Is Slavery a Christian institution?
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
July 16, 2025, 06:04:05 PM
News: Election Calculator 3.0 with county/house maps is now live. For more info, click here

  Talk Elections
  General Discussion
  Religion & Philosophy (Moderator: Tokugawa Sexgod Ieyasu)
  Is Slavery a Christian institution?
« previous next »
Pages: [1]
Poll
Question: Well is it?
#1
Yes (Christian)
 
#2
No (Christian)
 
#3
Yes (Non-Christian)
 
#4
No (Non-Christian)
 
Show Pie Chart
Partisan results

Total Voters: 24

Author Topic: Is Slavery a Christian institution?  (Read 984 times)
Wiggle Your Yummy Moist Preggers Cake Ben Shapiro
The Obamanation
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,886
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: October 16, 2013, 02:40:31 PM »
« edited: October 17, 2013, 02:35:16 PM by I want it, you got it »

In history classes at school, I've learned that the 2nd and 3rd Great Awakenings inspired the anti-slavery movement, and that once the Roman Empire became predomantly Christian, slaves were decreasing in numbers (at one point in pagan Rome nearly 1/3 of the population were slaves).

However, the OT makes several rules about slaves. Fredrick Douglas wrote that the best slave masters were not Christians. Jefferson Davis believed slavery was of God.

So I'm a little conflicted. But what about you? (Of course OT slavery and Roman Slavery were not as bad as 19th century slavery.)
Logged
afleitch
Moderators
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 30,940


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2013, 02:49:35 PM »

As an institution it was used by men of power in all realms and all faiths and none. You can cite Christians (particularly Quakers) who pushed against it, but you can also look at slave owners brandishing the Bible during the US Civil War. It was two sides of humanity.
Logged
True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 42,133
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: October 16, 2013, 04:37:08 PM »

Using the term slavery to cover Hebrew Testament slavery, Roman slavery, and slavery in the Americas just goes to show that this is one area where modern English suffers from a lack of terminology.

At least in its idealized form, Hebrew Testament slavery was actually what would more accurately be called indentured servitude.  Altho at times the Hebrews backslid on this, which made YHWH angry. (Read Jeremiah 34:8-22 for one particular example.)

Still, while in both the actual fact of Hebrew slavery, and in how Roman slavery was conducted, slavery could be lifelong, the keeping of a freed slave in a perpetual second class status did not happen.  That innovation happened here in the Americas. Slavery was far more an economic transaction or a means of punishment than a means of subjugating an entire ethnic group.

Also, the reason why slavery declined in the Roman Empire had little to with the spread of Christianity, but more because with wars of conquest no longer being waged, a major source of new slaves disappeared.  Many occupations Roman slaves were put to work in were brutal, with little hope of long term survival, let alone breeding replacements.  Domestic and agricultural slaves were treated better, but they also tended to be emancipated.

At least in its idealized Hebrew Testament version, there is nothing incompatible with Christianity and slavery.  It's little more than a long term labor contract.  Yet more stringent versions clearly are not Christian.
Logged
J. J.
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 32,892
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: October 16, 2013, 05:30:13 PM »



Still, while in both the actual fact of Hebrew slavery, and in how Roman slavery was conducted, slavery could be lifelong, the keeping of a freed slave in a perpetual second class status did not happen.  That innovation happened here in the Americas. Slavery was far more an economic transaction or a means of punishment than a means of subjugating an entire ethnic group.


I would not agree that there was not second class citizenship for freed slaves in Imperial Rome.

That said, slavery in the Americas had a largely, though not completely, racial/ethnic element that was largely missing elsewhere.

In terms of Christianity, there are many examples of slavery being practiced and condoned in the Bible, though never with that racial/ethnic element.  I would say that early Christianity was neutral toward the practice.
Logged
True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 42,133
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: October 16, 2013, 08:10:07 PM »

I would not agree that there was not second class citizenship for freed slaves in Imperial Rome.

