Sen. Ted Kennedy is dead.

[The Duke]

John D Ford:  So now we can start just assuming guilt of a crime and judge that person based on our assumptions?

Guilty until proven otherwise:  The Republican idea on justice.

Society can't put him in jail without convicting him, but any person can make their own private judgements about his culpability without waiting for a court verdict to tell them what to think.

[Stampever]

And people wonder why I'm ashamed of my party...  

This is odd. You're not possibly a Democrat.

Yup, that's it.  You nailed it.  "If you're not a looney left-winger, you're not a Democrat." 

Big tent my ass. 

[Marokai Backbeat]

And people wonder why I'm ashamed of my party...  

This is odd. You're not possibly a Democrat.

Yup, that's it.  You nailed it.  "If you're not a looney left-winger, you're not a Democrat." 

Big tent my ass. 

(back in the 1970s, Congress was practically Marxist)

[The Vorlon]

Rest in peace.

Kennedy was kind to fellow senators and deeply believed in his causes.

That being said, he did, in my opinion, kill a women, leave her to drown, and then used the power and influence of his family to avoid prosecutiion for a crime that the vast majority of us would have spent years in jail for.

Many people commit bad acts in their life (Nelson Mandella's actual crime for which he was imprisioned, for example, was blowing up a hospital with a bomb and killing 8 people) and then go on to do good, perhaps great works.

Kennedy perhaps fits in this category. 

The events of Chappaquiddick and Mary Jo Kopechne likely cost Senatory Kennedy the Presidency (or at very least the nomination of his party) and in political terms that was certainly a very high price.

[fezzyfestoon]

I hope you guys realize that fighting over the disrespectful comments isn't making a positive change in what this thread will be.  Instead of being pages of respectful remembrance with a few blemishes, it's now pages of anger and politics with a few glimmers of respect.

So I guess not then.

[Landslide Lyndon]

For those who think the people making Chappaquidick jokes have no class, keep in mind that none of us ever drowned a girl nor did we ever lionize a man who drowned a girl.

This wasn't someone with whom I simply had political disagreements, this was a genuinely bad person.

No wonder you're States's favorite poster.
Birds of a feather indeed.

[War on Want]

And people wonder why I'm ashamed of my party...  

This is odd. You're not possibly a Democrat.

Yup, that's it.  You nailed it.  "If you're not a looney left-winger, you're not a Democrat." 

Big tent my ass. 

I fail to see how any of the Democrats here are looney left-wingers. Unless you think that support for gay marriage and single payer health care is "looney".

[Scam of God]

And people wonder why I'm ashamed of my party...  

This is odd. You're not possibly a Democrat.

Yup, that's it.  You nailed it.  "If you're not a looney left-winger, you're not a Democrat." 

Big tent my ass. 

I'm a libertarian, not a liberal. But you're a theofascist.

[Mechaman]

And people wonder why I'm ashamed of my party...  

This is odd. You're not possibly a Democrat.

Yup, that's it.  You nailed it.  "If you're not a looney left-winger, you're not a Democrat." 

Big tent my ass. 

(back in the 1970s, Congress was practically Marxist)

I wonder where this great rumor that the Democratic Party is a leftist party comes from anyway. If anything it's centrist, people just don't realize it because the other side is full of right wing loonies (not everyone, but quite a few) it makes the other side look like they're "the loony left". They may have an active Progressive Caucus, but by no means do they own the party. I mean if the Democratic Party was a "progressives only" club why the hell do they have such a hard time uniting their own party members on health care reform and environmental legislation? Two reasons: Southern and Rocky Mountain West Democrats who have to worry about saving their own asses come re-election time.

And this is coming from somebody who is by no means a progressive Democrat.

[Marokai Backbeat]

The Democratic Party is only left-wing in the context of the American political spectrum. When viewed from the larger political spectrum, the Democratic Party largely lands somewhere around the center-right.

[Scam of God]

The Democratic Party is only left-wing in the context of the American political spectrum. When viewed from the larger political spectrum, the Democratic Party largely lands somewhere around the center-right.

