Irish Demographic Maps

[Benj]

In the "Other Stated Religion" map, four constitutencies outside the Greater Dublin area stand out in brownish colour. Thre of them are adjacent to Northern Ireland, so I assume its Protestants there.

But what about the coastal strip south-west of Cork? Hippie-land with lots of Celtic Druids and converted Buddhists? Or English, German and Dutch immigrannts working for the local tourism business?

I believe there's a bit of a Protestant tradition in Kerry, at least stronger than elsewhere in rural Ireland.

[minionofmidas]

It's southwestern County Cork, actually. But yes, the area has a homegrown Protestant (minority) tradition.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

I thought there were more Prots in Cavan/Monaghan

There were, especially in Monaghan*. The population declined dramatically after partition though.

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Ah this is where you have been ill-informed. There has long been a Protestant minority in Donegal, around 25% in 1921 although obviously much lower now. During the period of partition, dividing up Donegal between the North and the South was regularly touted even including the Boundary commission. Some signs of Northern Protestantism still persist in the region to this day.

* (Actually IIRC there were more Prots in Monaghan at time of the 1911 Census than in Fermanagh. Either way, the population levels were very similar. It was geography not population o/c which determined partition).

In the "Other Stated Religion" map, four constitutencies outside the Greater Dublin area stand out in brownish colour. Thre of them are adjacent to Northern Ireland, so I assume its Protestants there.

Yes. Those regions are part of historic Ulster.

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What Lewis said but also all of the above apply to some what. West Cork has got a reputation for its large (by Irish standards) Hippie population and of Continental Europeans setting up organic farms. The Eastern Part of the constituency is also quite rich and full of old towns, and old, rich towns in Ireland are associated with non-negligible Protestant populations. The same is true in Wicklow.

[ObserverIE]

I thought there were more Prots in Cavan/Monaghan

Actually IIRC there were more Prots in Monaghan at time of the 1911 Census than in Fermanagh. Either way, the population levels were very similar. It was geography not population o/c which determined partition).

There were (and are) more Presbyterians in Monaghan than Fermanagh. Fermanagh has (and had) a much larger Protestant population once you include Anglicans and Methodists. (Supposedly this is because a lot of the 17th century settlers in Fermanagh were Border Reivers - of doubtful Protestantism to begin with - who went with Anglicanism rather than Presbyterianism once on the ground.)

[Tetro Kornbluth]

I thought there were more Prots in Cavan/Monaghan

Actually IIRC there were more Prots in Monaghan at time of the 1911 Census than in Fermanagh. Either way, the population levels were very similar. It was geography not population o/c which determined partition).

There were (and are) more Presbyterians in Monaghan than Fermanagh. Fermanagh has (and had) a much larger Protestant population once you include Anglicans and Methodists. (Supposedly this is because a lot of the 17th century settlers in Fermanagh were Border Reivers - of doubtful Protestantism to begin with - who went with Anglicanism rather than Presbyterianism once on the ground.)

This is correct. I knew I was forgetting something important. Thanks.

EDIT: I had been trying to find some stuff on this earlier to back up my faulty memory. This map was the best I could find (From wiki so I don't know how reliable):



So yeah correct, I apologize for any misinformation given.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Born in the UK....



I put Donegal North East a shade too dark and it's number can't be read in the chart - it should read 17.07%.

Lowest numbers seen in - predictably enough - Working Class urban areas.

[Franknburger]

Born in the UK....

I guess UK includes Northern Ireland. Any way to distinguish Intra-Irish migration from non-Irish UK immigrants (I suppose this could be quite different patterns after all)?

[Oakvale]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

[ObserverIE]

Did anyone in Dublin declare their occupation as "farmer"? I'd like to meet that person

Yes. In every constituency there were people who declared themselves as farmers. In Dublin Central there were 47 people who were declared as farmers (or 0.04%). It's not impossible or like the US, it only takes two hours from the centre to get into deep countryside and it's possible that these people have more than one job which requires them to be in the city but any real details further than that I would not know.

You do have the Phoenix Park and the Botanic Gardens nearby, I suppose, and there are a couple of farms inside the city boundaries (http://census.cso.ie/agrimap/).

What I'm really impressed by is the city block formed by Camden Street/Grantham Street/Synge Street/South Circular Road (small area 268142005, and part of Hipster Central to the casual observer) where 10% of the population claim to be farmers. Guys, a marijuana plant in a pot does not a market garden make.

An entire basement converted to a greenhouse, on the other hand.... especially if that's indeed your biggest source of income?

Much more prevalent down my way but I don't think the farmers concerned would be inclined to fill out census forms - 至少不是英文.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

[Oakvale]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

[ObserverIE]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

There's a farm listed on the Census of Agriculture in one of the Whitehall EDs, which I assume is whatever part of the old Albert Agricultural College didn't get taken over by Dublin City University. Less plausibly, there's one in Royal Exchange A (Temple Bar/Dublin Castle/west side of Great Georges Street-Aungier Street).

