Senate Bill: Atlasian Education Modernization Act (Rejected)

[TJ in Oregon]

Nay.  

The 180 days requirement is the only part of this I'd really support. I'm also a little bit conflicted on the 8 hours requirement. The mandatory recess, study hall, and not starting before 8am requirements, though, are unacceptable, especially in conjunction with the 8 hours part. If we're going to mandate longer school days, it had better not be for high schoolers to have recess and mandatory study, and we would then definitely need to allow them to start before 8am.

[Gass3268]

Aye

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

Nay.

[TNF]

You must be logged in to read this quote.

How does this look?

Add back the original second section (providing for an entitlement to lunch) and this will have my full support. I could go for an income based entitlement, but I want to make lunch as free for as many kids as possible. Scott originally had it for kids whose parents make under $25K. I'd like to see that a bit higher if possible.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I have considerable issues with the original clause two. Particularly as it relates to the health care mandate it contains, which would naturally come into conflict with the requirements of Fritzcare, which theoretically would ensure they already are covered.

As for the lunch mandate, don't we already have that in place as it is? I am sort of confused about its purpose and most certainly what would be accomplished with the requirement. I am not aware of a school that doesn't provide lunch.

[MaxQue]

I have considerable issues with the original clause two. Particularly as it relates to the health care mandate it contains, which would naturally come into conflict with the requirements of Fritzcare, which theoretically would ensure they already are covered.

As for the lunch mandate, don't we already have that in place as it is? I am sort of confused about its purpose and most certainly what would be accomplished with the requirement. I am not aware of a school that doesn't provide lunch.

Many elementary schools don't.

[Napoleon]

I have considerable issues with the original clause two. Particularly as it relates to the health care mandate it contains, which would naturally come into conflict with the requirements of Fritzcare, which theoretically would ensure they already are covered.

As for the lunch mandate, don't we already have that in place as it is? I am sort of confused about its purpose and most certainly what would be accomplished with the requirement. I am not aware of a school that doesn't provide lunch.

Many elementary schools don't.

Cite?

[HagridOfTheDeep]

Nay

[MaxQue]

I have considerable issues with the original clause two. Particularly as it relates to the health care mandate it contains, which would naturally come into conflict with the requirements of Fritzcare, which theoretically would ensure they already are covered.

As for the lunch mandate, don't we already have that in place as it is? I am sort of confused about its purpose and most certainly what would be accomplished with the requirement. I am not aware of a school that doesn't provide lunch.

Many elementary schools don't.

Cite?

I went to two.

[Napoleon]

I have considerable issues with the original clause two. Particularly as it relates to the health care mandate it contains, which would naturally come into conflict with the requirements of Fritzcare, which theoretically would ensure they already are covered.

As for the lunch mandate, don't we already have that in place as it is? I am sort of confused about its purpose and most certainly what would be accomplished with the requirement. I am not aware of a school that doesn't provide lunch.

Many elementary schools don't.

Cite?

I went to two.

In the US, there's a federal school lunch program so we offer lunch. IIRC, you're from a rural area so it's understandable but none of our schools should have that problem urban or rural.

Also, this: https://uselectionatlas.org/AFEWIKI/index.php/School_Lunch_Act

[Napoleon]

Amendment proposal


SECTION 7. STANDARDIZED TEST REFORM

All ties between federal funding and federally mandated standardized tests are hereby repealed. Federally mandated standardized tests shall remain in place for the sole purpose of tracking progress and success in education policy as administered by the Department of Education and Secretary of Internal Affairs. Standardized test results may be submitted to universities for the purpose of college admissions.

[Napoleon]

Amendment proposal

SECTION 6. SCHOOL ENVIRONMENT

1.   All schools below college shall be required to be open to students for at least 190 days per year for at least 7.5 hours a day for no less than eleven years.  One hour each day must be reserved to study hall periods and recess, which shall be required in all schools.

2.   All students across all regions will be entitled to health care (including mental health) and daily lunch.  If a student is of an income level below $25,000, their lunches shall be at no cost.

