Connecticut was more Republican than New Jersey for the first time since 1976
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  Connecticut was more Republican than New Jersey for the first time since 1976
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Author Topic: Connecticut was more Republican than New Jersey for the first time since 1976  (Read 4318 times)
old timey villain
cope1989
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« on: May 31, 2013, 11:22:03 PM »

New Jersey has always been more Republican than Connecticut in every presidential election since 1976 when Ford won NJ by 3 but won CT by 5. Since then Dems and liberal third party candidates like John Anderson (80) and Ralph Nader (00) have always done better in Connecticut. But in 2012, Obama won NJ by 17.75 points while winning CT by 17.34 points. It's not a huge difference but it's statistically interesting to me.

Also important is that NJ swung towards Obama while CT had the hardest swing against him in the northeast. So was it just the Sandy effect? Did New Jersey's minority population have more to do with it? Both states have a lot of affluent white collar workers making their money in finance and Wall Street, so maybe Romney picked up more of these voters in CT? People always seem to forget that CT has a lot of white blue collar folks as well who aren't your typical latte liberals- did they swing really hard to Romney?

I'd love to hear perspectives from anyone living in either of these two states.
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« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2013, 11:58:29 PM »
« Edited: June 01, 2013, 12:13:30 AM by TDAS04 »

You forgot about 1984.

Anyway, it is a good observation.  Sandy probably had something to do with it, and CT is a little more white collar (and more white), but someone from either of those states might have more of an explanation.  
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bedstuy
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« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2013, 08:49:44 AM »

I don't live in either state, but...

-Hurricane Sandy hit the more Republican areas of NJ.
-Linda McMahon spent a ton of money and perhaps her GOTV helped Romney.
-Obama was weak among Wall Street types in the Gold Coast area.
-Obama was weak among the white, lower middle-class New England types because of racism.
-Romney is from New England and was a finance guy so he was stronger with both groups.
-NJ has slightly more black folks and their turnout dropped less from 2008 than other groups.
-NJ has more Asians who swung towards Obama in 2012.
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« Reply #3 on: June 01, 2013, 09:19:47 AM »

I don't live in either state, but...

-Hurricane Sandy hit the more Republican areas of NJ.
-Linda McMahon spent a ton of money and perhaps her GOTV helped Romney.
-Obama was weak among Wall Street types in the Gold Coast area.
-Obama was weak among the white, lower middle-class New England types because of racism.
-Romney is from New England and was a finance guy so he was stronger with both groups.
-NJ has slightly more black folks and their turnout dropped less from 2008 than other groups.
-NJ has more Asians who swung towards Obama in 2012.

The two in bold I'd dispute. McMahon actually made some effort to distance herself from the national GOP (there were ads of people saying they were voting for Obama and McMahon), and there are way more blue-collar whites in New Jersey than in Connecticut. In fact, it seems that working-class white ethnic (Italian, Polish, etc) communities in New Jersey had some swing to Obama thanks to Sandy.

But the primary reasons, as stated, are that New Jersey is a more ethnically diverse state and it was hit hard by Sandy.
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« Reply #4 on: June 01, 2013, 10:13:52 AM »

I loved, loved, loved when I saw this.  NJ and CT are actually extremely similar states. 

-largely suburban
-a couple medium-sized, albeit run-down, cities
-populations that identify more with two cities from other states (NJ: New York and Philadelphia, CT: New York and Boston)
-pretty diverse populations (Non-Hispanic whites: 77% in CT, 69% in NJ)
-some very wealthy shore areas (Gold Coast in CT, Ocean County in NJ)

CT probably always had the edge on us when it came to vote share for the more liberal of the two parties for a couple of reasons.

1. NJ has SOME rural-ish areas.  CT really doesn't have any. 
2. CT is just a bit more "northern", geographically and culturally.
3. CT doesn't really have anything like Northwest Jersey.   

From now on, though, the states will probably vote very similarly.  NJ has a bit more of a diverse population to offset the Confederate sympathizers and NASCAR dads in the Pine Barrens and scattered around other parts of South Jersey.  Connecticut is a pretty static state.  New Jersey is losing white population to those emigrating south for warmer weather, and the fact that immigrants still tend to come to Jersey because, in all honestly, you CAN find a job here. 
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bedstuy
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« Reply #5 on: June 01, 2013, 12:29:15 PM »

I don't live in either state, but...