Depends on what you mean.  While de jure the libertini did not enjoy full civil rights, their children did.  Any additional de facto problems they had more likely came from their economic status than from their status ad freedmen or the descendants thereof.
Logged
Wiggle Your Yummy Moist Preggers Cake Ben Shapiro
The Obamanation
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 8,886
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2013, 02:35:28 PM »

I fixed the question.
Logged
Atlas Has Shrugged
ChairmanSanchez
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 38,078
United States


Political Matrix
E: 5.29, S: -5.04

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2013, 03:04:08 PM »

Of course not. Slavery can happen under any faith. The idea that it is a Christian institution is propaganda from the Black Muslim movement, which is little more than a cult that is rejected by Islam.
Logged
The Mikado
Moderators
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 22,184


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2013, 11:43:44 PM »
« Edited: October 17, 2013, 11:48:55 PM by The Mikado »

Slavery did decline for a long time in the late Roman world (though it did not disappear).  In large part that was because the late Roman/post-Roman model just couldn't maintain the "aristocrat with a gigantic plantation with hundreds of slaves" model.  Serfdom/semi-free labor proved to be the order of the day for most of Late Antiquity (though slavery, again, did not disappear).  It is true that there grew to be a taboo at the time against Christians owning Christians as slaves but it was a taboo regularly broken, especially as non-Christians grew to be in rather short supply in Christendom.   Islam would later develop a similar taboo against Muslims owning Muslims, and Muhammad had said that freeing a slave was a virtuous act, though Medieval Islamic states clearly condoned slavery as an institution.

EDIT: Slavery's revival as a widespread institution after the discovery of the New World is a very different topic and is basically a different institution.
Logged
H. Ross Peron
General Mung Beans
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,404
Korea, Republic of


Political Matrix
E: -6.58, S: -1.91

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2013, 11:53:16 PM »

Of course not. Slavery can happen under any faith. The idea that it is a Christian institution is propaganda from the Black Muslim movement, which is little more than a cult that is rejected by Islam.

With regards to that, I find it incredibly ironic Cassius Clay (the boxer) rejected his original name due to it being a "slave name".
Logged
dead0man
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 48,834
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #9 on: October 18, 2013, 02:14:24 AM »

Of course not.
Logged
Robert California
Cathcon
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 27,877
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2013, 02:46:52 AM »

This seems like an incredibly awful question. Was it invented by Christians? No. What other qualities might there be to make it a Christian institution? And is this to say it is Christian rather than of other religions, or is this not exclusive? Is it to say that slavery is specifically bound to Christianity or vice versa? For several of these awful questions stemming from the first awful question, I'd think the answer would generally be no. Therefore, I ascertain that yup, it's not a Christian institution.
Logged
Cassius
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,983


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #11 on: October 18, 2013, 03:21:37 AM »

As an institution it was used by men of power in all realms and all faiths and none. You can cite Christians (particularly Quakers) who pushed against it, but you can also look at slave owners brandishing the Bible during the US Civil War. It was two sides of humanity.

This...
Logged
Tetro Kornbluth
Gully Foyle
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 12,902
Ireland, Republic of


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2013, 01:09:51 PM »

As meaningful a question as "Is Slavery a type of car stereo?"
Logged
Oldiesfreak1854
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 13,674
United States


WWW Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2013, 09:30:39 AM »

No (Christian.)  Slavery existed long before Christians came along, not to mention that first century slavery was very different from the New World slavery that most of us are familiar with.
Logged
Mr.Bakari-Sellers
olawakandi
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 98,904
Jamaica


Political Matrix
E: -6.19, S: -4.17

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2013, 10:02:53 AM »

Lincoln believed that he was Moses freeing blacks from involuntary servitude and the GOP party became the religious party. Whereas, Jefferson believed that if God wanted blacks to be free, they would of been born free. Using religion to fit own purposes. Thus establishing the precedent that we live by today, in doctrines, in our constitution and our bibles. Living doctrine vs strict interpretation of doctrines.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.047 seconds with 11 queries.