Animal Protection Act [LAW'D]

[Purple State]

We seem to have found an issue that the left and regionalists in this game both believe in, though for entirely different reasons. Intriguing.

[tmthforu94]

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Heavens no, I love meat! I just don't like the torture of animals. It makes me think "That could have been my dog" everytime I see neglect and torture take place.

Fascinating logic...

My dog was rescused from the streets, if that makes more sense...

[bgwah]

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Heavens no, I love meat! I just don't like the torture of animals. It makes me think "That could have been my dog" everytime I see neglect and torture take place.

Fascinating logic...

My dog was rescused from the streets, if that makes more sense...

And you have no problem killing animals as smart as your dog for your own personal pleasure... Interesting...

[tmthforu94]

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Heavens no, I love meat! I just don't like the torture of animals. It makes me think "That could have been my dog" everytime I see neglect and torture take place.

Fascinating logic...

My dog was rescused from the streets, if that makes more sense...

And you have no problem killing animals as smart as your dog for your own personal pleasure... Interesting...

I never said my dog was smart.
This bill aims to prevent people from killing animals for pure enjoyment, but only for food.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

[Хahar 🤔]

And forgive me while I ROTFLOL about your allegations of "enviro-facism". That's almost as good as "Cultural Marxism".

I don't know how you can take yourself seriously, let alone how anyone else would be able to.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

And forgive me while I ROTFLOL about your allegations of "enviro-facism". That's almost as good as "Cultural Marxism".

I don't know how you can take yourself seriously, let alone how anyone else would be able to.

I feel I do a public service Xahar, I keep people like you in business. You would think you'd be sayin "Thank You"

[Bacon King]

Senators in favor: Tmthforu94, Bacon King, Fritz, Badger
Senators opposed: Winston, Hans, NCYankee, Duke
Senators abstaining: bgwah
Senators yet to vote: Mint

[bgwah]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism. Carbon taxes, Cap-n-trade, and draconing restrictions that make certain economic activities impossible even if they could benefit the local environment or the environment in general. Such has holding up the building of a Hydro-plant for a fish or relatively safe offshore drilling of Natural Gas and oil but especially the Natural Gas from which the revenues and taxes can be put into conservation efforts. Forcing people to buy or preventing them from buying certain things to reduce the amount of carbon in the atmosphere by like .0001%.

This is not to be confused with reasonable efforst to conserve resources, protect wildlife (that are trully in danger), and moves towards greater efficiency. Its up to the individual to judge the differences. The best way to improve efficiency and reduce emissions and waste is technological advancement not policies that sacrifice much for little gain.

[Badger]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism. Carbon taxes, Cap-n-trade, and draconing restrictions that make certain economic activities impossible even if they could benefit the local environment or the environment in general. Such has holding up the building of a Hydro-plant for a fish or relatively safe offshore drilling of Natural Gas and oil but especially the Natural Gas from which the revenues and taxes can be put into conservation efforts. Forcing people to buy or preventing them from buying certain things to reduce the amount of carbon in the atmosphere by like .0001%.

This is not to be confused with reasonable efforst to conserve resources, protect wildlife (that are trully in danger), and moves towards greater efficiency. Its up to the individual to judge the differences. The best way to improve efficiency and reduce emissions and waste is technological advancement not policies that sacrifice much for little gain.

With respect, Yank, I don't begin to see how this particular bill can be remotely compared to "enviro-facism" as you define it.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism. Carbon taxes, Cap-n-trade, and draconing restrictions that make certain economic activities impossible even if they could benefit the local environment or the environment in general. Such has holding up the building of a Hydro-plant for a fish or relatively safe offshore drilling of Natural Gas and oil but especially the Natural Gas from which the revenues and taxes can be put into conservation efforts. Forcing people to buy or preventing them from buying certain things to reduce the amount of carbon in the atmosphere by like .0001%.

This is not to be confused with reasonable efforst to conserve resources, protect wildlife (that are trully in danger), and moves towards greater efficiency. Its up to the individual to judge the differences. The best way to improve efficiency and reduce emissions and waste is technological advancement not policies that sacrifice much for little gain.

With respect, Yank, I don't begin to see how this particular bill can be remotely compared to "enviro-facism" as you define it.

I never said that it was. I was making a dig at Tmth.

[tmthforu94]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism. Carbon taxes, Cap-n-trade, and draconing restrictions that make certain economic activities impossible even if they could benefit the local environment or the environment in general. Such has holding up the building of a Hydro-plant for a fish or relatively safe offshore drilling of Natural Gas and oil but especially the Natural Gas from which the revenues and taxes can be put into conservation efforts. Forcing people to buy or preventing them from buying certain things to reduce the amount of carbon in the atmosphere by like .0001%.