-Hurricane Sandy hit the more Republican areas of NJ.
-Linda McMahon spent a ton of money and perhaps her GOTV helped Romney.
-Obama was weak among Wall Street types in the Gold Coast area.
-Obama was weak among the white, lower middle-class New England types because of racism.
-Romney is from New England and was a finance guy so he was stronger with both groups.
-NJ has slightly more black folks and their turnout dropped less from 2008 than other groups.
-NJ has more Asians who swung towards Obama in 2012.

The two in bold I'd dispute. McMahon actually made some effort to distance herself from the national GOP (there were ads of people saying they were voting for Obama and McMahon), and there are way more blue-collar whites in New Jersey than in Connecticut. In fact, it seems that working-class white ethnic (Italian, Polish, etc) communities in New Jersey had some swing to Obama thanks to Sandy.

But the primary reasons, as stated, are that New Jersey is a more ethnically diverse state and it was hit hard by Sandy.

McMahon may have made ads that said that but, she did spend $12 million dollars.  No other Republican campaign in NJ or CT spent serious money on statewide organizing and GOTV.  That could have had some effect in boosting Romney.

Also, I think lower class whites in New England are especially racist.
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old timey villain
cope1989
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« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2013, 12:31:34 PM »

You forgot about 1984.

Anyway, it is a good observation.  Sandy probably had something to do with it, and CT is a little more white collar (and more white), but someone from either of those states might have more of an explanation.  

oops, you're right. But that's still a long streak.
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old timey villain
cope1989
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« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2013, 12:40:05 PM »

I loved, loved, loved when I saw this.  NJ and CT are actually extremely similar states. 

-largely suburban
-a couple medium-sized, albeit run-down, cities
-populations that identify more with two cities from other states (NJ: New York and Philadelphia, CT: New York and Boston)
-pretty diverse populations (Non-Hispanic whites: 77% in CT, 69% in NJ)
-some very wealthy shore areas (Gold Coast in CT, Ocean County in NJ)

CT probably always had the edge on us when it came to vote share for the more liberal of the two parties for a couple of reasons.

1. NJ has SOME rural-ish areas.  CT really doesn't have any. 
2. CT is just a bit more "northern", geographically and culturally.
3. CT doesn't really have anything like Northwest Jersey.   

From now on, though, the states will probably vote very similarly.  NJ has a bit more of a diverse population to offset the Confederate sympathizers and NASCAR dads in the Pine Barrens and scattered around other parts of South Jersey.  Connecticut is a pretty static state.  New Jersey is losing white population to those emigrating south for warmer weather, and the fact that immigrants still tend to come to Jersey because, in all honestly, you CAN find a job here. 

Glad the thread interested you!

The part in bold is what I found interesting. I always assumed that pretty much all of CT was tied to NYC but apparently that isn't the case. I have an aunt (by marriage) who grew up in eastern Connecticut. She's a big sports fan and she's always rooted for Boston teams like the Red Sox and the Patriots. She grew up going into Boston a lot but the first time she ever visited New York was when she was an adult, after she had moved away from Connecticut. So since that area of the state identifies more with New England then it would make sense that whites would vote more like they do in New England than the mid Atlantic.

Also, I had no idea that Jersey had any areas that were culturally southern. The Pine Barrens sounds kind of like the Florida panhandle- Largely white, close to the ocean, full of pine trees and lots of nascar fans.
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« Reply #8 on: June 01, 2013, 02:40:52 PM »

I loved, loved, loved when I saw this.  NJ and CT are actually extremely similar states. 

-largely suburban
-a couple medium-sized, albeit run-down, cities
-populations that identify more with two cities from other states (NJ: New York and Philadelphia, CT: New York and Boston)
-pretty diverse populations (Non-Hispanic whites: 77% in CT, 69% in NJ)
-some very wealthy shore areas (Gold Coast in CT, Ocean County in NJ)

CT probably always had the edge on us when it came to vote share for the more liberal of the two parties for a couple of reasons.

1. NJ has SOME rural-ish areas.  CT really doesn't have any. 
2. CT is just a bit more "northern", geographically and culturally.
3. CT doesn't really have anything like Northwest Jersey.   

From now on, though, the states will probably vote very similarly.  NJ has a bit more of a diverse population to offset the Confederate sympathizers and NASCAR dads in the Pine Barrens and scattered around other parts of South Jersey.  Connecticut is a pretty static state.  New Jersey is losing white population to those emigrating south for warmer weather, and the fact that immigrants still tend to come to Jersey because, in all honestly, you CAN find a job here. 

Glad the thread interested you!

