FL-Gov: Crist comeback getting underway

[CatoMinor]

Its laughable that some of you think Crist is in any way a moderate. To be a moderate would require him to stake out what his positions are, and he is the least likely to do that of anyone. If he was elected as a Democrat and thought he could better win reelection as a Republican there is no doubt he would switch back without a second thought. Crist's policies will be populist BS that will be liked because they sound good, no matter how terrible they actually are in practice.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ This.

[Donerail]

I pray and hope that some democrat can knock him out in the primaries, it shouldn't be as hard as people think with all his baggage. I would donate all I could and be out knocking on doors to defeat Crist, I'd vote for Sink.

But what Democrat? We don't exactly have a bench. With everyone (Smith, Dyer, Iorio, Buckhorn, Nelson) declining and if we accept that Brown isn't running, the only other conceivable candidate is Alex Sink, and it's very questionable whether she runs. With Crist's support here in Tampa Bay, as well as his popularity with African-Americans, trial lawyers, and teachers (all key Democratic constituencies), any opponents not named Alex Sink would have some of South Florida and not much else, especially with Crist having Obama, Clinton, and whoever else in his corner. Florida Democrats haven't won a state executive race this century except for one race in 2006. We want a winner, and one of our best communicators is our best shot at regaining the office. Seeing Crist, the bipartisan compromiser, go up against a guy who said he didn't know why anyone is not a Republican is a recipe for victory, and that's what Florida Dems need right now.

[Mechaman]

I love the revisionist history in this thread.  Charlie Crist the "moderate" Republican Governor?

This is usually the part where I go on a huge rant, but I think instead I'll leave this here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Crist#Florida_Governor
But hey, if you mean "moderate" as in "slightly to the left of Rick Perry" then yes I guess.

The man is a total scumbucket opportunist who doesn't seem to believe anything.  And you guys are excited that he is your candidate?  Well his opponent is Rick Scott. . . . . . but still.

EDIT: Mega mistype gaffe.  Still, the overall point stands.

[Donerail]

This is usually the part where I go on a huge rant, but I think instead I'll leave this here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Crist#Florida_Governor
But hey, if you mean "moderate" as in "slightly to the right of Rick Perry" then yes I guess.

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So which bit is the to-the-right-of-Perry part?

[CatoMinor]

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Oh and whats this?

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Crist has no positions. People are loving him because he can beat Rick Scott, but he's hardly a FF. 

[Donerail]

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“Marriage is something sanctified between a man and a woman." - Barack Obama (2004)
"For me personally, it is important for me to go ahead and affirm that I think same-sex couples should be able to get married." - Barack Obama (2012).

Not exactly an unacceptable shift.

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What really mattered was the ultrasound veto. Pro-choice when it counts.

[Brittain33]

Great. So if he has no defined positions, it makes it that much more likely he'll adhere to some Dem positions when he runs as a Dem.

[Dereich]

Great. So if he has no defined positions, it makes it that much more likely he'll adhere to some Dem positions when he runs as a Dem.

Unless he thinks they would hold back his further political carrier. If he thought the winds were blowing right he'd go right back to being "chain gang Charlie". If he ends up winning he'll lurch to the right immediately to get anything passed through the Republican legislature. You're bound for disappointment if you think anything else.

Here's a few quotes from him and his website in 2010

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And Sjoyce, it'd be easier to accept that as a real change of heart if he didn't have quite a few cases of full turnabouts in belief. As recently as 2010 he had an A+ from the NRA http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2010/jul/14/charlie-crist/crist-stands-firm-gun-rights/ and now he talks about gun restrictions.

And here was his position on Obamacare in February 2010: “Absolutely not,” he said. “And the reason is three. Number one, it would raise the rates people would have to pay for health insurance. Number two, it would raise taxes at a time when we don’t need to be raising taxes at all. And number three, it would have the incredible effect of taking about half a trillion dollars out of Medicare.” Then, FIVE MONTHS LATER he says "I would have voted for it. But I think it can be done better, I really do." Even on education he's decided to up the pandering by changing his positions to oppose vouchers: http://tbo.com/news/who-is-the-real-charlie-crist-578827
Abortion has been probably his most consistent political position and he's even changed his stance on that 2 or 3 times.
 
Good lord, I don't see how you can like this spineless creep Sjoyce.  

[BluegrassBlueVote]

Crist was a good governor and the alternative is Rick Scott. I'm not personally supporting the guy or hoping he'll run for president one day, but he can win in a swing state in time for 2016 and that's what important.

[tmthforu94]

Anyone who labeled Mitt Romney as a flip-flopper, opportunist, scumbag, etc., and doesn't label Crist the same is a hypocrite. Plain and simple.

At least Mitt Romney's alleged shift was basically from the middle to the right. Crist is trying to jump from the right all the way to the left, and I sincerely hope he doesn't get away with it.