3. The School Lunch Act (FL 31-20) is hereby repealed.

[MaxQue]

I agree than standardized tests shouldn't be linked to funding, but couldn't they be used for higher education admission, instead of all those tests made by private organisations?

[Napoleon]

I agree than standardized tests shouldn't be linked to funding, but couldn't they be used for higher education admission, instead of all those tests made by private organisations?

Works for me, I included that in a modification

[TJ in Oregon]

Why do high schoolers need to have mandatory recess and why do kindergarteners need study hall? Or am I reading that wrong?

[Napoleon]

Amendment proposal

SECTION 8. MISCELLANEOUS

The School Standards Reform Act of 2009 is amended as follows:

Section 3: Middle School Reforms

    All public middle schools must offer at least one foreign language program. Enrollment in said program may be optional, as dictated by regional and district law.
    All students in grades 6 through 8 shall be required to study science, English, history, physical education, and mathematics for all of their three years in said grades. All public middle schools must offer said subjects for all three grades.

Section 4: High School Reforms

    All public high school students must complete, between 9th and 12th grade, at least four courses in mathematics, four courses in English, three courses in a single foreign language, three courses in the social sciences, one course in Atlasian history, two courses in physical education, three courses of science with at least three of said courses lab intensive, in addition to four elective courses.
    All public high schools must offer classes on mathematics, chemistry, biology, physics, English, Atlasian history, world history, physical education, and at least (but not limited to) two different foreign languages sufficient in number to allow students to complete the above requirements.
    All public high schools with a student body greater than 400 that offer at least 8 advanced courses (Advanced Placement, Running Start and International Baccalaureate are acceptable) shall receive up to 60% the total cost of such programs split evenly between the governing region and federal government.

SECTION 9. FUNDING

TBD

SECTION 10. IMPLEMENTATION

This law shall go into effect at the start of the 2015 school year.

[MaxQue]

Why defining things in days? Shouldn't hours offer more flexibility?
I echo TJ comments.
I also oppose the striking down of the requirement of not being courses before 8AM. Beginning before 8AM is pure insanity for the parents.

[Sbane]

Amendment proposal


SECTION 7. STANDARDIZED TEST REFORM

All ties between federal funding and federally mandated standardized tests are hereby repealed. Federally mandated standardized tests shall remain in place for the sole purpose of tracking progress and success in education policy as administered by the Department of Education and Secretary of Internal Affairs. Standardized test results may be submitted to universities for the purpose of college admissions.

I think standardized testing does have some uses, especially as one of the ways to evaluate teachers. I do agree with separating it from funding, since poorer schools will have lower scores than richer ones, which means they get less funding thus the more they are starved of resources leading to a downward spiral. We should be measuring the improvement in scores over a year, as opposed to comparing the overall scores between schools.

Amendment proposal

SECTION 6. SCHOOL ENVIRONMENT

1.   All schools below college shall be required to be open to students for at least 190 days per year for at least 7.5 hours a day for no less than eleven years.  One hour each day must be reserved to study hall periods and recess, which shall be required in all schools.

2.   All students across all regions will be entitled to health care (including mental health) and daily lunch.  If a student is of an income level below $25,000, their lunches shall be at no cost.

3. The School Lunch Act (FL 31-20) is hereby repealed.

I don't like dictating how long a school must be open and how much time must be reserved for study hall and recess. I didn't have study hall at my school and I liked that. Otherwise I do like extending the school year to 190 days. We should shorten the summer break that kids get.

[Napoleon]

I think standardized testing does have some uses, especially as one of the ways to evaluate teachers. I do agree with separating it from funding, since poorer schools will have lower scores than richer ones, which means they get less funding thus the more they are starved of resources leading to a downward spiral. We should be measuring the improvement in scores over a year, as opposed to comparing the overall scores between schools.

That was my goal. I don't like the reactionary response to standardized tests because as you said that data is very useful for formulating new policies and finding where to make necssary adjustments. And I think they help kids learn how to test better over time which can help with college admissions and stuff.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

That is a bit confusing, should I change my amendment to amendment that part of the bill too? And I tend to agree with TJ about recess and study hall.