Most Democrats actively want to roll back the precious few civil liberties we have today; the only difference is that their zeal for anti-individualism is slightly less than that of the Republicans.

[Sewer]

The Democratic Party is only left-wing in the context of the American political spectrum. When viewed from the larger political spectrum, the Democratic Party largely lands somewhere around the center-right.

Most Democrats actively want to roll back the precious few civil liberties we have today; the only difference is that their zeal for anti-individualism is slightly less than that of the Republicans.

What civil liberties do Democrats actively want to roll back?

[JSojourner]

I am coming into my busy season and am trying to pay more attention to business and less to the Atlas.  Hard to do cause so many of you are like family to me now.  (Weird uncles,  included.)

Anyway, I had to come and express my sorrow over this loss.  May God comfort all who mourn a husband, father, friend or colleague. I said the same when Jesse Helms and Ronald Reagan died so, of course, I say the same for Teddy...with whom I agreed on almost all the issues.

I note, with sorrow, that his past sins have wormed their way into this thread.  Well, asshole liberals squawked about old Jesse's homophobia and Dutch Reagan's stereotyping of the poor or his first failed marriage.  But damn -- whoever said -- "What are we, five?" hit the nail on the head.  

Good people do bad things.  Sometimes bad people do good things.  But all in all, there are really very, very few Hitlers or Pol Pots in the world, thank God.  And I'd wanna sock you in the mouth if you equated Ted Kennedy OR Ronald Reagan with either of those pukes.

Conservatives -- if you've been kind about this (and so many of you have, God bless you) then keep it up.  You are showing the worlds' assholes what class is all about.  Thank you.

If you have been assholes about this, go get bent will ya?  Or maybe try to summon that final ounce of maturity you might have left and at least give the man credit for some damn thing.  His military service, maybe?  Working with Orrin Hatch on something?  Being courteous to his foes?  I dunno...think hard.  Or failing that, say a prayer for his widow and his kids.  

Fellow libs?  I'm with you in grieving the man.  I didn't like one or two of his past choices in life but taken as a whole, he made the country and the world a vastly better place.  Now that he is gone (and Paul Wellstone is long gone), I worry about who will fill those shoes.

Oh...and if you cracked wise or nasty about President Reagan or some other conservative icon on the day of their day...take a lesson.  I know you can do better next time.

I'll miss you, Ted.

[bullmoose88]

I am coming into my busy season and am trying to pay more attention to business and less to the Atlas.  Hard to do cause so many of you are like family to me now.  (Weird uncles,  included.)

Anyway, I had to come and express my sorrow over this loss.  May God comfort all who mourn a husband, father, friend or colleague. I said the same when Jesse Helms and Ronald Reagan died so, of course, I say the same for Teddy...with whom I agreed on almost all the issues.

I note, with sorrow, that his past sins have wormed their way into this thread.  Well, asshole liberals squawked about old Jesse's homophobia and Dutch Reagan's stereotyping of the poor or his first failed marriage.  But damn -- whoever said -- "What are we, five?" hit the nail on the head.  

Good people do bad things.  Sometimes bad people do good things.  But all in all, there are really very, very few Hitlers or Pol Pots in the world, thank God.  And I'd wanna sock you in the mouth if you equated Ted Kennedy OR Ronald Reagan with either of those pukes.

Conservatives -- if you've been kind about this (and so many of you have, God bless you) then keep it up.  You are showing the worlds' assholes what class is all about.  Thank you.

If you have been assholes about this, go get bent will ya?  Or maybe try to summon that final ounce of maturity you might have left and at least give the man credit for some damn thing.  His military service, maybe?  Working with Orrin Hatch on something?  Being courteous to his foes?  I dunno...think hard.  Or failing that, say a prayer for his widow and his kids.  

Fellow libs?  I'm with you in grieving the man.  I didn't like one or two of his past choices in life but taken as a whole, he made the country and the world a vastly better place.  Now that he is gone (and Paul Wellstone is long gone), I worry about who will fill those shoes.

