Public Discussion on the Supreme Court Cases (Avoid Cluttering Case Threads)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Copying this into here:

As we have three separate cases being filed about the result of the run-off, I would request that the Supreme Court treats each as parts of a single case - rather than having three separate cases regarding the election.

I support this action. Also, for FWIW, my position on each contested vote:

Xahar - Invalid (VP choice not clearly interpretable)
Bmotley/Cassius - Invalid (Missed 3 reg. elections)
BRTD/Hashemite - Invalid (Even though they voted for Blair, their criticism of the VP choice could have persuaded others to vote for Yankee)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Xahar - Invalid (VP choice not clearly interpretable)

This is, uh, self-evidently moronic.

google translates it as "arcanpoilyan", not "kingpoleon"

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

So when are we actually getting a ruling in TimTurner v. Peebs?

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I must confess that I don't exactly understand why both the plaintiffs on these two cases are putting so much emphasis on asking for injunctions? There isn't really anything to injunct against - the law in question does not change anything about the voting booth or voting conditions. If it were a law to say, reduce the hours of the voting booth, then the injunction would be warranted in order to force the election admin to have a booth open during the whole initial timeframe.

In this case, the only thing affected by the law in question is the certification - which the courts can  vacate and order for recertification in accordance with the new ruling (this is what's happened every time the Supreme Court has overruled an election official!) There is nothing about certification that requires an injunction ahead of time. All the plaintiffs are doing is forcing the court to rush and, in the process, increasing the burden that's been placed on them.

The injunctions are because the law does impose further requirements on the validity to vote. Without an injunction, voters who are newly invalidated by the law (not all of which are Federalists or YT supporters) would be unlikely to vote because they would see little point due to the risk of invalidation. Therefore, even if the Court eventually struck the law down, there would still be voter disenfranchisement because there would be people who would not have voted or attempted to vote solely because they believed they would be invalidated, and therefore the result of the election would still be changed by the law's temporary existence.  If an injunction is issued, those voters will have more reason to believe their vote will be counted, and thus the risk of this unconstitutional law indirectly impacting the election is mitigated to the greatest extent possible.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

You can't have a constitution saying one thing and a bill that says another. The bill should have been an amendment to the Lincoln constitution if it wants any sort of merit.

Tbf, it's clear why the legislation wasn't passed that way - Amendments require a larger majority, which was not achievable with both me and IBNU opposed (I would have voted No if my vote was decisive).

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I kindly ask the justices to immediately intervene, right now, with the decision regarding the injunction and the certiorari request with respect to Ninja0428 vs Region of Lincoln. Both sides have had adequate ability to make their points on this narrow portion of the case. Further argument can be made in formal briefs once, as I hope, certiorari has been granted.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Parts of the decision made are absolutely ridiculous and the case honestly should not have been taken. The court, here, has made the mockery of the legislature's rulemaking power and taken the first step to absolute control over the legislature by the judiciary.

Part VI of the decision blatantly attempts to take away the legislature's ability to alter, amend, or nullify their own rules by simple majority vote, a blatant overreach which essentially strips the legislature of any power or meaning; the region might as well be a judicial dictatorship after that point.

I urge the Council to repeal Section 7.C of its rules immediately. Not doing so would be an admission that there is no longer even a facsimile of democracy in the region and would invite a constitutional crisis of the highest order.

The trouble with repealing Section 7.C is it would leave no recourse for any challenge to the rules and provide no means of enforcing the rules if the Speaker does not follow the rules themselves. Even if a point of order were to be raised, the rules make no reference to points of order so the Speaker could not really be compelled to recognize such points of order. If the rules are just unenforceable suggestions or best practices, there's really no point to them in the first place.

I'm also hesitant given similar procedures are in the Southern Rules, The Fremont Rules, and at least the Federal House Rules if not the Federal Senate Rules as well.

However, the Rules do sort of need an overhaul anyways, and I'm open to some sort of replacement for Section 7.C that doesn't make the Speaker some dictator with unlimited power, which has never been the Atlas intention for that role.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Is there any evidence that the information was posted against the person's will, as the law says?

LT, or for that matter any Federalist, should not have even been accessing the spreadsheet in question.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I would urge the Court to hold Louisville in Contempt of Court for his excessive wasting of the court's valuable time. This could be taken into consideration at sentencing as an aggravating factor if found guilty.  

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

If the responsability of saving Lincoln from communism has fallen to Wulfric, I think the proletarian revolution is very likely to suceed

Well as it turns out I have successfully negotiated to return Lincoln to democratic government and still achieve Speaker RC

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

LT is a free man unless a change is made to the Court

With all due respect to Mr. Dragon: the removal of the Chief Justice would not alter the Court's consensus in this matter.

