2024 Third Party and Independent Candidate General discussion

[HisGrace]

Also looking forward to trolling the blue hair intersectional queer kids telling them that they're not voting Oliver because of their internalized homophobia.

[Neo-Malthusian Misanthrope]

Am I crazy or is there an outside chance for this guy to appeal to dejected and disaffected college kids off the back of his whole "gay, anti-war, pro-immigration" thing?

[HisGrace]

Am I crazy or is there an outside chance for this guy to appeal to dejected and disaffected college kids off the back of his whole "gay, anti-war, pro-immigration" thing?

If he doesn't it's because they have internalized homophobia.

[ReallySuper]

Am I crazy or is there an outside chance for this guy to appeal to dejected and disaffected college kids off the back of his whole "gay, anti-war, pro-immigration" thing?

between jill stein, cornel west and claudia de la cruz, the "dejected and disaffected college kid" demographic has plenty of better options than a right wing guy who thinks the department of education should be abolished and wants to end federal financial aid programs

[AltWorlder]

https://twitter.com/jeremykauffman/status/1794939238095720793
The NH LP guy endorsed Trump after Oliver beat Rectenwald, I wonder how many other mises people will do the same, not that it matters much any way this is very likely to be a historically bad year for the Libertarians with RFK jr in the race sucking up most of the air Centerist third party politics lane.

And it continues to be heading for the worst otherwise slam dunk election for American third parties, collectively lmao

[HisGrace]

Who the hell is this Jeremy Kauffman guy anyway? No idea what being gay has to do with anything and how is Oliver a "race communist"? He's not for affirmative action, he's not for hate speech laws, he doesn't defend rioting. Thinking it was bad that George Floyd got murdered does not make you a "race communist". All I can find about him is that he got fired from the Free State Project. Probably just a skunk looking for an excuse to vote for Trump anyway. If you'd even think about it for a millisecond you're not a real libertarian.

[Open Source Intelligence]

What the hell happened to the Libertarian party? They used to have at least respectable candidates and even Jorgensen wasn't outright terrible. However, now they nominated some gay woke neoliberal who thinks the Mises Caucus and close to half of the party is racist. Trump was right the other day except the 3% part, Oliver probably won't even get 1.3%. At least on the bright side, its the best possible Libertarian candidate Trump could have hoped for.

I see in your statement a lot of the conservative criticism of Spike Cohen when he was nominated 4 years ago, when Spike was as great a messenger for libertarianism as the party has had in some time.

First, there's a decent-sized handful of people in the party that are gay and they seem driven to the party by life experience. My state party chair Evan McMahon in Indiana is gay and I've heard his story on why he's a libertarian and it revolves a lot around his experiences as a kid growing up in Bloomington, home to Indiana University and probably most liberal city in the state, and his school counselor's recommendations for him to deal with him getting gay-bashed was to quit being gay or to move. It helped form beliefs for him that the government won't help him when that's the answer from the public school counselor in the most liberal city in the state. It also helps why he's in favor of gun rights, he says "try and gay bash me when I have a 45 in my pocket". (He's said all of this publicly so I'm not outing him or saying anything held privately.)

Also if you are gay and hold beliefs like limited government, gun rights, etc., which of the 2 major parties are you supposed to join? Democrats don't want you for your policy beliefs and Republicans don't want you because of who you have sex with (and Republicans under Trump obviously don't believe in limited government anymore). There's a wannabe politician in Fort Wayne active in GOP politics there that is young, very conservative, and very gay, and there are definitely segments of the party in the area that don't want him to win anything because he's gay. (He was able to get a GOP State Convention Delegate ousted once in Credentials because the guy said on social media to not vote for him when he was the Republican nominee in a safe Democratic district, which infuriated the other guy of course.)

I also want to point out here youth. Oliver is 37 years old, and the aforementioned Spike Cohen is 42.

Trump's best choice would've been Rectenwald, because Rectenwald was a diehard Trump supporter as close as 2 years ago (you can see it on his Twitter) and I imagine the dream was we got to late September and Rectenwald would've said "this election is too important, we cannot let Joe Biden win, I ask every person intending to vote for me to vote for Donald Trump". Mises are full of Republican operatives who since they took power 2 years ago their goal was to sabotage the party from the inside, and since they took control membership has gone down, fundraising has gone down, and election wins have gone down. 300 people voted for None of the Above to be the presidential nominee, which if it won would have irreparably harmed our party's ballot access for the future. If there were Republican operatives operating inside the party to sabotage it from the inside, isn't that what they would have wanted?

[Open Source Intelligence]

Who the hell is this Jeremy Kauffman guy anyway? No idea what being gay has to do with anything and how is Oliver a "race communist"? He's not for affirmative action, he's not for hate speech laws, he doesn't defend rioting. Thinking it was bad that George Floyd got murdered does not make you a "race communist". All I can find about him is that he got fired from the Free State Project. Probably just a skunk looking for an excuse to vote for Trump anyway. If you'd even think about it for a millisecond you're not a real libertarian.