This is not to be confused with reasonable efforst to conserve resources, protect wildlife (that are trully in danger), and moves towards greater efficiency. Its up to the individual to judge the differences. The best way to improve efficiency and reduce emissions and waste is technological advancement not policies that sacrifice much for little gain.

With respect, Yank, I don't begin to see how this particular bill can be remotely compared to "enviro-facism" as you define it.

I never said that it was. I was making a dig at Tmth.

Game over, you failed.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism. Carbon taxes, Cap-n-trade, and draconing restrictions that make certain economic activities impossible even if they could benefit the local environment or the environment in general. Such has holding up the building of a Hydro-plant for a fish or relatively safe offshore drilling of Natural Gas and oil but especially the Natural Gas from which the revenues and taxes can be put into conservation efforts. Forcing people to buy or preventing them from buying certain things to reduce the amount of carbon in the atmosphere by like .0001%.

This is not to be confused with reasonable efforst to conserve resources, protect wildlife (that are trully in danger), and moves towards greater efficiency. Its up to the individual to judge the differences. The best way to improve efficiency and reduce emissions and waste is technological advancement not policies that sacrifice much for little gain.

With respect, Yank, I don't begin to see how this particular bill can be remotely compared to "enviro-facism" as you define it.

I never said that it was. I was making a dig at Tmth.

Game over, you failed.

Damn, I thought I would atleast reach level 15.

[bgwah]

Well I always thought the Schools were purposely indoctrinating the kiddies to love furry creatures a little more then they otherwise would or should (to further the enviro-facist adjenda). I must say, I find it this whole thing lolish for that reason, forgive me while I ROTFLOL.

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism. Carbon taxes, Cap-n-trade, and draconing restrictions that make certain economic activities impossible even if they could benefit the local environment or the environment in general. Such has holding up the building of a Hydro-plant for a fish or relatively safe offshore drilling of Natural Gas and oil but especially the Natural Gas from which the revenues and taxes can be put into conservation efforts. Forcing people to buy or preventing them from buying certain things to reduce the amount of carbon in the atmosphere by like .0001%.

This is not to be confused with reasonable efforst to conserve resources, protect wildlife (that are trully in danger), and moves towards greater efficiency. Its up to the individual to judge the differences. The best way to improve efficiency and reduce emissions and waste is technological advancement not policies that sacrifice much for little gain.

So you think cap-n-trade and carbon taxes are... fascist?

... lol

[Ban my account ffs!]

It's funny how cap and trade are leading us towards fascism and socialism... yet when you look at WWII Germany and Italy and communist Russia.. you'll find they had little regard for the natural environment.  In fact, the Soviet Union did wonders for pollution.  As has communist China.

Cap and trade is, by its very definition, not socialist or fascist.  It is a regulation set forth by a democratically elected government that prods the market into reducing emissions where they can be reduced efficiently while allowing trades so that industries that can't efficiently reduce emissions can buy credits and keep polluting.

Sure, it's not laissez faire free enterprise, but it works just fine within a capitalist system, and actually has its roots in free democratic action and concern for the environment.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

It's funny how cap and trade are leading us towards fascism and socialism... yet when you look at WWII Germany and Italy and communist Russia.. you'll find they had little regard for the natural environment.  In fact, the Soviet Union did wonders for pollution.  As has communist China.

Cap and trade is, by its very definition, not socialist or fascist.  It is a regulation set forth by a democratically elected government that prods the market into reducing emissions where they can be reduced efficiently while allowing trades so that industries that can't efficiently reduce emissions can buy credits and keep polluting.

Sure, it's not laissez faire free enterprise, but it works just fine within a capitalist system, and actually has its roots in free democratic action and concern for the environment.

The policy of Cap-n-trade is not fascist, the reasoning of the people pushing it is. Silencing opposition, manipulating data, and attempting to indoctrinate people into beleiving a certain way (Global Warming is being taught the AL Gore way to children as young as Elemenary school). What do you call that? You have questioned certain aspects of Global Warming yourself, Snowguy, surely you can understand what I am talking about. The need or desire for Cap-and Trade, is based off, pseudo-fascistic science that violates every rule of the scientific method except maybe the observation and hypothesis parts. However it seems most of these people stop here and then message the data to support their hypothesis. I have a hard time not seeing alterior motives in this, such as wealth redistribution/economic stagnation advocated by many on the fringe left. What else would be the purpose in staging such elaborate lies and falsehoods. Both of that is just theory on my part, what is undeniable fact is that Cap-n-Trade is in fact a Trading scheme that was heavilly backed by Enron back in the day and Goldman Sachs. And its clear Enron's and other's goal, and in my opinion some of the environmentatlists pushing that solution, would be in a position or would quickly move to a position that would allow them to significantly benefit themselves financially.

