.

In any case, a PSOE-Podemos-IU government will be a weak one. Usually, minority coalitions are one of the shortest-lived governments, on average lasting little more than 2 years or so.
Logged
🦀🎂🦀🎂
CrabCake
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 19,192
Kiribati


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #689 on: January 22, 2016, 01:27:17 PM »

Is Rajoy likely to stay as leader of the PP btw?
Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #690 on: January 22, 2016, 01:57:53 PM »
« Edited: January 22, 2016, 02:06:02 PM by Nanwe »


No.

This is just in. The King was going to propose Rajoy, but Rajoy has rejected standing as candidate for the investiture.


EDIT: Instead of proposing anyone, the King will hold next week a second round of interviews before proposing anyone to Patxi Lopez. More time for PSOE and Podemos to reach an agreement and find support in other places.
Logged
RogueBeaver
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 20,058
Canada
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #691 on: January 22, 2016, 02:12:25 PM »

So what happens next? C accepts PSOE/P, PP goes into oppo & picks new leader?
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #692 on: January 22, 2016, 03:13:23 PM »


Rajoy said at a press conference held minutes ago that he's gong to stand as candidate  (and subsequently as PP leader). By the moment he rejects the king's offer because he has a majority of the Congress of Deputies against him. However, Mr Rajoy is still hanging on the idea of a Grosse Koalition including PP, PSOE and C's led by himself. The man is  obstinate.

Logged
Filuwaúrdjan
Realpolitik
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 67,609
United Kingdom


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #693 on: January 22, 2016, 06:04:00 PM »

This will end well I'm sure.
Logged
Antonio the Sixth
Antonio V
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,964
United States


Political Matrix
E: -7.87, S: -3.83

P P
Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #694 on: January 22, 2016, 09:45:12 PM »


Hey, Portugal was a pleasant surprise. There is some hope (though I'll probably regret saying this).
Logged
15 Down, 35 To Go
ExtremeRepublican
Moderators
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,663


Political Matrix
E: 7.35, S: 5.57


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #695 on: January 22, 2016, 10:10:23 PM »


Rajoy said at a press conference held minutes ago that he's gong to stand as candidate  (and subsequently as PP leader). By the moment he rejects the king's offer because he has a majority of the Congress of Deputies against him. However, Mr Rajoy is still hanging on the idea of a Grosse Koalition including PP, PSOE and C's led by himself. The man is  obstinate.



Is there any way for Rajoy to stay PM?  He seems like the best of the bunch!
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #696 on: January 23, 2016, 09:18:51 AM »

Pedro Sánchez reacts to Mariano Rajoy's move, as well to criticism inside his party, saying that PP must try again. PSOE leadership issued a press release stressing that in the new round of consultations next week it should emerge with the commission of forming a government a person proposed by the first party in the Chamber. Meanwhile, PSOE is not going to undertake negotiations with other parties in order to forge an alternative government . PSOE release charges against Podemos without mentioning it, saying that the surprising offer made by Pablo Iglesias is posed from blackmail and prioritizing party interests to the citizens' interests. Yesterday Alfredo Pérez Rubalcaba and Eduardo Madina said that Iglesias' offer was "insulting" and an attempt to humiliate socialists, demanding respect for the PSOE. Socialists will maintain contacts with all parties in order to assess the situation and find a common ground around Spain's major problems. Sánchez will call Rivera first.

On Jan 30 there's a meeting of the PSOE Federal Committee that promises to be like Vietnam, with 'barons' and 'socialconservatives' in opposition to Pedro Sánchez. 
Logged
Nanwe
Rookie
**
Posts: 219
Spain


Political Matrix
E: 2.06, S: -8.00

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #697 on: January 23, 2016, 09:22:29 AM »


Rajoy said at a press conference held minutes ago that he's gong to stand as candidate  (and subsequently as PP leader). By the moment he rejects the king's offer because he has a majority of the Congress of Deputies against him. However, Mr Rajoy is still hanging on the idea of a Grosse Koalition including PP, PSOE and C's led by himself. The man is  obstinate.