Kauffman is the most absolute of absolutist libertarians that believes you spread the message by saying shocking things on Twitter and him and people similar to him controlled the @LPNH Twitter account that everyone anti-libertarian shared posts they were making to paint the whole party with the same brush. He has even managed to piss off Mises Caucus leadership.

[Open Source Intelligence]

https://twitter.com/jeremykauffman/status/1794939238095720793
The NH LP guy endorsed Trump after Oliver beat Rectenwald, I wonder how many other mises people will do the same, not that it matters much any way this is very likely to be a historically bad year for the Libertarians with RFK jr in the race sucking up most of the air Centerist third party politics lane.

And it continues to be heading for the worst otherwise slam dunk election for American third parties, collectively lmao

Larry Sharpe (New York State Libertarian) mentioned this in a quote of his in a Politico article I've read of RFK Jr. is going to suck up most of the oxygen for all the anti-system voters. It depends on whether you consider RFK Jr. a third party or not. I think non-Republican, non-Democrat options should be pooled together. Under that criterion, 1992 was a banner year even if the non-Perot options on the ballot got nothing.

[AltWorlder]

I think RFK will do well with anti-system voters but I think there was a chance he could have gotten closer to ‘92 levels of success if he had ran a better campaign. Instead he comes off as am Epstein-connected formerly brain-worm infested stooge who can’t even pick a popular veep.

[Open Source Intelligence]

I think RFK will do well with anti-system voters but I think there was a chance he could have gotten closer to ‘92 levels of success if he had ran a better campaign. Instead he comes off as am Epstein-connected formerly brain-worm infested stooge who can’t even pick a popular veep.

It's early. If he gets universal ballot access, I think he gets 5% minimum just from people that hate this Biden-Trump repeat election. Gary Johnson with significantly less money and media attention than RFK Jr. will have got 3.3% in 2016 and the total anti-Hillary, anti-Trump vote in 2016 was 6+% counting write-ins. Throw in his campaigning and funding, I don't expect voters to develop warmer feelings to Biden or Trump the months ahead, I can easily see double digits.

[Bandit3 the Worker]

Not only that, but a lot of the anti-establishment vote in 1992 went to the Democrats by default. The Republicans were the establishment back then.

That seems strange now, because the Democrats have squandered so much political capital since then, but they were better back then. They had some problematic officials, but nothing like now.

[wbrocks67]

In case anyone else is interested - DDHQ has a great map of ballot access for RFK - confirmed and claimed

https://elections2024.thehill.com/

[HisGrace]

Who the hell is this Jeremy Kauffman guy anyway? No idea what being gay has to do with anything and how is Oliver a "race communist"? He's not for affirmative action, he's not for hate speech laws, he doesn't defend rioting. Thinking it was bad that George Floyd got murdered does not make you a "race communist". All I can find about him is that he got fired from the Free State Project. Probably just a skunk looking for an excuse to vote for Trump anyway. If you'd even think about it for a millisecond you're not a real libertarian.

Kauffman is the most absolute of absolutist libertarians that believes you spread the message by saying shocking things on Twitter and him and people similar to him controlled the @LPNH Twitter account that everyone anti-libertarian shared posts they were making to paint the whole party with the same brush. He has even managed to piss off Mises Caucus leadership.

Well I don't see what being anti-gay and against basic civil rights for black people has to do with being an "absolute libertarian". More like a right winger saying he's a libertarian to look cooler.

[Unbeatable Titan Susan Collins]

https://twitter.com/angela4LNCChair/status/1795512208748875804

Is this the chair of the Libertarian party, encouraging people to vote Trump. What has happened to the party?

[MyLifeIsYours]

Chase Oliver calls for the end of the genocide in Gaza.

[Progressive Pessimist]

Chase Oliver calls for the end of the genocide in Gaza.

That honestly might be a good move considering that Biden, RFK, and Trump are probably seen as all being too pro-Israel.

[Open Source Intelligence]

https://twitter.com/angela4LNCChair/status/1795512208748875804
Is this the chair of the Libertarian party, encouraging people to vote Trump. What has happened to the party?

That's the Mises Caucus.

Trump promised to pardon Ulbricht. As Oliver correctly pointed out, Trump was already President for 4 years and never pardoned him then when he had the chance.

[Inmate Trump]

Chase Oliver, the Libertarian candidate for Senate in Georgia in 2022, is running for the Libertarian presidential nomination.

He was briefly my boyfriend when we were both in high school lol

I once dated a presidential candidate, which is kinda cool to say.

He was a nice guy. Having said that, I won’t be voting for him.

Biden 2024

[GM Team Member and Deputy PPT WB]

https://twitter.com/angela4LNCChair/status/1795512208748875804

Is this the chair of the Libertarian party, encouraging people to vote Trump. What has happened to the party?

the party leadership was taken over by the AnCaps iirc, who don't really represent the party as a whole. They're the "boo gary johnson for supporting drivers licenses" caucus.

Reminds me a bit of the DSA taking over all the leadership for the NV Dems and basically none of the actual playmakers paid attention to what they said.