To be clear I'm referring to the removal and replacement with someone who votes in favor of taking the case. Not asking you to reveal exact counts, but if you meant it would be 2-2 and still denied - I am more than capable of realizing that and so was assuming the full removal and replacement.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

All right. I still believe Windjammer must face some form of Sanction for issuing threats toward elected officials from the bench; I find it hard to believe he will be impartial going forward. But I do appreciate that at least some level of Fairness existed here.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I would understand by what Authority, (I mean lawfull) I am brought hither. There are many unlawfull Authorities in the world, as Thieves and Plunderers in the high-wayes. I would know by what Authority I was taken from thence, and carried from place to place, I know not where? When I have understood the lawfulness of the Authority, I will make my Answer: In the mean time, re∣member that I represent your Government, your lawfull Government; and weigh well with your selves, what sins you heap on your own heads, and the anger and judgments of God which you will bring upon this land, I say seriously, weigh it before you further do proceed from one sin to a greater. Therefore declare unto me, by what lawfull Authority I sit here, and I will not refuse to Answer you. In the mean time I will not betray my trust. I have a trust committed to me by God, by an ancient and lawfull succession, I will not betray that by answering to a new and an unlawfull Authority; wherefore satisfie me in this, and you shall hear further from me.

If you had but pleased to observe what the Court did suggest unto you, when you first came hither, you had under∣stood by what Authority you were brought hither; which Au∣thority doth require of you, in the Name of the People of Atlasia, by whom you are elected Attorney General, that you make answer to them.

Atlasia was never an Elective Commonwealthe, but collectivist, for almost, these two decades. Therefore declare unto me, by what Authority I am brought hither. I labour more for the liberty of my people then any of you, who pretend to be my Judges; and therefore I say, declare unto me, by what lawfull Authority I am placed here, and I will answer you; otherwise, I shall make no answer at all.

You are brought hither by the authority of thou Supreme Court of Atlasia, which is authorized under thou constitution that thou have sworn to uphold.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I would understand by what Authority, (I mean lawfull) I am brought hither. There are many unlawfull Authorities in the world, as Thieves and Plunderers in the high-wayes. I would know by what Authority I was taken from thence, and carried from place to place, I know not where? When I have understood the lawfulness of the Authority, I will make my Answer: In the mean time, re∣member that I represent your Government, your lawfull Government; and weigh well with your selves, what sins you heap on your own heads, and the anger and judgments of God which you will bring upon this land, I say seriously, weigh it before you further do proceed from one sin to a greater. Therefore declare unto me, by what lawfull Authority I sit here, and I will not refuse to Answer you. In the mean time I will not betray my trust. I have a trust committed to me by God, by an ancient and lawfull succession, I will not betray that by answering to a new and an unlawfull Authority; wherefore satisfie me in this, and you shall hear further from me.

If you had but pleased to observe what the Court did suggest unto you, when you first came hither, you had under∣stood by what Authority you were brought hither; which Au∣thority doth require of you, in the Name of the People of Atlasia, by whom you are elected Attorney General, that you make answer to them.

Atlasia was never an Elective Commonwealthe, but collectivist, for almost, these two decades. Therefore declare unto me, by what Authority I am brought hither. I labour more for the liberty of my people then any of you, who pretend to be my Judges; and therefore I say, declare unto me, by what lawfull Authority I am placed here, and I will answer you; otherwise, I shall make no answer at all.

You are Thou art brought hither by the aAuthority of thou y^e Supreme Court of Atlasia, which is authorized under thou y^e constitution that thou have hast sworn to uphold.

Thankfully, illiterates cannot be lawyers. Even in fantasyland!

Ye Supreme Court of Atlasia hast recongized me before, and even ruled in my favor. Thou shalt be impeached before long regardless.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I would understand by what Authority, (I mean lawfull) I am brought hither. There are many unlawfull Authorities in the world, as Thieves and Plunderers in the high-wayes. I would know by what Authority I was taken from thence, and carried from place to place, I know not where? When I have understood the lawfulness of the Authority, I will make my Answer: In the mean time, re∣member that I represent your Government, your lawfull Government; and weigh well with your selves, what sins you heap on your own heads, and the anger and judgments of God which you will bring upon this land, I say seriously, weigh it before you further do proceed from one sin to a greater. Therefore declare unto me, by what lawfull Authority I sit here, and I will not refuse to Answer you. In the mean time I will not betray my trust. I have a trust committed to me by God, by an ancient and lawfull succession, I will not betray that by answering to a new and an unlawfull Authority; wherefore satisfie me in this, and you shall hear further from me.

If you had but pleased to observe what the Court did suggest unto you, when you first came hither, you had under∣stood by what Authority you were brought hither; which Au∣thority doth require of you, in the Name of the People of Atlasia, by whom you are elected Attorney General, that you make answer to them.

Atlasia was never an Elective Commonwealthe, but collectivist, for almost, these two decades. Therefore declare unto me, by what Authority I am brought hither. I labour more for the liberty of my people then any of you, who pretend to be my Judges; and therefore I say, declare unto me, by what lawfull Authority I am placed here, and I will answer you; otherwise, I shall make no answer at all.

You are Thou art brought hither by the aAuthority of thou y^e Supreme Court of Atlasia, which is authorized under thou y^e constitution that thou have hast sworn to uphold.