Is there any way for Rajoy to stay PM?  He seems like the best of the bunch!

Most unlikely. His party's arrogant style of government during the past legislature have made them essentially toxic, like it happened in 2004. They will whine and complain about a 'stolen' victory and blah, and try - as they have already announced - to make life difficult for any left-wing government by trying to block as much as possible with their Senate majority. Of course, the left-wing only needs to change the electoral system of the Senate (by absolute majority in the lower chamber to overturn the Senate) and employ article 155 to only dissolve the Senate. And no more problem.

Sánchez needs time to build up his links and a coalition. Rajoy has taken that away from him through his announcement yesterday. Humiliating Rajoy on an investiture motion with all parties but the PP voting against him would have built up the cohesion of the various left forces. And Rajoy is not interested in playing that role.
Logged
jaichind
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 27,153
United States


Political Matrix
E: 9.03, S: -5.39

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #698 on: January 25, 2016, 07:01:19 AM »

(Bloomberg) -- Party of acting Prime Minister Mariano Rajoy would be only one of biggest four to increase number of seats in Parliament if elections were to be repeated, though still insufficient to govern, newspaper says, citing GAD3 poll.
- PP to increase seats to 131 from 123 that were won in Dec. 20 election, while Socialists would lose one seat, to 89: Poll
- Podemos would drop four seats to 65, Ciudadanos falls two seats, to 38
- 802 people were interviewed Jan. 15-21, with 3.5pp margin of error
Logged
Velasco
andi
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 5,684
Western Sahara


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #699 on: January 25, 2016, 12:24:49 PM »

Spain came no closer to see a government formed this weekend, says El País.  Pedro Sánchez and Pablo Iglesias had a telephone conversation yesterday. Both disagree on the time frame for beginning negotiations. Sánchez admonished Iglesias for the surprise announcement made on Friday, while the Podemos leader insisted on the need to begin talks. Sánchez, reportedly, would rather wait. The pair are due to talk again this week.

PSOE is facing a huge strategic dilemma, says Enric Juliana in La Vanguardia. According to him, the choice for Spanish socialists is becoming in the 'Responsibility Party' (in the fashion of the SPD) or the 'Explorer Party' (half responsible and half adventurer), in order to stand in the way of the Podemos and avoid the fate of PASOK.

Juliana also remarks that among certain political circles in Madrid was spreading the fear of a leftist government. "Only Felipe González can stop this madness", say the same people that 20 years ago was conspiring against the former socialist PM.

The two competing positions in PSOE (approximate translation):

Pedro Sánchez's partners in the PSOE are closer to the second way (the 'Explorer Party'). "Those who demand responsibility are those who abused of absolute majority (PP) (...). For some people responsibility means placing ourselves at the disposal of PP and becoming in its crutch. Such 'responsiblity' means falling from 22% to 12% of the vote in a short period of time. That would be the materialization of the Podemos' dream: an old PSOE confined in the South of Spain, declining in support among workers and civil servants, annulled in big cities and increasingly weak in Catalonia and the Basque Country (...) The Spanish PASOK. Those who give the example of the SPD seem to ignore that German socialdemocrats are steadily falling in the polls(...) We don't want to follow that path. PSOE must remain a clear alternative to the Spanish right, not a sad subordinate party".

Advocates of the 'Responsibility Party' or the SPD way (the 'social-centrists') say that election results didn't give a mandate for "radical change". Instead, they express a mandate for pact. "Today in Spain, pact is change. PSOE must force PP to pact a 'brave' agenda of reforms, finding a solution that permits the gradual deactivation of separatism in Catalonia (...) Change is the 'correctness of European politics' to stand in the way of 'populism' (...) A very unstable socialist government could lead PSOE to disaster in the short term".

In other news, Pedro Sánchez will try to convince regional 'barons' that in neither case he's going to deal with separatists.

Warnings from Brussels:

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/01/25/inenglish/1453713864_988989.html

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.
Logged
Pages: 1 ... 23 24 25 26 27 [28] 29 30 31 32 33 ... 93  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.055 seconds with 11 queries.