[Anti Democrat Democrat Club]

Now I know how the conservatives that begrudgingly backed Romney felt after the candidates of the month dropped out. FL Dems seem to be more interested in getting the best candidate to beat Scott instead of a real Democrat. The party switch absolutely wreaks of a power grab, and I would have preferred someone like Iorio to step up before she declined.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

Anyone who labeled Mitt Romney as a flip-flopper, opportunist, scumbag, etc., and doesn't label Crist the same is a hypocrite. Plain and simple.

At least Mitt Romney's alleged shift was basically from the middle to the right. Crist is trying to jump from the right all the way to the left, and I sincerely hope he doesn't get away with it.

Crist is no better than Romney. The difference is that one is running for governor of a state many hours away from me while the other was trying to be my president.

I just want him to beat Scott.

[Dereich]

Anyone who labeled Mitt Romney as a flip-flopper, opportunist, scumbag, etc., and doesn't label Crist the same is a hypocrite. Plain and simple.

At least Mitt Romney's alleged shift was basically from the middle to the right. Crist is trying to jump from the right all the way to the left, and I sincerely hope he doesn't get away with it.

Crist is no better than Romney. The difference is that one is running for governor of a state many hours away from me while the other was trying to be my president.

I just want him to beat Scott.

Which of Scott's policies in particular do you disagree with so much?

[BluegrassBlueVote]

Anyone who labeled Mitt Romney as a flip-flopper, opportunist, scumbag, etc., and doesn't label Crist the same is a hypocrite. Plain and simple.

At least Mitt Romney's alleged shift was basically from the middle to the right. Crist is trying to jump from the right all the way to the left, and I sincerely hope he doesn't get away with it.

Crist is no better than Romney. The difference is that one is running for governor of a state many hours away from me while the other was trying to be my president.

I just want him to beat Scott.

Which of Scott's policies in particular do you disagree with so much?

You really need to ask that?

And then there's the strategical implications of having a Democrat as governor of a swing state for '16 instead of a Republican.

[Dereich]

Anyone who labeled Mitt Romney as a flip-flopper, opportunist, scumbag, etc., and doesn't label Crist the same is a hypocrite. Plain and simple.

At least Mitt Romney's alleged shift was basically from the middle to the right. Crist is trying to jump from the right all the way to the left, and I sincerely hope he doesn't get away with it.

Crist is no better than Romney. The difference is that one is running for governor of a state many hours away from me while the other was trying to be my president.

I just want him to beat Scott.

Which of Scott's policies in particular do you disagree with so much?

You really need to ask that?

And then there's the strategical implications of having a Democrat as governor of a swing state for '16 instead of a Republican.

I really do. What specifically has he done in office that you disagree so vehemently with? He's been the moderate force as compared to the legislature (which is itself more moderate than many other Republican legislatures). Why are you so desperate to be rid of him personally that you'd accept the lowest of the very low?

[Mechaman]

This is usually the part where I go on a huge rant, but I think instead I'll leave this here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Crist#Florida_Governor
But hey, if you mean "moderate" as in "slightly to the right of Rick Perry" then yes I guess.

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So which bit is the to-the-right-of-Perry part?

I'm going to admit an epic dumbass mistake moment.  I meant to say "left".
Still your quotes don't negate the fact that you guys are living in revisionist land if you think the Governor who passed restrictions on same sex adoption was "moderate".

Look I feel really really freaking sorry for you to have Rick Scott as a Governor.  But replacing him with Charlie Crist is like replacing inoperable brain cancer with AIDS.  Going further with the AIDS parallel, if Charlie Crist wins the race it sets a dangerous precedent in many areas where the "best candidate" is more preferable to the "right" ("right" as in the morally correct choice, not "right" as in "right wing") candidate.  If Florida can't elect anybody but a former Republican Governor from the last decade, it's at least time to get back to the drawing board.

[Mechaman]

One more thing SJoyce:

While this is a state office and not a federal seat he's running for, you would be one of the first to admit that Crist would have no qualms taking the anti-privacy, pro-war, and pro-drone policies that the hacks do now days. You made one of the greatest threads in the history of this forum as to why Barack Obama didn't deserve your support in 2012. . ..  what in the blue hell are you doing supporting a man who would no doubt be a statist control freak if he was put in the right position?  If I saw this kind of inconsistent logic from posters like Lief I wouldn't be at all surprised, but from you?  Really?

And before you respond "he's running for Governor, not Senator" I would point out that Charlie Crist attaining statewide office arguably puts him a step closer to federal office in the future.  For me, that's too dangerous a scenario to consider support.  And unlike Rick Scott, who will no doubt go down being remembered as one of the most horrible POS who ever governed a state, his becoming President is more of a certifiable reality.  I'm not saying four more years of Rick Scott is preferable to four more years of Crist, but given how horrible Scott has been as Governor I don't see what the harm is in considering other candidates for office.  The man barely won election in a Republican wave year (granted against a popular Democrat) Republicans haven't really shown yet that they are on track to repeat the wave in 2014.

So yes I will echo Dereich's statement: What are you doing supporting such a creep?

