HOW TO GET TO HEAVEN WHEN YOU DIE

[Joe Republic]

This is my thread.  You are free to leave it, but I'm not gonna leave until the last person on earth has accepted Jesus.  You aren't forced to click on this and I only post here so...

Take it from me, friend.  We already know who Jesus supposedly was, and what Christianity is all about, mainly because we are mostly intelligent adults.  It's perhaps for that reason that the overwhelming majority of people who have participated in this thread and poll (including the person who voted for Option 1 as a joke, I would expect) are not interested in being evangelized.  Even our resident fundamentalist has come to accept this, even if he still uses Bible quotes to somehow support his arguments.

So, given that you are completely wasting your time with us, perhaps there are other things you could spend your time doing?

[Joe Republic]

Plus, your choice of username is highly amusing.  I expect the irony of your interest in the mythology created by J.R.R. Tolkien running parallel with your probable belief in the literal interpretation of the Bible is entirely lost on you.

Unless you're just trollin' us, that is.

[John Dibble]

This is my thread.

No, it's mine now. I stole it fair and square and you can never have it back - MWAHAHAHA!

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You're going to be here forever then. But that's fine, you're welcome in my thread, but only if you can answer me these questions three!

1. WHAT is your name?
2. WHAT is your quest?
3. WHAT is the air speed velocity of an unladen swallow?

[xfrodobagginsx]

Please take the time to read this first post and pray that prayer at the bottom of it to God from your heart.

[Lief 🗽]

Someone needs to get nkpatel, pbrowser and this dude into a conversation. It would be terrific.

[Bo]

No offense, but I don't believe in a lot of things that are written here.

[John Dibble]

Please take the time to read this first post and pray that prayer at the bottom of it to God from your heart.

Alternatively, you can try this one which is equally effective:

"Oh Great and Mighty Thor, I beseech you! Please use your magic hammer to save us all from the frost giants, for they seek to do bad things to us because they are bad. Also, if it wouldn't be too much trouble, smite my enemies for they have most likely been naughty in thine eyes. Oh, and lest I forget, I humbly ask that you put in a good word with Odin so that I may go to Valhalla when I die, where we'll get totally drunk on mead and then we'll pick up some Valkyrie bitches. We both know that would totally rock."

[Bo]

This is all a bunch of baloney.

[xfrodobagginsx]

So you say.  God is real.  Your very existence is a miracle.  It's not even possible for you to exist according to scientific law, yet here you are.  God created you.

[John Dibble]

It's not even possible for you to exist according to scientific law, yet here you are.

Uh, no, there is no scientific law that says it's not even possible for us to exist.

[xfrodobagginsx]

Yes, there is.  According to the laws of conservation of energy and thermodynamics matter and energy cannot be created nor destroyed, yet matter exists and energy exists, therefore it is impossible for us to exist, yet here we are because GOD created the matter and energy.  He has power over scientific law.

[John Dibble]

Yes, there is.  According to the laws of conservation of energy and thermodynamics matter and energy cannot be created nor destroyed, yet matter exists and energy exists, therefore it is impossible for us to exist, yet here we are because GOD created the matter and energy.  He has power over scientific law.

Once again you have failed in a most epic manner to understand basic logical principles.

You are applying the God of the gaps logical fallacy - just because science does not currently have an explanation for something does not even remotely imply that supernatural beings are responsible. Therefore just because science does not currently have an adequate explanation of where matter and energy originated from (if it originated at all, it may very well have always existed) does not mean that your God, or any deity for that matter, is responsible for making it.

But wait, your logical fail goes even further into the depths of epic failure! Not only do you claim that a god is responsible for this event, but you go even further to claim that it is your specific deity of choice. Why couldn't it have been any of the other numerous gods or goddesses or spirits or whatever that spawned the universe? Do you have any evidence to back up that it is your specific deity that exists and is responsible for creation?

If you're going to try to use science to prove your claims, then do so scientifically, because right now I can provide any number of other explanations that fill in the gap with just as little evidence as you have used to fill it in yourself.

[Associate Justice PiT]

Yes, there is.  According to the laws of conservation of energy and thermodynamics matter and energy cannot be created nor destroyed, yet matter exists and energy exists, therefore it is impossible for us to exist, yet here we are because GOD created the matter and energy.  He has power over scientific law.

Once again you have failed in a most epic manner to understand basic logical principles.

You are applying the God of the gaps logical fallacy - just because science does not currently have an explanation for something does not even remotely imply that supernatural beings are responsible. Therefore just because science does not currently have an adequate explanation of where matter and energy originated from (if it originated at all, it may very well have always existed) does not mean that your God, or any deity for that matter, is responsible for making it.

But wait, your logical fail goes even further into the depths of epic failure! Not only do you claim that a god is responsible for this event, but you go even further to claim that it is your specific deity of choice. Why couldn't it have been any of the other numerous gods or goddesses or spirits or whatever that spawned the universe? Do you have any evidence to back up that it is your specific deity that exists and is responsible for creation?

If you're going to try to use science to prove your claims, then do so scientifically, because right now I can provide any number of other explanations that fill in the gap with just as little evidence as you have used to fill it in yourself.

     This reminds me that I also used to subscribe to the line of thought that since current science cannot explain the origins of matter & energy, it would only be logical to say that God created anything.

     I agree with your post, though I would also like to phrase it from my own viewpoint as well. In science, no hypothesis is superior to another unless it is verified. With that in mind, it is no more scientifically valid to suppose that God created the universe than it would be to suppose that an extradimensional robot monkey came & left behind an infinitely dense particle to then undergo the Big Bang. Simply put, there is not enough information to come to formulate a theory about the origins of matter within any sort of scientific framework.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

Yes, there is.  According to the laws of conservation of energy and thermodynamics matter and energy cannot be created nor destroyed, yet matter exists and energy exists, therefore it is impossible for us to exist, yet here we are because GOD created the matter and energy.  He has power over scientific law.

