Opinion of this explanation of life after death
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
July 16, 2025, 06:17:44 PM
News: Election Calculator 3.0 with county/house maps is now live. For more info, click here

  Talk Elections
  General Discussion
  Religion & Philosophy (Moderator: Tokugawa Sexgod Ieyasu)
  Opinion of this explanation of life after death
« previous next »
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Opinion of this explanation of life after death  (Read 622 times)
Free Speech Enjoyer
Just Passion Through
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 47,171
Ukraine


P P P

Show only this user's posts in this thread
« on: June 08, 2013, 09:23:28 AM »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=5BkP9-HG8-I
Logged
DC Al Fine
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 14,080
Canada


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2013, 10:09:21 AM »

Spong being Spong.
Logged
True Federalist (진정한 연방 주의자)
Ernest
Atlas Legend
*****
Posts: 42,133
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2013, 12:57:03 PM »

It was more an explanation of what life after death is not like than what he thought it was like.
Logged
DemPGH
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 4,755
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2013, 03:03:10 PM »

"People don't need to be 'born again.' They need to grow up." Wow. For a theologian, I massively approve of Spong because of statements like that. I'm not sure if "born again" language is Protestant only, but he's absolutely right.

And it ties in a bit to the thread on Eden in one sense: the pre-lapsarian condition is akin to childhood, for sure a good childhood, and you can't be "born again," so it's best to just deal with reality.

I think there have been other threads on hell and damnation, but sure, all those prescriptions made up by the Church were for social control and little else. Perhaps someone thought it in everyone's best interest to do this or that on a certain day, but on the whole, it's all just social control.
Logged
Tokugawa Sexgod Ieyasu
Nathan
Moderator
Atlas Superstar
*****
Posts: 37,674


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2013, 11:32:26 PM »


"People don't need to be 'born again.' They need to grow up." Wow. For a theologian, I massively approve of Spong because of statements like that. I'm not sure if "born again" language is Protestant only, but he's absolutely right.

'Born again' is mostly used by Protestants, especially pietistic Protestants, but it's actually in the Bible. John 3.3.

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

This is actually a lot less questionable (from a Christian perspective) as a viewpoint on the Fall than it is as a viewpoint on the Four Last Things--at least, that the Fall is fait accompli in the world as it currently is. How we are to deal with this fact is...where Spong goes a little heterodox around the edges. Or a lot.

It was more an explanation of what life after death is not like than what he thought it was like.

This is also true.
Logged
HagridOfTheDeep
Junior Chimp
*****
Posts: 9,095
Canada


Political Matrix
E: -6.19, S: -4.35


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2013, 02:41:28 AM »

I confess I've never heard from this guy before, but it's pretty much exactly what I believe. I believe in an all-powerful God that we can't even begin to understand. The Bible was written by God, through man, just as Harry Potter was written by God, through man. I have to believe there's a reason that God chose to elevate the Bible the way it has been elevated, but I can't ever know why. I can't know if it's true. I believe in God because I feel God. Jesus points the way, and I identify as a Christian because it's part of my tradition... but I'm probably not one. I still have all the respect in the world for the work of the Church.

Anyhow, I don't believe in the dichotomy of heaven and hell because the only thing that points it out is a fallible book. I do believe, though, that there's "more." I believe what happens to me after death will probably also happen to the most outspoken and belligerent athiest. There are universes out there that we can't even comprehend... maybe that's where we go. Maybe that's where we were before we were born. Everything we know in this life is gleaned from our five senses. If we were in one of those other universes before we were born, of course we wouldn't be able to recall it, as our bodies just wouldn't have the capability.

I'm obviously extrapolating a bit, and I can't say my faith in an afterlife is unshakable... but I do have faith in God, and I think Spong summarizes my beliefs very well. My only departure is that I don't think I'd use such strong words to critique religion and the modern Church. I've been an active part of my church's congregation for years. The people I've met and the work it does are remarkable. That's why I don't really have the time of day for those militant athiests who go out of their way to attack religion and faith. I digress.

So ends my late night post about personal faith. Tongue
Logged
pbrower2a
Atlas Star
*****
Posts: 27,404
United States


Show only this user's posts in this thread
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2013, 12:23:11 AM »

Religious authorities find Hell useful as a threat to heretics, dissidents, and backsliders. When persuasion fails, the appeal to fear emerges. So even if one escapes religious authorities (let us say Jews fleeing the Spanish Inquisition and ending up in Holland or Turkey) and the auto-da-fe one will still burn forever in Hell. 

I have used it -- but on someone standing for a consummate evil. A Nazi. I inverted the threat that  the saved would get to take delight in the torments of the damned. Figure that Hell is more a place of shame, regret, distrust, fear, and ugliness (think of a prison), and that part of the torment is that one gets to see those that one terribly wronged enjoying delights denied one indefinitely. A Holocaust perpetrator gets to see his Jewish victims in a paradise that he can only envy -- and that Paradise is undeniably Jewish. A Crusader who massacred a Muslim town gets to recognize -- too late -- that God is Allah, Mohammed is His Greatest Prophet, and that the Paradise denied him is undeniably Islamic.

But save Hell for the most egregious sinners.     
Logged
Pages: [1]  
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.036 seconds with 9 queries.