Homosexuality

[J. J.]

The predisposition to same-sex attraction is probably at least in part genetic, along with some element of socialization, any activity that could affect hormone levels, etc.

But, to act upon those attractions is not genetic at all. People also have the ability to not engage in a sex act or to enter into a certain relationship. So if we take homosexuality to be an act rather than an attraction (the word 'homosexuality' may be ambiguous in this respect, though I haven't met many celibate people who experience same-sex attraction who call themselves homosexuals so I am taking it to imply that one has engaged in said acts and is not celibate), then it must be a choice as long as we accept that we have the ability to make choices, ie. free will. If we have no free will then this is all a moot point anyway, so I'd consider "lifestyle choice" to be a more representative reflection of my view than "genetic" but that I'd rather select "Both" if I could.

Breathing and eating should also be classified as "lifestyle choices" then.

What we eat is largely a lifestyle choice, as is how much we eat.  It isn't absolute free will, but it is close.

[ilikeverin]

The predisposition to same-sex attraction is probably at least in part genetic, along with some element of socialization, any activity that could affect hormone levels, etc.

But, to act upon those attractions is not genetic at all. People also have the ability to not engage in a sex act or to enter into a certain relationship. So if we take homosexuality to be an act rather than an attraction (the word 'homosexuality' may be ambiguous in this respect, though I haven't met many celibate people who experience same-sex attraction who call themselves homosexuals so I am taking it to imply that one has engaged in said acts and is not celibate), then it must be a choice as long as we accept that we have the ability to make choices, ie. free will. If we have no free will then this is all a moot point anyway, so I'd consider "lifestyle choice" to be a more representative reflection of my view than "genetic" but that I'd rather select "Both" if I could.

Breathing and eating should also be classified as "lifestyle choices" then.

What we eat is largely a lifestyle choice, as is how much we eat.  It isn't absolute free will, but it is close.

That's actually probably untrue.  Obesity has high heritability, somewhere around .80 (higher than height, even!).  A lot of that is likely due to different food preferences which might be essentially hardwired.  I'm somewhat of a supertaster, for example, and my eating habits reflect that; consequently, I'm not overweight.  It's hard to imagine the number of taste buds on my tongue not at least partially being a product of genetics

That's not to say you can't help your weight entirely, of course.  But most people don't try to do things completely out of sync with what their body tells them.

[Verily]

Not genetic per se, but far more similar to genetics than lifestyle choice (i.e., not wholly [or maybe at all] genetic, influenced by pre-natal conditions, but definitely not a choice nor something that can be controlled by others by controlling childhood environment).

[Free Palestine]

The predisposition to same-sex attraction is probably at least in part genetic, along with some element of socialization, any activity that could affect hormone levels, etc.

But, to act upon those attractions is not genetic at all. People also have the ability to not engage in a sex act or to enter into a certain relationship. So if we take homosexuality to be an act rather than an attraction (the word 'homosexuality' may be ambiguous in this respect, though I haven't met many celibate people who experience same-sex attraction who call themselves homosexuals so I am taking it to imply that one has engaged in said acts and is not celibate), then it must be a choice as long as we accept that we have the ability to make choices, ie. free will. If we have no free will then this is all a moot point anyway, so I'd consider "lifestyle choice" to be a more representative reflection of my view than "genetic" but that I'd rather select "Both" if I could.

Breathing and eating should also be classified as "lifestyle choices" then.

What we eat is largely a lifestyle choice, as is how much we eat.  It isn't absolute free will, but it is close.

That's actually probably untrue.  Obesity has high heritability, somewhere around .80 (higher than height, even!).  A lot of that is likely due to different food preferences which might be essentially hardwired.  I'm somewhat of a supertaster, for example, and my eating habits reflect that; consequently, I'm not overweight.  It's hard to imagine the number of taste buds on my tongue not at least partially being a product of genetics

That's not to say you can't help your weight entirely, of course.  But most people don't try to do things completely out of sync with what their body tells them.

I think it has to do with fat parents passing on their unhealthy eating habits to their kids, who become fats themselves, rather than anything genetic.

[J. J.]

The predisposition to same-sex attraction is probably at least in part genetic, along with some element of socialization, any activity that could affect hormone levels, etc.

But, to act upon those attractions is not genetic at all. People also have the ability to not engage in a sex act or to enter into a certain relationship. So if we take homosexuality to be an act rather than an attraction (the word 'homosexuality' may be ambiguous in this respect, though I haven't met many celibate people who experience same-sex attraction who call themselves homosexuals so I am taking it to imply that one has engaged in said acts and is not celibate), then it must be a choice as long as we accept that we have the ability to make choices, ie. free will. If we have no free will then this is all a moot point anyway, so I'd consider "lifestyle choice" to be a more representative reflection of my view than "genetic" but that I'd rather select "Both" if I could.

Breathing and eating should also be classified as "lifestyle choices" then.