[Sbane]

I don't think we should be in the business of dictating whether schools have recess or study hall. That is something we should leave up to teachers, the principal and parents.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

We are getting lost in the weeds here on the present vote.

My current count:
AYe: Gass TNF

Nay: Hagrid, Maxy sbane Yankee Scott


We are voting on 56:06 by TNF

[Sec. of State Superique]

In Brazil, schools are required to give classes for 200 days and most of Schools start at 7:20 AM :/

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

Amendment proposal


SECTION 7. STANDARDIZED TEST REFORM

All ties between federal funding and federally mandated standardized tests are hereby repealed. Federally mandated standardized tests shall remain in place for the sole purpose of tracking progress and success in education policy as administered by the Department of Education and Secretary of Internal Affairs. Standardized test results may be submitted to universities for the purpose of college admissions.

Very unfriendly.  My proposal doesn't eliminate standardized tests, but merely reduces them and gives the regions a chance to design their own.  If we're actually going to keep testing students year after year, then there's really no need for this bill at all.  We also should keep in mind that colleges are beginning to see standardized tests as a poor way of measuring student ability.  I know you don't like it when I bring up the Finnish model, but the fact is that students in that country haven't needed standardized tests.  They certainly don't prevent them from being successful after high school.  If you think we should test so students can "learn how to test better over time," then you are completely out of step with the goals outlined by the bill.

I've seen a lot of bad ideas proposed for this bill, but that has got to be the worst of them all.

Amendment proposal

SECTION 6. SCHOOL ENVIRONMENT

1.   All schools below college shall be required to be open to students for at least 190 days per year for at least 7.5 hours a day for no less than eleven years.  One hour each day must be reserved to study hall periods and recess, which shall be required in all schools.

2.   All students across all regions will be entitled to health care (including mental health) and daily lunch.  If a student is of an income level below $25,000, their lunches shall be at no cost.

3. The School Lunch Act (FL 31-20) is hereby repealed.

Friendly.

Amendment proposal

SECTION 8. MISCELLANEOUS

The School Standards Reform Act of 2009 is amended as follows:

Section 3: Middle School Reforms

    All public middle schools must offer at least one foreign language program. Enrollment in said program may be optional, as dictated by regional and district law.
    All students in grades 6 through 8 shall be required to study science, English, history, physical education, and mathematics for all of their three years in said grades. All public middle schools must offer said subjects for all three grades.

Section 4: High School Reforms

    All public high school students must complete, between 9th and 12th grade, at least four courses in mathematics, four courses in English, three courses in a single foreign language, three courses in the social sciences, one course in Atlasian history, two courses in physical education, three courses of science with at least three of said courses lab intensive, in addition to four elective courses.
    All public high schools must offer classes on mathematics, chemistry, biology, physics, English, Atlasian history, world history, physical education, and at least (but not limited to) two different foreign languages sufficient in number to allow students to complete the above requirements.
    All public high schools with a student body greater than 400 that offer at least 8 advanced courses (Advanced Placement, Running Start and International Baccalaureate are acceptable) shall receive up to 60% the total cost of such programs split evenly between the governing region and federal government.

SECTION 9. FUNDING

TBD

SECTION 10. IMPLEMENTATION

This law shall go into effect at the start of the 2015 school year.

Friendly.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I am really conflicted on the testing issue.


WE need to measure to ensure progress is being made, but the way we measure doesn't work. We need new forms and ways to test. Sbane is right that we should move towards measuring progress over the year instead of measuring them agaisnt some arbitrary line in the sand and then cutting funding to those who aren't proficient without considering to where they started at. On the other hand Scott is right about giving the Region's flexibility so that they can develop those alternative testing methods.

Some parts of Nappy's first amendment are good, but others are concerning.

I need to look at the other two more closely.

And don't forget we are voting on 56:06 right now.

[Bleach Blonde Bad Built Butch Bodies for Biden]

Here is an insightful article on why standardized testing fails.