Why isn’t Israel in an alliance with Russia?
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  Why isn’t Israel in an alliance with Russia?
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Author Topic: Why isn’t Israel in an alliance with Russia?  (Read 844 times)
pppolitics
Junior Chimp
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« on: December 15, 2023, 01:51:51 PM »

Every time I see Israel’s tactic, I think: Wow, that’s what Russia would do!

Israel has a lot more common with Russia than the United States.

A right-wing authoritarian government? Check

Indiscriminate attacks? Check

Committing war crimes with impunity? Check
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patzer
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« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2023, 01:53:43 PM »

And the United States, of course, is well known for neither having had a right wing government nor having committed any war crimes?
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It’s so Joever
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« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2023, 02:08:53 PM »

I mean Netanyahu was trying to kinda veer towards that with his Ukraine response.
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rc18
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« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2023, 02:32:49 PM »

Russia is too busy being allies of your pals in Hamas...
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Hnv1
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« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2023, 02:49:58 PM »

A right-wing authoritarian government, indiscriminate attacks, committing war crimes with impunity, are you talking about Linebacker II? or is it the second battle of Fallujah?
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Gass3268
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« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2023, 03:05:06 PM »

I mean Netanyahu was trying to kinda veer towards that with his Ukraine response.

Pretty crazy even after Putin has shown himself to be a clear ally of Hamas, Bibi is still unwilling to embrace Ukraine. Really shows how much he wants Putin to be his friend.
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rc18
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« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2023, 03:08:44 PM »

I mean Netanyahu was trying to kinda veer towards that with his Ukraine response.

Pretty crazy even after Putin has shown himself to be a clear ally of Hamas, Bibi is still unwilling to embrace Ukraine. Really shows how much he wants Putin to be his friend.

It's almost like Israel has its own defence to worry about...


(The policy on Ukraine hasn't really changed much from the previous government either)
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pppolitics
Junior Chimp
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« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2023, 03:24:57 PM »

I mean Netanyahu was trying to kinda veer towards that with his Ukraine response.

Pretty crazy even after Putin has shown himself to be a clear ally of Hamas, Bibi is still unwilling to embrace Ukraine. Really shows how much he wants Putin to be his friend.

It's almost like Israel has its own defence to worry about...


(The policy on Ukraine hasn't really changed much from the previous government either)

Israel thought that Hamas was a joke.

Israel was given precise details of Hamas's plan but thought that Hamas was too incompetent to execute such a plan.
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jojoju1998
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« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2023, 05:12:22 PM »

Every time I see Israel’s tactic, I think: Wow, that’s what Russia would do!

Israel has a lot more common with Russia than the United States.

A right-wing authoritarian government? Check

Indiscriminate attacks? Check

Committing war crimes with impunity? Check


Russia has backed a lot of Israel's enemies over the years. Iran, Hezbollah,
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TiltsAreUnderrated
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« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2023, 09:51:12 PM »

They’re not allies, but each has better relations with the other than most of the rest of the world. Ignore Putin’s posturing on Palestine - it doesn’t change material realities.
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CumbrianLefty
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« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2023, 05:54:14 AM »

I mean Netanyahu was trying to kinda veer towards that with his Ukraine response.

Pretty crazy even after Putin has shown himself to be a clear ally of Hamas, Bibi is still unwilling to embrace Ukraine. Really shows how much he wants Putin to be his friend.

They are peas in a pod in several respects.
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President Punxsutawney Phil
TimTurner
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« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2023, 05:58:07 AM »

They’re not allies, but each has better relations with the other than most of the rest of the world. Ignore Putin’s posturing on Palestine - it doesn’t change material realities.
Early in the Russo-Ukrainian War, there was a lot of pro-Ukraine sentiment from Arab countries, who felt closer to Ukraine than Russia. (It seems that such sympathy has declined to some degree due to Zelensky attaching himself close to Washington and him positioning himself especially closely to Israel, harming the country's more innocent image in the region as opposed to US and Russia).
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Silent Hunter
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« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2023, 10:14:45 AM »

Russia has a very long history of antisemitism, often at official policy level. Zionism arguably exists because of it.
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Blue3
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« Reply #13 on: December 17, 2023, 03:07:55 PM »

I think most Jews who came to Israel in recent decades are Russians?
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jfern
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« Reply #14 on: December 18, 2023, 12:46:35 AM »

Only the US is dumb enough to give $10 billion in aid to Israel.
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President Punxsutawney Phil
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« Reply #15 on: December 18, 2023, 06:18:10 AM »

I think most Jews who came to Israel in recent decades are Russians?
There's loads of Russian Jews, yes. Beersheva is one center where they are particularly relevant.
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oldtimer
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« Reply #16 on: December 18, 2023, 10:25:16 AM »

Middle East diplomacy is a mess.

Everyone is an enemy and an ally of everyone else at the same time.

The Syrian spaggeti is a good illustration:
 
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Vosem
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« Reply #17 on: December 18, 2023, 11:11:28 AM »

One of the countries with strikingly pro-Israel media and strikingly pro-Israel popular attitudes is Ukraine, as even Al Jazeera would admit to you. "We must become more like Israel" is a common message of Ukrainian domestic propaganda, though.

(This is actually an unusually interesting question, pppolitics, given that under Netanyahu the Israeli government has deliberately tried to stake out a neutral approach in the Russo-Ukrainian conflict, but distinctly failed to do so. Besides the international law question -- contrary to your claims it is Israel and Ukraine whose positions are similar, since they both rely on pre-colonial boundaries not changing without input from all parties* -- most of the Israeli public sympathizes with Ukraine, except for supporters of the kind of extremist Hadash/Balad parties, but even more than that sympathy within Ukraine for Israel is overwhelming. And new -- I doubt it would've existed at all pre-Maidan.)

*This is also why Israel and Ukraine are supporters of Azerbaijan, incidentally.
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Reactionary Libertarian
ReactionaryLibertarian
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« Reply #18 on: December 18, 2023, 11:17:32 AM »

Russia has a very long history of antisemitism, often at official policy level. Zionism arguably exists because of it.

Not really. Zionism exists today because of the Dreyfuss Affair and the Holocaust- which showed that Jews would never be accepted even in liberal countries like France and Germany. Previously, Jews had assumed assimilation was the answer to anti-Semitism and Reform
Jews were anti-Zionist because “Berlin is our Jerusalem”. No one had high expectations that Russia would treat Jews well. However, the USSR did play a significant role in spreading European-style anti-Semitism into the Arab world.
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Peeperkorn
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« Reply #19 on: December 18, 2023, 12:17:36 PM »

Why isn’t Israel in an alliance with Russia?

Because not exactly a small share of the federal taxes I pay go to the IDF? Russia doesn't have an economy to help Israel as much as the US does.
Also, cultural and political similarities/ties are stronger with the Western World, regardless of the number of Russian immigrants.
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