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

[ObserverIE]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

Bertie Ahern was renowned for his continual doorstep canvassing at all weekends (and sometimes evenings) during the year, in between elections as well as during them.

Oakvale, for some reason I thought you came from Monaghan.

[Oakvale]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

That's the appropriate reaction, yes.

Bertie Ahern used to knock on doors canvassing as part of his "man of the people" schtick. Sometimes he would be invited inside briefly to talk about how he represented the plain people of Ireland or whatever. Anyway, my parents would never have let him in but my fourteen-year-old brother knew no better so that... happened.

I've never been the same since.

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

Bertie Ahern was renowned for his continual doorstep canvassing at all weekends (and sometimes evenings) during the year, in between elections as well as during them.

Oakvale, for some reason I thought you came from Monaghan.

Ah, you're confusing me with my fellow I-IE, Jas.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

Bertie Ahern was renowned for his continual doorstep canvassing at all weekends (and sometimes evenings) during the year, in between elections as well as during them.

Oakvale, for some reason I thought you came from Monaghan.

No, that's the other (now rarely seen) I-IE poster; Jas.

[ObserverIE]

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

That's the appropriate reaction, yes.

Bertie Ahern used to knock on doors canvassing as part of his "man of the people" schtick. Sometimes he would be invited inside briefly to talk about how he represented the plain people of Ireland or whatever. Anyway, my parents would never have let him in but my fourteen-year-old brother knew no better so that... happened.

I've never been the same since.

When does the brother get home from exile?

[ObserverIE]

Oakvale, for some reason I thought you came from Monaghan.

No, that's the other (now rarely seen) I-IE poster; Jas.

Ah, apologies.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Now to go a bit off-base. Lietuva!



Yes, that's right. No detailed Protestant information available but there is data on the Lithuanian-born (In nation of birth the data by constituency I can access is Ireland, the UK, Poland, Lithuania, Other EU and ROTW (see above)).

So what happened in Cavan/Monaghan?

[ObserverIE]

Now to go a bit off-base. Lietuva!



Yes, that's right. No detailed Protestant information available but there is data on the Lithuanian-born (In nation of birth the data by constituency I can access is Ireland, the UK, Poland, Lithuania, Other EU and ROTW (see above)).

So what happened in Cavan/Monaghan?

Mushrooms and piggeries, basically. There was a sizeable Lithuanian and Latvian presence in the area (as evidenced by car registration plates) even before 2004.

As far as the religious breakdown is concerned, I think they only publish about 5 or 6 categories, but they publish them at all levels down to Small Area. I think the 2006 census reports listed a more detailed breakdown at county level only. (Edit: Yep.)

[Tetro Kornbluth]

^

Yeah, I know that county level (and lower) data exists, I'm just sticking with constituency level for the moment.

[ObserverIE]

^

Yeah, I know that county level (and lower) data exists, I'm just sticking with constituency level for the moment.

The point I'm trying to make is that in 2006, there was a detailed breakdown given by Christian denomination at county level rather than just lumping everyone in as "other religion". The jazzed-up but dumbed-down "profiles" for the 2011 census no longer give that detail.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

^

Yeah, I know that county level (and lower) data exists, I'm just sticking with constituency level for the moment.

The point I'm trying to make is that in 2006, there was a detailed breakdown given by Christian denomination at county level rather than just lumping everyone in as "other religion". The jazzed-up but dumbed-down "profiles" for the 2011 census no longer give that detail.

Oh sorry, I catch you now. I've found though that the CSO sometimes doesn't release some detailed information for years after they have collected it. I don't know if this is the case here or not.

[Tetro Kornbluth]

Unskilled labourers with some rounding done (Galway West and Kildare South were put upwards. I am so cruel to these places)



Kind of interesting how this really is the inverse of the Managerial map.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Fascinating, and I normally find this kind of thing very dull. I live in 'Dublin Central' and don't recall ever seeing any farms around but some people have gardens and perhaps some of them grow broccoli or something.

Whereabouts, if I may be so imprudent to ask?

Cabra, one of Bertie's many old stomping grounds. I once came home to find the man himself in my kitchen, let in by my brother to the horror of my parents.

What.

That's the appropriate reaction, yes.

Bertie Ahern used to knock on doors canvassing as part of his "man of the people" schtick. Sometimes he would be invited inside briefly to talk about how he represented the plain people of Ireland or whatever. Anyway, my parents would never have let him in but my fourteen-year-old brother knew no better so that... happened.

I've never been the same since.

That's, uh, special. You have my condolences.