Oh...and if you cracked wise or nasty about President Reagan or some other conservative icon on the day of their day...take a lesson.  I know you can do better next time.

I'll miss you, Ted.

Well Put.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

My mother loathed Ted Kennedy. While I disagreed with him on every issue I actually deep down really liked Kennedy for some reason. I pray for his family and pray that he may rest in peace.

[opebo]

For those who think the people making Chappaquidick jokes have no class, keep in mind that none of us ever drowned a girl nor did we ever lionize a man who drowned a girl.

This wasn't someone with whom I simply had political disagreements, this was a genuinely bad person.

The dispute is not about the reprehensibility of girl-drowning, Ford, but about the veracity of the claim.  (though on balance he was such a good senator I'd still lionize him)

It is worth remembering that you lionize all sorts of girl-killers, perhaps not by drowning, but in other ways...

[Fmr. Pres. Duke]

While I disagreed with Mr. Kennedy and felt he had tremendous character issues, this is a day to remember the good he did for this country (and he was responsible for a lot of good), not to pick political fights. We can save a date for debating later.

[Хahar 🤔]

And people wonder why I'm ashamed of my party...  

This is odd. You're not possibly a Democrat.

Yup, that's it.  You nailed it.  "If you're not a looney left-winger, you're not a Democrat." 

Big tent my ass. 

You've never expressed any idea that would be pro-Democratic, so you're free to leave.

[Vepres]

The Democratic Party is only left-wing in the context of the American political spectrum. When viewed from the larger political spectrum, the Democratic Party largely lands somewhere around the center-right.

Well, yeah, but the nature of our country's culture, both in general and politically, makes our political center to the right. There's nothing really wrong though.

[Hillary 2016]

I was expecting this once they reported he was very sick.  It is sad.  I did not know much about him except that he was called "The Lion of the Senate." 

I do hope his lifelong dream of providing every American with health care is realized.

[Nym90]

John D Ford:  So now we can start just assuming guilt of a crime and judge that person based on our assumptions?

Guilty until proven otherwise:  The Republican idea on justice.

Society can't put him in jail without convicting him, but any person can make their own private judgements about his culpability without waiting for a court verdict to tell them what to think.

True.

And likewise I feel the policies advocated by many conservatives have led to many deaths (far more than Sen. Kennedy was responsible for), and can thus dislike them for that even though they haven't been convicted in a court of law of murder.

[Ban my account ffs!]

My mother loathed Ted Kennedy. While I disagreed with him on every issue I actually deep down really liked Kennedy for some reason. I pray for his family and pray that he may rest in peace.

Some politicians are just like that.  I have the same feeling for John McCain.. deep down I really like the man and admire him.  I really think he was a great choice for the Republicans... and I wish he would've been nominated in 2000.

[Psychic Octopus]

I always liked Ted Kennedy. There is, no question, that he was one of the greatest senators in history. We'll miss you.

[War on Want]

My mother loathed Ted Kennedy. While I disagreed with him on every issue I actually deep down really liked Kennedy for some reason. I pray for his family and pray that he may rest in peace.

Some politicians are just like that.  I have the same feeling for John McCain.. deep down I really like the man and admire him.  I really think he was a great choice for the Republicans... and I wish he would've been nominated in 2000.

Yeah same here, I don't really know why I like him either.

[The Duke]

John D Ford:  So now we can start just assuming guilt of a crime and judge that person based on our assumptions?

Guilty until proven otherwise:  The Republican idea on justice.

Society can't put him in jail without convicting him, but any person can make their own private judgements about his culpability without waiting for a court verdict to tell them what to think.

True.

And likewise I feel the policies advocated by many conservatives have led to many deaths (far more than Sen. Kennedy was responsible for), and can thus dislike them for that even though they haven't been convicted in a court of law of murder.

I’m sorry, which canard are you introducing into the conversation?  The canard that Republicans kill people by being warmongers or the canard that Republicans kill people by The canard that Republicans kill people by being warmongers or the canard that Republicans kill people by refusing to nationalize the health care system?