Dutch director killed by islamist fanatic!

[AuH2O]

In a democracy, you do not ban parties for having views you dislike, so long as they don't call for armed struggle.

Yes, it would be perfectly legitimate to kill judges that are oppressing the Flemish people. Actually, it is an insult to Western civilization that such people are allowed to live... it's possible the Flemish are acting immorally in failing to defend themselves.

In the meantime, the Frenchies will keep stealing from Flanders, giving the money to themselves, while starving the military (except for the shiny medals they stick on their prim French Generals).

And, yes, Vlaams Blok is mainstream. They are even pro-Zionist for crying out loud.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Do you remember how in Iran the 'elections' were rigged by banning all candidates who did not adhere to islamo-facism?

In much of western europe, elections are 'won' on a similiar basis by banning those who disagree with the idiotology of the 'politically correct.'

I believe it was earlier this year that Bridget Bardot was fined for daring to say something not in accord with political correctness.

In Denmark, the murderer of the leader of the Danish libertarian party was given a very lenient sentence because the judges felt that it was not really bad to kill someone who opposed political correctness.

In both the Netherlands and Germany, banning parties that do not adhere to political correctness is done, just as in Belgium.

The rulers of many western european countries are afraid of their own people and are slowly inflicting a totalitarian state there to hold onto power.

[Beet]

Not that European democracies have no faults, they do.

But comparing genuine democracies with the radical government in Iran is sick. You are doing a deep, deep injustice to all the Iranian people who suffer under the yoke of that government.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Facts are facts.

The Iranian council banned candidates who did not toe their line and in Belgium (and other counties cited), if you dare disagree with the prevailing line you get banned as well.

[AuH2O]

Iran is very similar to Germany, except the Iranian government cares more about its people.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

Iran is very similar to Germany, except the Iranian government cares more about its people.

Are you for real?

[Huckleberry Finn]

Facts are facts.

The Iranian council banned candidates who did not toe their line and in Belgium (and other counties cited), if you dare disagree with the prevailing line you get banned as well.

Yeah! We haven't democracy. In France one journalist got 10 years in jail only because he said in television that the war on Iraq was right.

In Sweden and Germany government can arrest any person who says that welfare state shoud be abolished.

Also there are secret concentration camps all around the Europe. We also have a lot of Weapons of Mass Destruction, but you can't find them.

I think that USA should  immediately occupy and liberate Europe. It's about time that America brings its values to the Old Continent.

[angus]

Facts are facts.

The Iranian council banned candidates who did not toe their line and in Belgium (and other counties cited), if you dare disagree with the prevailing line you get banned as well.

Yeah! We haven't democracy.

but you do!  that's the whole ing point.  Democracy is what leads to all this madness.  As alexander hamilton said, "your people, sir, are a beast."  The great unwashed masses ruling themselves is democracy, and democracy is exactly why these authoritarian laws exist.  appreciate the paradox, young man!

[Huckleberry Finn]

Do you remember how in Iran the 'elections' were rigged by banning all candidates who did not adhere to islamo-facism?

In much of western europe, elections are 'won' on a similiar basis by banning those who disagree with the idiotology of the 'politically correct.'

I believe it was earlier this year that Bridget Bardot was fined for daring to say something not in accord with political correctness.

In Denmark, the murderer of the leader of the Danish libertarian party was given a very lenient sentence because the judges felt that it was not really bad to kill someone who opposed political correctness.

In both the Netherlands and Germany, banning parties that do not adhere to political correctness is done, just as in Belgium.

The rulers of many western european countries are afraid of their own people and are slowly inflicting a totalitarian state there to hold onto power.

As I said above.

[Huckleberry Finn]

Facts are facts.

The Iranian council banned candidates who did not toe their line and in Belgium (and other counties cited), if you dare disagree with the prevailing line you get banned as well.

Yeah! We haven't democracy.

  appreciate the paradox, young man!

Hey, I'm not young.

[angus]

excuse me, sir. 

[CARLHAYDEN]

Facts are facts.

The Iranian council banned candidates who did not toe their line and in Belgium (and other counties cited), if you dare disagree with the prevailing line you get banned as well.

Yeah! We haven't democracy. In France one journalist got 10 years in jail only because he said in television that the war on Iraq was right.

In Sweden and Germany government can arrest any person who says that welfare state shoud be abolished.

Also there are secret concentration camps all around the Europe. We also have a lot of Weapons of Mass Destruction, but you can't find them.

I think that USA should  immediately occupy and liberate Europe. It's about time that America brings its values to the Old Continent.

HaHa.

I notice you avoided the specific examples I cited.

To use the French example, are you denying that Briget Bardot was fined for expressing poltically incorrect opinions?

Are you denying that parties in Belgium and Germany are banned if they don't toe the line on poltical correctness?

Are you denying that the scumbag who murdered the head of the Danish libertarian party got a very light sentence?

Old europe isn't worth liberating. 

Give them another generation of the current policies and they will sink into irrelvancy.

[AuH2O]

Patriots will overthrow their illegal governments in due time.

Already, Italy and Austria have governments in line with public opinion, and several others are in decent shape (Poland, of course Switzerland though giving women the right to vote in 1972 slowed their progress).

[Michael Z]

Wow. Now European governments are being compared to the fundamentalist regime in Iran due to a few minor superficial similarities. Could the Europe-haters possibly sink any lower?