The part in bold is what I found interesting. I always assumed that pretty much all of CT was tied to NYC but apparently that isn't the case. I have an aunt (by marriage) who grew up in eastern Connecticut. She's a big sports fan and she's always rooted for Boston teams like the Red Sox and the Patriots. She grew up going into Boston a lot but the first time she ever visited New York was when she was an adult, after she had moved away from Connecticut. So since that area of the state identifies more with New England then it would make sense that whites would vote more like they do in New England than the mid Atlantic.

Also, I had no idea that Jersey had any areas that were culturally southern. The Pine Barrens sounds kind of like the Florida panhandle- Largely white, close to the ocean, full of pine trees and lots of nascar fans.

There really isn't any single area in Jersey that is majority "culturally Southern".  It's just that in South Jersey you will find plenty of those types the more inland you go.  In my own town, there is a string of houses along Rancocas Creek that display Confederate flags.  That's in no way the majority, but you will run into it.  I honestly wish we could just ship 'em over to Delaware... they need to grow their population anyway. 
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old timey villain
cope1989
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« Reply #9 on: June 01, 2013, 07:38:08 PM »
« Edited: June 01, 2013, 07:44:32 PM by cope1989 »

I loved, loved, loved when I saw this.  NJ and CT are actually extremely similar states.  

-largely suburban
-a couple medium-sized, albeit run-down, cities
-populations that identify more with two cities from other states (NJ: New York and Philadelphia, CT: New York and Boston)
-pretty diverse populations (Non-Hispanic whites: 77% in CT, 69% in NJ)
-some very wealthy shore areas (Gold Coast in CT, Ocean County in NJ)

CT probably always had the edge on us when it came to vote share for the more liberal of the two parties for a couple of reasons.

1. NJ has SOME rural-ish areas.  CT really doesn't have any.  
2. CT is just a bit more "northern", geographically and culturally.
3. CT doesn't really have anything like Northwest Jersey.    

From now on, though, the states will probably vote very similarly.  NJ has a bit more of a diverse population to offset the Confederate sympathizers and NASCAR dads in the Pine Barrens and scattered around other parts of South Jersey.  Connecticut is a pretty static state.  New Jersey is losing white population to those emigrating south for warmer weather, and the fact that immigrants still tend to come to Jersey because, in all honestly, you CAN find a job here.  

Glad the thread interested you!

The part in bold is what I found interesting. I always assumed that pretty much all of CT was tied to NYC but apparently that isn't the case. I have an aunt (by marriage) who grew up in eastern Connecticut. She's a big sports fan and she's always rooted for Boston teams like the Red Sox and the Patriots. She grew up going into Boston a lot but the first time she ever visited New York was when she was an adult, after she had moved away from Connecticut. So since that area of the state identifies more with New England then it would make sense that whites would vote more like they do in New England than the mid Atlantic.

Also, I had no idea that Jersey had any areas that were culturally southern. The Pine Barrens sounds kind of like the Florida panhandle- Largely white, close to the ocean, full of pine trees and lots of nascar fans.

There really isn't any single area in Jersey that is majority "culturally Southern".  It's just that in South Jersey you will find plenty of those types the more inland you go.  In my own town, there is a string of houses along Rancocas Creek that display Confederate flags.  That's in no way the majority, but you will run into it.  I honestly wish we could just ship 'em over to Delaware... they need to grow their population anyway.  

It seems to me that anybody displaying the rebel flag on the front of their house is pretty damn southern, or at least is a wannabe southerner.

Not that all southerners even like the flag, I certainly don't. I think a lot of people display it because they're trying desperately to create some kind of identity for themselves. I grew up in an exurb of Atlanta and there were a lot of kids who moved there from the northeast and midwest, and sure enough, a lot of them started wearing rebel flag t shirts and putting bumper stickers on their cars. What were they trying to prove??

I bet a lot of those people in the pine barrens are the same way- northerners who feel marginalized from the wealthier areas in NJ and adopt the rebel flag to create some outlaw image.
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« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2013, 01:21:55 AM »
« Edited: June 08, 2013, 01:33:04 AM by asexual trans victimologist »

I loved, loved, loved when I saw this.  NJ and CT are actually extremely similar states. 

-largely suburban
-a couple medium-sized, albeit run-down, cities
-populations that identify more with two cities from other states (NJ: New York and Philadelphia, CT: New York and Boston)
-pretty diverse populations (Non-Hispanic whites: 77% in CT, 69% in NJ)
-some very wealthy shore areas (Gold Coast in CT, Ocean County in NJ)

CT probably always had the edge on us when it came to vote share for the more liberal of the two parties for a couple of reasons.

1. NJ has SOME rural-ish areas.  CT really doesn't have any. 
2. CT is just a bit more "northern", geographically and culturally.
3. CT doesn't really have anything like Northwest Jersey.   