What we eat is largely a lifestyle choice, as is how much we eat.  It isn't absolute free will, but it is close.

That's actually probably untrue.  Obesity has high heritability, somewhere around .80 (higher than height, even!).  A lot of that is likely due to different food preferences which might be essentially hardwired.  I'm somewhat of a supertaster, for example, and my eating habits reflect that; consequently, I'm not overweight.  It's hard to imagine the number of taste buds on my tongue not at least partially being a product of genetics

That's not to say you can't help your weight entirely, of course.  But most people don't try to do things completely out of sync with what their body tells them.

We still choose how much to eat.

[ilikeverin]

The predisposition to same-sex attraction is probably at least in part genetic, along with some element of socialization, any activity that could affect hormone levels, etc.

But, to act upon those attractions is not genetic at all. People also have the ability to not engage in a sex act or to enter into a certain relationship. So if we take homosexuality to be an act rather than an attraction (the word 'homosexuality' may be ambiguous in this respect, though I haven't met many celibate people who experience same-sex attraction who call themselves homosexuals so I am taking it to imply that one has engaged in said acts and is not celibate), then it must be a choice as long as we accept that we have the ability to make choices, ie. free will. If we have no free will then this is all a moot point anyway, so I'd consider "lifestyle choice" to be a more representative reflection of my view than "genetic" but that I'd rather select "Both" if I could.

Breathing and eating should also be classified as "lifestyle choices" then.

What we eat is largely a lifestyle choice, as is how much we eat.  It isn't absolute free will, but it is close.

That's actually probably untrue.  Obesity has high heritability, somewhere around .80 (higher than height, even!).  A lot of that is likely due to different food preferences which might be essentially hardwired.  I'm somewhat of a supertaster, for example, and my eating habits reflect that; consequently, I'm not overweight.  It's hard to imagine the number of taste buds on my tongue not at least partially being a product of genetics

That's not to say you can't help your weight entirely, of course.  But most people don't try to do things completely out of sync with what their body tells them.

I think it has to do with fat parents passing on their unhealthy eating habits to their kids, who become fats themselves, rather than anything genetic.

That's probably not the case; parents seem to do very little to affect obesity after early childhood according to most studies which take genetics into account (Maes, Neale, & Eaves, 1997; Wardle, Carnell, Haworth, & Plomin, 2008); you'll find very little correlation between the weight of parents and their adopted children, for example.

The predisposition to same-sex attraction is probably at least in part genetic, along with some element of socialization, any activity that could affect hormone levels, etc.

But, to act upon those attractions is not genetic at all. People also have the ability to not engage in a sex act or to enter into a certain relationship. So if we take homosexuality to be an act rather than an attraction (the word 'homosexuality' may be ambiguous in this respect, though I haven't met many celibate people who experience same-sex attraction who call themselves homosexuals so I am taking it to imply that one has engaged in said acts and is not celibate), then it must be a choice as long as we accept that we have the ability to make choices, ie. free will. If we have no free will then this is all a moot point anyway, so I'd consider "lifestyle choice" to be a more representative reflection of my view than "genetic" but that I'd rather select "Both" if I could.

Breathing and eating should also be classified as "lifestyle choices" then.

What we eat is largely a lifestyle choice, as is how much we eat.  It isn't absolute free will, but it is close.

That's actually probably untrue.  Obesity has high heritability, somewhere around .80 (higher than height, even!).  A lot of that is likely due to different food preferences which might be essentially hardwired.  I'm somewhat of a supertaster, for example, and my eating habits reflect that; consequently, I'm not overweight.  It's hard to imagine the number of taste buds on my tongue not at least partially being a product of genetics

That's not to say you can't help your weight entirely, of course.  But most people don't try to do things completely out of sync with what their body tells them.

We still choose how much to eat.

I'm not saying we can't; I'm just saying that our choices are influenced (in the case of weight, quite strongly so) by our genes.

[Democratic Hawk]

Democrat: genetic

[Lulz]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

[angus]

This is not a very good poll. 

They never really are.  Just abstain, that's what I do.  In any case, it has already been pointed out that the dichotomy is false.  (nurturing, for example, or sociological factors beyond one's control were not among the choices.  And combination of factors wasn't a choice.)  But, false dichotomy or not, these polls generate lively and interesting discussion.  And occasionally, if you're lucky, some amusing flame wars.  Learn to enjoy such polls on their merits.

And welcome! 

[afleitch]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

[J. J.]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

Any blood relatives that are gay? 

[Lulz]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

That would be like going onto an internet forum and asking an alleged cancer patient whether their cancer was caused by genetics or environmental factors.  That is hardly a scientific exercise.

There are hundreds of disorders that have been definitvily found to have a genetic basis.  We can test for them and say with 100% certainty that a person has the disease or is a carrier.  There are far more things where we just don't know.  Homosexuality is one of them.