Though if you want to play Devil's Advocate, may I suggest that American conservatives have far more in common with Islamic fundamentalists in that they both wish to see Europe wiped off the face of the earth? At the very least they are united by a seething hatred of this continent, if some of the comments here are anything to go by.

[AuH2O]

Sorry, we haven't banned any political parties recently or thrown someone in jail for life for slightly questioning the government.

Europe and Canada are more than making up for it, though.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Wow. Now European governments are being compared to the fundamentalist regime in Iran due to a few minor superficial similarities. Could the Europe-haters possibly sink any lower?

Though if you want to play Devil's Advocate, may I suggest that American conservatives have far more in common with Islamic fundamentalists in that they both wish to see Europe wiped off the face of the earth? At the very least they are united by a seething hatred of this continent, if some of the comments here are anything to go by.

Once again we have another example of statements made of the sinking europeans which are NOT founded in reality.

I never said I wanted to see europe wiped off the face of the earth.  I merely stated that if certain european countries continue pursuing their current policies they will become irrelevant.

But, since you bring it up.  In the United States we have a great deal of tolerance, including religious freedom.  Has the government of Germany stopped persecuting the Scientologists yet?

[Jens]

Are you denying that the scumbag who murdered the head of the Danish libertarian party got a very light sentence?

What on Earth are you talking about! No Danish politician has even been murdered. There has been two attempted assault on Danish politicians since 1849, one in 1885 and one in 1930 and only the one in 1885 was even remotely close to causing damage.

[Michael Z]

Wow. Now European governments are being compared to the fundamentalist regime in Iran due to a few minor superficial similarities. Could the Europe-haters possibly sink any lower?

Though if you want to play Devil's Advocate, may I suggest that American conservatives have far more in common with Islamic fundamentalists in that they both wish to see Europe wiped off the face of the earth? At the very least they are united by a seething hatred of this continent, if some of the comments here are anything to go by.

Once again we have another example of statements made of the sinking europeans which are NOT founded in reality.

Your vitriol is pretty apparent from your posts, otherwise you wouldn't see the need to display that kind of hostility in front of all and sundry.

Or let me put it this way; you state that Europe will sink into irrelevancy. Not as a warning, or allied with some constructive suggestion of how it could improve (which might actually result in you facing less rancour), but simply in the vain hope that merely by stating such a thing it will become a self-fulfilling prophecy. I believe it was at that point where I QED'd and arrived at the conclusion below...

You must be logged in to read this quote.

I never directly aimed my comment at you, though I admit the statement was an extreme one.

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Well, you'd think a few million deaths would make people over there somewhat jumpy towards pseudo-fascist groupings. But then this completely and utter unwillingness to understand the trauma WW2 embedded on that culture is symptomatic of little more than ignorance. 

Oh, and of course religious freedom is principally desirable, but then "persecuting" is hardly the word here. The government in Germany refused to give religion status to Scientology. Big deal. By using such an emotive term you make it sound as if people are being hounded and herded into cells just for having that specific belief; which also makes your accusation of melodramatics above seem like a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

Besides, just to rebuke your initial point further, governmental intolerance of certain groupings alone does not automatically result in a culture's downfall. Look at China.

At any rate, I refuse to be drawn into these immature "my country is better than yours!"-playground arguments you seem to enjoy indulging in. You can rant and rave to your heart's content, the USA and Europe still have far more in common than people like yourself would like to have us believe.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Well, your posting was long on opinion and short on facts.

I notice you did not answer my question about the persecution of the Scientolgists in Germany.

Also, if you had bothered to read the series of posts I have made on this topic you would see that I noted that the europeans are sliding into irrelevancy BECAUSE of the policies they are pursuing.

It they were to change their policies to thoughtful and ethical ones, then they could well avoid the irrelevancy.  This was clearly implied in my series of posts.

Sorry you could not understand it.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Mea culpa!

Actually, the party leader murdered was Pim Fortuyn of the Netherlands  on May 6, 2002.

His murderer is eligible for parole in 2014.

In 1968, Sirhan Sirhan murdered Robert F. Kennedy.  He's still in prison, and would have been executed except for the intervention of liberals in the judiciary.

[Michael Z]

Well, your posting was long on opinion and short on facts.

Then you didn't read it properly. Read again and rebuke each point I made one by one. Then we'll talk.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Please cite what you call a FACT in your post.

I notice that you keep avoiding answering my specific examples.

Oh, and by the way, a long winded diatribe is NOT a fact.

[Michael Z]

Oh, and by the way, a long winded diatribe is NOT a fact.

Another case of the pot calling the kettle black.

I notice that you've decided not to answer my specific examples as well.

State one FACT where Scientologists are "persecuted" against.

And while we are there, perhaps you could name one FACT which states Europe will delve into irrelevancy, as opposed to your personal interpretation.

[CARLHAYDEN]

Hereis one quick link:

http://www.journalism.sfsu.edu/www/pubs/gater/spring97/feb06/OPINIONB.html

[CARLHAYDEN]

Oh, and by the way, a long winded diatribe is NOT a fact.

Another case of the pot calling the kettle black.

I notice that you've decided not to answer my specific examples as well.

State one FACT where Scientologists are "persecuted" against.

And while we are there, perhaps you could name one FACT which states Europe will delve into irrelevancy, as opposed to your personal interpretation.

Another citation I made was the fineing of BB for making politically incorrect remarks

A link is:

http://www.animalrights.net/archives/year/2000/000036.html