From now on, though, the states will probably vote very similarly.  NJ has a bit more of a diverse population to offset the Confederate sympathizers and NASCAR dads in the Pine Barrens and scattered around other parts of South Jersey.  Connecticut is a pretty static state.  New Jersey is losing white population to those emigrating south for warmer weather, and the fact that immigrants still tend to come to Jersey because, in all honestly, you CAN find a job here. 

The only thing I'd dispute here is to point out that there are sort of rural parts of eastern and northwestern Connecticut.




So, nothing like the Pine Barrens, but the Litchfield Hills and some areas east, roughly speaking, of Willimantic are present and accounted for. New Jersey also has a higher overall population density--1,205 people per square mile to Connecticut's 741.
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Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee
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« Reply #11 on: June 08, 2013, 07:20:13 AM »

I would think that rural CT would be more Democratic or at least more liberal then rural areas of NJ, since Jersey's rural area's would be more like those of say NY or PA, whereas in CT you probably have the VT effect going on, at least to some extent.
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« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2013, 07:32:36 AM »

I would think that rural CT would be more Democratic or at least more liberal then rural areas of NJ, since Jersey's rural area's would be more like those of say NY or PA, whereas in CT you probably have the VT effect going on, at least to some extent.

IIRC, the smallest towns in Litchfield, CT comprise the most reliably Democratic portions of the county.
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PolitiJunkie
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« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2013, 11:46:09 AM »

I don't live in either state, but...

-Hurricane Sandy hit the more Republican areas of NJ.
-Linda McMahon spent a ton of money and perhaps her GOTV helped Romney.
-Obama was weak among Wall Street types in the Gold Coast area.
-Obama was weak among the white, lower middle-class New England types because of racism.
-Romney is from New England and was a finance guy so he was stronger with both groups.
-NJ has slightly more black folks and their turnout dropped less from 2008 than other groups.
-NJ has more Asians who swung towards Obama in 2012.

The two in bold I'd dispute. McMahon actually made some effort to distance herself from the national GOP (there were ads of people saying they were voting for Obama and McMahon), and there are way more blue-collar whites in New Jersey than in Connecticut. In fact, it seems that working-class white ethnic (Italian, Polish, etc) communities in New Jersey had some swing to Obama thanks to Sandy.

But the primary reasons, as stated, are that New Jersey is a more ethnically diverse state and it was hit hard by Sandy.

McMahon may have made ads that said that but, she did spend $12 million dollars.  No other Republican campaign in NJ or CT spent serious money on statewide organizing and GOTV.  That could have had some effect in boosting Romney.

Also, I think lower class whites in New England are especially racist.

That's not true. Lower class whites in Connecticut are especially likely to support Obama. Think lower class Italians, Hispanics, Portuguese, etc in cities like Stamford, New Haven, and Bridgeport. The reason Obama underperformed in Connecticut was for the opposite reason; Romney appealed to the wealthy, white Wall Street crowd in Fairfield County more than other Republicans. That, I believe, is the main answer to the OP's question.
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PolitiJunkie
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« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2013, 11:47:12 AM »
« Edited: June 14, 2013, 11:49:04 AM by PolitiJunkie »

I would think that rural CT would be more Democratic or at least more liberal then rural areas of NJ, since Jersey's rural area's would be more like those of say NY or PA, whereas in CT you probably have the VT effect going on, at least to some extent.

IIRC, the smallest towns in Litchfield, CT comprise the most reliably Democratic portions of the county.

Litchfield County is the least Democratic county in the state.

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Sol
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« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2013, 05:10:12 PM »

I would think that rural CT would be more Democratic or at least more liberal then rural areas of NJ, since Jersey's rural area's would be more like those of say NY or PA, whereas in CT you probably have the VT effect going on, at least to some extent.

IIRC, the smallest towns in Litchfield, CT comprise the most reliably Democratic portions of the county.

Litchfield County is the least Democratic county in the state.

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True, but the most D areas of Litchfield are in the rural parts.
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barfbag
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« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2013, 08:44:53 PM »

This is interesting but it was due to the hurricane. New Jersey would've been between 55-44 and 53-47 for Obama without such an anomaly.
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« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2013, 09:36:13 AM »

This is interesting but it was due to the hurricane. New Jersey would've been 55-44 for Obama without such an anomaly.

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barfbag
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« Reply #18 on: July 02, 2013, 10:20:05 PM »

This is interesting but it was due to the hurricane. New Jersey would've been 55-44 for Obama without such an anomaly.

fixed

what do you mean?
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