Could early Christian martyrdom have largely been a myth?
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  Could early Christian martyrdom have largely been a myth?
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Author Topic: Could early Christian martyrdom have largely been a myth?  (Read 925 times)
Joe Kakistocracy
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« on: May 13, 2013, 02:54:03 PM »

Our silly 'copyright infringement' policy requires that I clumsily chop up this article for you.  I'd recommend reading the rest of it; it's an interesting hypothesis.


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Torie
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« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2013, 03:18:50 PM »

Yes, my overall impression is that the Romans were pretty religiously tolerant. They were more interested in rule on this earth, rather than what might lie beyond, and after one's final exit.
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afleitch
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« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2013, 03:34:05 PM »

It would certainly be interesting to read her work. The Romans were generally favourable to new religions and faiths as long as they did not claim either supremacy which early Christianity did or were hostile to the state. Roman religion was very public. The Empire was faced with a new cult which seemed to be as 'set apart' as the Jews (and potentially as mischievous) in terms of how Christians operated in society. Worse still they were not geographically concentrated and were seeking converts. They became a cult group that was subverting the state and it's institutions so treatment of them by the authorities was always going to be harsh. The anti-pagan iconoclasm of the Christians after the reign of Constantine helped confirm those fears.
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Free Speech Enjoyer
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« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2013, 03:39:42 PM »

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This is interesting.  If the books I read in the last several months are correct, I believe the early Romans thought of Caesar as a God and were obligated to worship all their kings as such, and so those who refused to partake in that custom were treated as outsiders.

However, I'm not entirely surprised that they refused to join the military.  Pacifism was a common belief among early Christians.
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Tokugawa Sexgod Ieyasu
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« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2013, 04:03:03 PM »

I thought it was already generally accepted that the early Christians were persecuted for the ways in which the faith incidentally conflicted with Roman public mores, rather than the specific theological propositions involved.
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TJ in Oregon
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« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2013, 08:03:31 PM »

I thought it was already generally accepted that the early Christians were persecuted for the ways in which the faith incidentally conflicted with Roman public mores, rather than the specific theological propositions involved.

One good example of this was St. Agnes, who was put to death for refusing to have sex and refusing marriage to a well-connected Roman. The Romans were likely fine with her Christianity itself, but not her oath of virginity.
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The Mikado
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« Reply #6 on: May 14, 2013, 01:15:50 PM »
« Edited: May 14, 2013, 02:26:53 PM by The Mikado »

Persecution was a result of Christian refusal to participate in the imperial cult, about the equivalent of not saying the pledge of allegiance or not saluting the flag.  It's a sign of possibly treasonous of unpatriotic intent in the eyes of some (see how much crap the Jehovah's Witnesses get today).  The Romans, except under Diocletian, didn't go out of their way to attack Christians, but Christians ended up in trouble for ostentatiously refusing to sprinkle incense on the Altar of Victory and other cult activities that all patriotic Romans were expected to do.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I explicitly said "except under Diocletian."  Christians (and Manicheans, and other foreign-ish religions) were heavily persecuted in his reign even by modern standards.
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Oldiesfreak1854
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« Reply #7 on: May 14, 2013, 07:33:12 PM »

Well, as I understand, Christians began worshipping on Sunday to avoid the persecution against Jews after the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD, and since Sunday was already a pagan day of worship, it was an easy choice to replace Saturday because it not only prevented this persecution, but it also brought more pagans into the Church.  They did the wrong thing for the right reasons.
Persecution was a result of Christian refusal to participate in the imperial cult, about the equivalent of not saying the pledge of allegiance or not saluting the flag.  It's a sign of possibly treasonous of unpatriotic intent in the eyes of some (see how much crap the Jehovah's Witnesses get today).  The Romans, except under Diocletian, didn't go out of their way to attack Christians, but Christians ended up in trouble for ostentatiously refusing to sprinkle incense on the Altar of Victory and other cult activities that all patriotic Romans were expected to do.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I explicitly said "except under Diocletian."  Christians (and Manicheans, and other foreign-ish religions) were heavily persecuted in his reign even by modern standards.
There's a major difference between not saluting the flag, voting, etc. and not participating in the imperial cult.  The Romans considered the emperor to be a god, which was most likely why the early Christians refused to participate in it.
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