Once again you have failed in a most epic manner to understand basic logical principles.

You are applying the God of the gaps logical fallacy - just because science does not currently have an explanation for something does not even remotely imply that supernatural beings are responsible. Therefore just because science does not currently have an adequate explanation of where matter and energy originated from (if it originated at all, it may very well have always existed) does not mean that your God, or any deity for that matter, is responsible for making it.

Actually, the conservation of energy has been observed in every scientific observation man has ever made.  I wouldn’t hold my breath that any observation to the contrary is ever going to be recorded.  Your hope to find one is actually contrary to the scientific evidence, evidence that can be duplicated repeatedly and in a moment’s whim.

Those who have Christ, on the other hand, are not only witnesses that Jesus is alive, but they also have the explanation to why we’re here in spite of the conservation of energy.

---

it may very well have always existed

increase in entropy doesn’t allow for an infinite age of the universe.

[justW353]

This is blatant spamming.  Obvious copy-pasta.

Anyways, I believe that Jesus of Nazareth was born c. 6BC.  I believe he was a pastor, and a revolutionary man of faith, perhaps even the Jewish Messiah.  I believe he was executed by Roman authorities.

I do not believe he was the Son of God.  Shoot me now.  I have questionable thoughts of whether there is a God.  If anything, I am a deist.

I believe reincarnation is much more likely than Heaven and Hell.  Much more likely than that is...nothing happens.

[John Dibble]

Actually, the conservation of energy has been observed in every scientific observation man has ever made.  I wouldn’t hold my breath that any observation to the contrary is ever going to be recorded.  Your hope to find one is actually contrary to the scientific evidence, evidence that can be duplicated repeatedly and in a moment’s whim.

*sigh* I have not claimed that the laws of thermodynamics have been contradicted by science. That you claim I have is a strawman argument. You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the argument I'm presenting, which is no surprise because you used this exact same argument before.

People inserting God into the Big Bang to explain what science hasn't been able to is no different than the ancients inserting their gods into planetary motion because science hadn't explained that.

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That's nice, but it's not science and thus far there hasn't been a single scrap of evidence to prove it. I could insert any number of supernatural beings into the gap in scientific knowledge to explain the presence of matter or energy or any of the other unknown aspects of the universe but that doesn't make it true, much less scientific.

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increase in entropy doesn’t allow for an infinite age of the universe.[/quote]

Which is why the matter and energy simply may have existed in a less entropic state than we see it now. Or perhaps the laws of the universe were different during pre-Big Bang conditions and matter and energy could spontaneously come into existence - that would perfectly explain the presence of matter and energy as well. Or perhaps the universe was at one point an open system and matter and energy flowed in from a perfectly natural source rather than a deity. Nobody really knows as we lack the means to see the universe in that time period. That's the whole point. Right now you're guess is just as scientifically worthless as mine would be.

[xfrodobagginsx]

Please read this first post and pray that prayer at the bottom of it to God from your heart.

[John Dibble]

Please read this first post and pray that prayer at the bottom of it to God from your heart.

Please don't bump your own threads without contributing anything new.

[xfrodobagginsx]

Evangelists claim Noah's Ark found
Mount Ararat explorers: 'We think it is 99.9 percent that this is it':

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=146369

[John Dibble]

Evangelists claim Noah's Ark found

What? Again? How many "arks" have been found over the years by now?

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That they think it's 99.9% likely it is doesn't make it so. Ever heard of "wishful thinking"?

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Maybe you should try reading this article a little closer - notice "Yes, Noah's Ark is completely real! Now find out "what you don't Noah" about the story as well as your spectacular destiny they rarely ever mention in church in this autographed No. 1 best-seller!" - yeah, they're trying to get you to buy stuff. They're trying to make a buck off of your beliefs. Classy! You might try getting a different source of information, maybe one that doesn't have a financial interest in you believing what the article has to say...

(yes, there are other articles on this archaeological find - and it is an archaeological find but not necessarily the one they are looking for)

You'll also note that they haven't confirmed that this "structure" that these compartments are in is even a boat! How can they really be 99.9% sure that it's the ark if they haven't even confirmed it's a boat?

[justW353]

OK seriously, what is this crap?

[Bo]

OK seriously, what is this crap?

Religious propaganda, mostly.

[John Dibble]

Evangelists claim Noah's Ark found

What? Again? How many "arks" have been found over the years by now?

You must be logged in to read this quote.

That they think it's 99.9% likely it is doesn't make it so. Ever heard of "wishful thinking"?

You must be logged in to read this quote.

Maybe you should try reading this article a little closer - notice "Yes, Noah's Ark is completely real! Now find out "what you don't Noah" about the story as well as your spectacular destiny they rarely ever mention in church in this autographed No. 1 best-seller!" - yeah, they're trying to get you to buy stuff. They're trying to make a buck off of your beliefs. Classy! You might try getting a different source of information, maybe one that doesn't have a financial interest in you believing what the article has to say...

(yes, there are other articles on this archaeological find - and it is an archaeological find but not necessarily the one they are looking for)

You'll also note that they haven't confirmed that this "structure" that these compartments are in is even a boat! How can they really be 99.9% sure that it's the ark if they haven't even confirmed it's a boat?

Christian Archaeologist Casts Further Doubt on Ark 'Discovery'

OH NOES!

[Derek]

STOP! Jesus died so that we can get into heaven. A real Christian understands that we cannot get into heaven ourselves!

[xfrodobagginsx]

I agree with you Derek.