[Donerail]

Look I feel really really freaking sorry for you to have Rick Scott as a Governor.  But replacing him with Charlie Crist is like replacing inoperable brain cancer with AIDS.  Going further with the AIDS parallel, if Charlie Crist wins the race it sets a dangerous precedent in many areas where the "best candidate" is more preferable to the "right" ("right" as in the morally correct choice, not "right" as in "right wing") candidate.  If Florida can't elect anybody but a former Republican Governor from the last decade, it's at least time to get back to the drawing board.

He's not the best candidate; I readily admit that, and the FL Dems certainly have other prospects, but everybody else has already declined, or won't run (Dereich explained Brown; Sink just had her husband die and is extremely unlikely to do so). He really is the only option that FL Dems have; everyone else has either declined or would be 4 more years of Scott. He's basically the only option.

And before you respond "he's running for Governor, not Senator" I would point out that Charlie Crist attaining statewide office arguably puts him a step closer to federal office in the future.  For me, that's too dangerous a scenario to consider support.  And unlike Rick Scott, who will no doubt go down being remembered as one of the most horrible POS who ever governed a state, his becoming President is more of a certifiable reality.  I'm not saying four more years of Rick Scott is preferable to four more years of Crist, but given how horrible Scott has been as Governor I don't see what the harm is in considering other candidates for office.  The man barely won election in a Republican wave year (granted against a popular Democrat) Republicans haven't really shown yet that they are on track to repeat the wave in 2014.

Maybe I'm being shortsighted, but if Crist runs for an office where he would have control over those issues (which I still care about) with those positions, then I would oppose his election. As it is, however, he's not - he's running against Rick Scott, where his issues will include stuff like high-speed rail, not drones. It's also worth mentioning that SB 92 passed (I believe unanimously; I remember it was 117-0 in the House) last session and is now law, heavily restricting the use of drones in the state - it's doubtful that the heavily Republican Legislature would repeal it at the behest of a Democratic governor. Crist just isn't really a threat on those issues for this office - thinking long-term there's a possibility, but is 4 more years of Scott really worth it?

And while a Crist or Sink victory would be a pretty decent bet, Scott isn't dead yet and leads some candidates.

[ajc0918]

According to a local political insider, Sink is telling her inner circle that she plans to run.

[tmthforu94]

According to a local political insider, Sink is telling her inner circle that she plans to run.

Hopefully this is right. I've always like Sink - I supported her in 2010, and while I'm not sure for 2014, I'd certainly be rooting for her in the primary.

[The Arizonan]

I thought we already have a Democratic candidate running for governor named Nan Rich. Did she drop out and I somehow missed that?

[Dereich]

I thought we already have a Democratic candidate running for governor named Nan Rich. Did she drop out and I somehow missed that?

Nan Rich has never had much of a chance of winning the Democratic primary. She's technically plausible as former Senate minority leader, but she's widely seen as too liberal to do well outside Democratic strongholds. She declared really really early hoping to gain momentum before big names like Sink or Crist jumped into the race. While she's been getting into the news a bit over the last week or so she's still too low in name recognition to do very well. The GOP are actually doing a media campaign on twitter right now supporting Nan Rich (and embarrassing the state Democrats) called #FreeNanRich over her being denied a speaking slot at the big Democratic gathering of the year.

Oh, and I've said it before, but I've always been a big fan of Alex Sink and never doubted for a moment that she'd be running. I hope she can take Crist out.

[Donerail]

I thought we already have a Democratic candidate running for governor named Nan Rich. Did she drop out and I somehow missed that?

This is the problem with Nan Rich.

[windjammer]

http://www.nationaljournal.com/politics/florida-governor-s-immigration-veto-predicted-to-set-off-anti-hispanic-bomb-20130604

A bit risky?

[BluegrassBlueVote]

Anyone who labeled Mitt Romney as a flip-flopper, opportunist, scumbag, etc., and doesn't label Crist the same is a hypocrite. Plain and simple.

At least Mitt Romney's alleged shift was basically from the middle to the right. Crist is trying to jump from the right all the way to the left, and I sincerely hope he doesn't get away with it.

Crist is no better than Romney. The difference is that one is running for governor of a state many hours away from me while the other was trying to be my president.

I just want him to beat Scott.

Which of Scott's policies in particular do you disagree with so much?

You really need to ask that?

And then there's the strategical implications of having a Democrat as governor of a swing state for '16 instead of a Republican.

I really do. What specifically has he done in office that you disagree so vehemently with? He's been the moderate force as compared to the legislature (which is itself more moderate than many other Republican legislatures). Why are you so desperate to be rid of him personally that you'd accept the lowest of the very low?

Uh, well besides disagreeing ideologically with just about everything he believes in, his refusal of the high-speed rail and Medicare expansion funds (until a few months ago on the latter) was ridiculous and his unfettered support for drug-testing welfare applicants is absolutely inexcusable. He's also, you know, incompetent and considered one of the worst governors in the country. What's next, you want to know why I'm no fan or Reagan or Dubya? It isn't obvious enough?

Competence > incompetence in terms of Crist vs. Scott and governance in general. Neither will be my governor, so why should I care about Crist being a opportunistic weasel? He's capable and would be a Democrat in charge of a massively important swing state in the next presidential election.