So we got pseudo science, a history of socialism or far left sympathy among many of the environmenatlists pushing this, and a solution that is a trading scheme that would allow people who are pushing it to enrich themselves of the general inflation of the economy, further squeezing of the middle class, and yet more pain for poorest people. Why I am off base in drawing this together and maintaining a healthy does of skepticism. Why is un-science accepted as undeniable facts, why should I trust a bunch of aged hippie socialists who have added a Ph.D and cut their hair, and a bunch of financial scam artists to form the energy policy (and basically economically policy) of the whole nation?

I am sorry, if I don't put blind faith in these people, I don't put the amount of trust in my parents that some of you put in these very unethical and questionable people.

[bgwah]

pseudo-fascistic science

Just stop. Please.

[Purple State]

pseudo-fascistic science

Just stop. Please.

You don't enjoy the quasi-coherent neo-prefix verbosity?

[Хahar 🤔]

What is an enviro-fascist?

Extreme Environmentalism to the point of wanting to destroy and as Obama's technology Tsar said "de-industrialize" America, which in my opinion is just a stalking horse for socialism.

wtf

[Badger]

It appears that the primary concern against this bill is a sense that this is somehow an issue that regional governments should address rather than the federal government preempting law entirely. Regardless of any federal vs. regional debate, I'm willing to concede the issue for this bill and offer the following amendment to make this a bill that will spur and encourage legislative activity at the regional level rather than inhibit it.

I realize a vote on the final bill has already started, but considering no senator but Bgwah even bothered to express their concerns about the bill before voting started, I sincerely hope that if this amendment is acceptable to the Senate then we can waive objections and merely vote on the amendment and final bill on a simple up or down vote. Considering the pre-vote silence from those with concerns over the bill which, if timely raised, could have led to a pre-vote amendment addressing those concerns, waiving such procedural objections is hardly much to ask.

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Accepted as friendly, Isaac?

[tmthforu94]

It appears that the primary concern against this bill is a sense that this is somehow an issue that regional governments should address rather than the federal government preempting law entirely. Regardless of any federal vs. regional debate, I'm willing to concede the issue for this bill and offer the following amendment to make this a bill that will spur and encourage legislative activity at the regional level rather than inhibit it.

I realize a vote on the final bill has already started, but considering no senator but Bgwah even bothered to express their concerns about the bill before voting started, I sincerely hope that if this amendment is acceptable to the Senate then we can waive objections and merely vote on the amendment and final bill on a simple up or down vote. Considering the pre-vote silence from those with concerns over the bill which, if timely raised, could have led to a pre-vote amendment addressing those concerns, waiving such procedural objections is hardly much to ask.

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Accepted as friendly, Isaac?

Accepted as friendly. I just sincerely hope the regions can act quickly on this, if it passes. Although, it'd be nice to push up the deadline on this from September. How about July? That would give them an entire 2 months, at least. It shouldn't take any region 4 months to pass a bill.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Finally back on topic.

I will review the changes later, I have to get offline.

[Badger]

It appears that the primary concern against this bill is a sense that this is somehow an issue that regional governments should address rather than the federal government preempting law entirely. Regardless of any federal vs. regional debate, I'm willing to concede the issue for this bill and offer the following amendment to make this a bill that will spur and encourage legislative activity at the regional level rather than inhibit it.

I realize a vote on the final bill has already started, but considering no senator but Bgwah even bothered to express their concerns about the bill before voting started, I sincerely hope that if this amendment is acceptable to the Senate then we can waive objections and merely vote on the amendment and final bill on a simple up or down vote. Considering the pre-vote silence from those with concerns over the bill which, if timely raised, could have led to a pre-vote amendment addressing those concerns, waiving such procedural objections is hardly much to ask.

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Accepted as friendly, Isaac?

Accepted as friendly. I just sincerely hope the regions can act quickly on this, if it passes. Although, it'd be nice to push up the deadline on this from September. How about July? That would give them an entire 2 months, at least. It shouldn't take any region 4 months to pass a bill.

2 or 4 months is fine with me either way. Maybe split the difference at 3 just in case? I'm fine anyway as long as at least 6 senators agree on it.

Feel free to amend the amendment I proposed. As you're the official sponser, any amendment you make is automatically incorportated as friendly.

[Bacon King]

Whoah now, hold on here. There's absolutely no way we can go back to debate guys. I'm sorry. If you like that bill enough the only procedural way we can amend this now is by passing the current bill, having afleitch veto-amend the bill to be like so, and for us to then accept his alterations.