Thankfully, illiterates cannot be lawyers. Even in fantasyland!

Ye Supreme Court of Atlasia hast recongized me before, and even ruled in my favor. Thou shalt be impeached before long regardless.

As I recall, y^e court recognized thee for the purpose of declaring thee mentally unfit to serve on a jury! I trust thy weak mental faculties are again represented in thy forecast of y^e criminal travesty of y^e so-called "trial."

Since that time, y^e Supreme Court hast ruled in my favor on at least two separate occasions (legality of my actions during my short-lived PUP chairmanship and the Lincoln Abortion Ban)

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Supreme Court of Atlasia

Nyman, DC

Dwarven Dragon vs the South

Opinion of the Court.

(Chief Justice Windjammer delivered the opinion of the Court)
After consideration of the submitted briefs and the facts of the case, the Court has come to a unanimous decision.
It’s the opinion of the Supreme Court "Promoting Holy Courts Act" relies explicitly on religious references (for example, « pursuant to leviticus ») and can not be implemented without it. Thus, it is a clear violation of the following clause of the Atlasian Constitution :

The Senate shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, nor obstructing the freedom of worship.

By passing legislations relying on the Bible’s scriptures, « Promoting the Holy Courts Act » de facto establishes Christianity as the religion of the South. For that reason, « Promoting the Holy Courts Act » shall be struck down in its entirety.
The Supreme Court would like to thank Wulfric and Blackraisin for their full cooperation.

LOL, what a joke. Would make more sense to argue that it established Judaism based solely on the scripture referenced in that bill.

Re-pass it with all the scriptural references moved to a non-binding findings section at the beginning and there you go. I would not challenge again in that case. As I outlined in the case and as even your region's appointee appears to agree, the way you did it in the overturned legislation at best created confusion as to whether one should refer to scripture or to other existing law (which would create establishment of religion if scripture was chosen at any point), and at worst (more likely) mandated the use of scripture to radically change the rule of law.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

BUMP.

Strongly disappointed in the Chief Justice's decision to not grant certorari in the twitter case. This basically means that the GM team can have "characters" do whatever they want to damage players, even actions contradicting in-game law, and face zero repercussions. I urge the Cao administration to explore the possibility of rescinding the twitter bans via executive order or explicit legislation.

This is the latest in a line of several actions from Windjammer with which I have disagreed, and I would emphasize that if we had retention elections in Atlasia, I would not vote to retain him.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Spectacular legislative prowess to pass an ultimately pretty meaningless ”reform” and somehow completely ignore the consequences of said bill! Hopefully the Supreme Court doesn’t take their usual leisurely pace with deliberations otherwise the next senate may never be seated! Given it’s taken the NPC case more than 2 months to select a jury, an interregnum till fresh elections may be on the cards.

All other elected seats aren't being contested in court. The most appropriate course of action would be to seat all other elected Senators while declaring the disputed seat vacant, possibly with a special election.

The entire at-large certification is suspended until the court case is resolved. The subregionally elected senators will take their seats as scheduled. All at-large seats, as of May 5, will be vacant by court order until the case is resolved. I suspect our Labor-Majority court will not want that to be the reality for long, considering the composition of the temporary 9 member senate will be 5 Peace 2 DA 1 Fed 1 SNP.

Was there ever zero registered voters in the United Kingdom? I am seeing now that Griff and Thumb moved out, but I dunno if there were any others.

No. Pink Panther is *still* registered there, though I guess his vote isn't being challenged because the existing counts are sufficient to decide this issue and correct the error in outcome.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I absolutely abhor about 95% of what Young Texan says these days, but this is the 5%. I completely concur with all his comments regarding Fairbol and his brief.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

FairBol, how have you spent all this time on a politics forum and involved in politics IRL and not understand what a lame duck session is?

I'm not even trying to attack you or anything, I'm just genuinely confused how you don't understand this.

This, and even if the 10 days came right at session switch (I know we don't formally do the 5 minute adjourn sine die and reconvene ritual like IRL, but maybe you could apply the general principle that the sessions are separate), you could argue that our Senate is a continuing body because we don't elect all of them at the same time and don't auto table everything at session switch.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

FairBol, how have you spent all this time on a politics forum and involved in politics IRL and not understand what a lame duck session is?

I'm not even trying to attack you or anything, I'm just genuinely confused how you don't understand this.

With a few regional exceptions, the new term/session has always commenced at noon on the first Friday of the month following the election.

Fairbol could make a case if we were talking Lincoln, because as a result of a Philly Plan relic I felt actually worked ok, we still vote everything up or down and adjourn sine die at the election, reconvening the following Wednesday. But the South, iirc, still has a short lame duck session even though they rarely use it. I make it a point to never follow Fremont.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

I have advised Laki, who was the author of the bill, to draft a brief.

[Attorney General, LGC Speaker, and Former PPT Dwarven Dragon]

Alright, what the dickens is going on?

Basically, we no longer have a Supreme Court. Not sure I'm authorized to reveal exactly why.