Talking About WWII--Something Which Came to my Mind
Bono:
From the way I see it, FDR, or whoever was secretary of state at the time, handled the last times of WWII pretty bad. I'll present an alternativer scnerio, I'd apreciate some feddback from the history experts. ;)
Filed Marshall Rommel thought that Germany should surrendor to the Allies,a dn that they should altogetehr fight the Russians. I thin the Allies should have reached out to Dönitzt after Hitler had suicided, instead of denying to recongnize his government, and should've rush some emergency help in, in order to garner what was left of the german forces to try to push the Russians eastwards. Plus, Donitz's own U-Boats should have been redeployed to the Black and Blatic Seas, and over Panama Canal to the pacific, where US bases could help them with supplies etc, and they would choke any Russian Commerce, and destroy the Russian Pacific fleet by attacking the Vladivostok instanlations. Also, what was left of the Africa Corps, plus Gen. Montegomery's troops could turn east, through British Iraq, forcing passage through Turkey or Iran if needed, and reaching the Caucasus. If they had managed to cross the Caucasus sucesefully, which woould be to expect, due to the resentment the Azeris, Armenians and other Caucasus people had towards Moscow(except maybe Georgians), but as I siad, if they managed to cross Caucasus, they'd caught the Russians off guard, sieze the Oil Fields, and while the German/Allied troops would be keeping them busy in theeastern europe front, Monty could rush through the steps and be in Moscow in 2 weeks.
What about?
Jake:
I would've supported open war with the Soviets in 1945. General Patton was right. Rearm the German POWs and they would've fought entusiastically against the Soviets.
Some observations though
1) By 1945 there wasn't an Afrika Korps any more. They suurendered in 1943.
2) The US Pacific Fleet would've stomped any Soviet naval force that sallied forth from Vladivostok.
3) The Russians wouldn't have had such a big advantage in troops. If we had rearmed the Germans and kept their factories operating, troops totals would be roughly equal. Reinforcements would greatly favor the US as we had barely tapped our military resources. We fielded about 70-80 divisions and could have fielded about 50 more.
4) This war would've been long and hard. After some confused fighting, the lines would be formed somewhere between the Elbe and Oder rivers and the fighting would commence from there. I could see the Soviets pulling back if we "demonstrate" an atomic weapon on hiroshima and then threaten their troops with the second.
Bono:
Quote from: Jake on January 07, 2005, 05:33:43 PM
1) By 1945 there wasn't an Afrika Korps any more. They suurendered in 1943.
There were still teh remainders and the contingent that was French and that was stationed in Algeria and Morocco, controlled by Germany.
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It'd be better to have the german subs kill them in their nest.
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I think the european front would be really just a treat to keep them busy while the African forces would storm through the Southeast, which would be the true surprise offensive, and the only one that could end it up quickyl
J. J.:
Quote from: Senator Bono on January 07, 2005, 04:59:29 PM
From the way I see it, FDR, or whoever was secretary of state at the time, handled the last times of WWII pretty bad. I'll present an alternativer scnerio, I'd apreciate some feddback from the history experts. ;)
Filed Marshall Rommel thought that Germany should surrendor to the Allies,a dn that they should altogetehr fight the Russians. I thin the Allies should have reached out to Dönitzt after Hitler had suicided, instead of denying to recongnize his government, and should've rush some emergency help in, in order to garner what was left of the german forces to try to push the Russians eastwards. Plus, Donitz's own U-Boats should have been redeployed to the Black and Blatic Seas, and over Panama Canal to the pacific, where US bases could help them with supplies etc, and they would choke any Russian Commerce, and destroy the Russian Pacific fleet by attacking the Vladivostok instanlations. Also, what was left of the Africa Corps, plus Gen. Montegomery's troops could turn east, through British Iraq, forcing passage through Turkey or Iran if needed, and reaching the Caucasus. If they had managed to cross the Caucasus sucesefully, which woould be to expect, due to the resentment the Azeris, Armenians and other Caucasus people had towards Moscow(except maybe Georgians), but as I siad, if they managed to cross Caucasus, they'd caught the Russians off guard, sieze the Oil Fields, and while the German/Allied troops would be keeping them busy in theeastern europe front, Monty could rush through the steps and be in Moscow in 2 weeks.
What about?
You are forgetting several important things.
1. Rommel was forced to commit suicide well before the end of the war. There were very few top Germans that were neither tainted with Nazism or who had had a bad track record as military leaders.
2. Donitz was fuhrer for a bit more than a week and Berlin had almost fallen by the time of the appointment.
3. There were still the Japanese.
4. Roosevelt had died and Truman, with virtually no experience in foriegn affairs, in charge.
5. History give us 20/20 hindsight. Maybe Patton was right, but we couldn't tell that at the time.
Jake:
Quote from: Senator Bono on January 07, 2005, 05:44:53 PM
Quote from: Jake on January 07, 2005, 05:33:43 PM
1) By 1945 there wasn't an Afrika Korps any more. They suurendered in 1943.
There were still teh remainders and the contingent that was French and that was stationed in Algeria and Morocco, controlled by Germany.
No, by 1945, all of north Africa was Allied controlled and no Axis Forces remained there. There were some British troops in the middle East, but not enough to launch an offensive towards Moscow.
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