We can't say for sure ALL homosexual are compelled to behave the way they do based on genetics neither can we deny it.  It needs more research.  That is the reasonable answer.

[afleitch]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

Any blood relatives that are gay? 

Yes; 2.

[J. J.]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

Any blood relatives that are gay? 

Yes; 2.

Current or former generation?  Grew up in the same area or some distance away.

(You have me beat by one.)

Added:  One parent's side or both parents sides'.

[afleitch]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

Any blood relatives that are gay? 

Yes; 2.

Current or former generation?  Grew up in the same area or some distance away.

(You have me beat by one.)

Added:  One parent's side or both parents sides'.

One grew up in California The other grew up not far from me. And, same generation.

[J. J.]

Democrat, Lifestyle Choice

This is not a very good poll.  I chose lifestyle choice because I'm not comfortable with the whole gay thing, but truth be told there just isn't enough science to support either view.

Well I can help you with part of it. I'm gay; so if you consider it to be a 'lifestyle choice', ask me anything you want on it.

Any blood relatives that are gay? 

Yes; 2.

Current or former generation?  Grew up in the same area or some distance away.

(You have me beat by one.)

Added:  One parent's side or both parents sides'.

One grew up in California The other grew up not far from me. And, same generation.

On one in a prior generation?

[The Mikado]

Afleitch, is it true that there's pressure in the gay community to not be the "stereotypical" gay guy?  I've noticed that the gay people I know tend to be downright annoyed at effeminate "fairies" and say that they make the rest of the gay community look bad.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Anyone who claims homosexuality a choice doesn't have a brain. You can't control to what/whom you're attracted to.

Did I ever "choose" to be straight? I don't recall.

[Holmes]

Afleitch, is it true that there's pressure in the gay community to not be the "stereotypical" gay guy?

Yes, to an extent. See: internal Pride parade squabbles.

But it's true for a lot of groups, isn't it? The pressure not to be a certain way, otherwise it reflects poorly on that group.

[tpfkaw]

Not a choice, not entirely genetic.

[Lulz]

Anyone who claims homosexuality a choice doesn't have a brain. You can't control to what/whom you're attracted to.

Did I ever "choose" to be straight? I don't recall.

There are women walking around Africa with a plate in their lower lip.  They still manage to get laid.  Does that mean African men are genetically predisposed to dig chicks with plates in their lip?

This is why I say this poll makes no sense.  Everyone has an agenda.  Whether or not homosexuality is 100% choice or 100% genetic or something in between is a matter of scientific fact.  It is not an opinion.  And frankly the evidence is inconclusive at best.  If you know more than those of us with "no brain."  Please post the genetic sequence for this "gay" gene.

[Gustaf]

Afleitch, is it true that there's pressure in the gay community to not be the "stereotypical" gay guy?  I've noticed that the gay people I know tend to be downright annoyed at effeminate "fairies" and say that they make the rest of the gay community look bad.

What I heard is more that on the market, the effeminate gay men rank lower. But my source might be unreliable.

[LBJer]

Anyone who claims homosexuality a choice doesn't have a brain. You can't control to what/whom you're attracted to.

Did I ever "choose" to be straight? I don't recall.

Whether or not homosexuality is 100% choice or 100% genetic or something in between is a matter of scientific fact.  It is not an opinion.  And frankly the evidence is inconclusive at best.

This is only partially true.  I removed my vote for genetics because it's not clear being gay or straight is a matter of genetics.  But it IS clear that it's not a choice.  As others here have already said, for those who dispute this, when did you choose to be straight?

[afleitch]

Afleitch, is it true that there's pressure in the gay community to not be the "stereotypical" gay guy?  I've noticed that the gay people I know tend to be downright annoyed at effeminate "fairies" and say that they make the rest of the gay community look bad.

What I heard is more that on the market, the effeminate gay men rank lower. But my source might be unreliable.

There is the same diverse choice amongst gays as there is amongst striaghts as to what people find attractive. I don't think effeminate men 'rank lower'; there are those who find them their type And tastes change as you get older I find. I prefer geeky, less fussy, slightly 'laddish' men but that's just me

[ilikeverin]

Anyone who claims homosexuality a choice doesn't have a brain. You can't control to what/whom you're attracted to.

Did I ever "choose" to be straight? I don't recall.

There are women walking around Africa with a plate in their lower lip.  They still manage to get laid.  Does that mean African men are genetically predisposed to dig chicks with plates in their lip?

This is why I say this poll makes no sense.  Everyone has an agenda.  Whether or not homosexuality is 100% choice or 100% genetic or something in between is a matter of scientific fact.  It is not an opinion.  And frankly the evidence is inconclusive at best.  If you know more than those of us with "no brain."  Please post the genetic sequence for this "gay" gene.

Though I appreciate your desire for more data, no one will ever find "the genetic sequence for this 'gay' gene"; for one, there's probably many more than one gene which affects sexuality, and, for two, genes are inherently way more complicated than one gene -> one trait.