Is it in both parties best long term interests to lose the GA runoffs?

[Starry Eyed Jagaloon]

Although I am really hesitant to give Ds majority control of the Senate, I'm starting to come around to the idea that it may not be an entirely bad thing for Rs to lose the GA runoffs.

Obviously, I'd like a trifecta for my own interests. That said, the past months have proven beyond a doubt that the contemporary Republican party doesn't care about the strength of our Democracy or the resilience of our institutions. It is clear to me that the only way the GOP will evolve from this unholy brand of Trump-McConnelism is if they lose power completely. And considering the senate would be 50-50 and contains Manchin, Sinema, et all., I don't think you have too much to fear from voting Ossoff.

Please, just give us two years to save liberal democracy. Then vote however you like.

Packing SCOTUS with dem hacks is saving democracy for you ? Also liberal democracy =/= left wing, the word liberal here is the classical one which comes from the enlightenment movement.

Well yeah (not that it'll happen.) What else would you expect from the whole Gorsuch/ACB fiasco? America can't withstand a 6-3 court undermining voting & civil rights. And considering the opposition's habit of vote suppression, gerrymandering, and general norm-destruction I think it's safe to say the Republican party doesn't care about the continuation of liberal democracy in America. They prefer to take their cues from the Visegrad 4.

[forsythvoter]

I appreciate the spirited debate here and it's helpful getting a sense where both parties stand on the policies themselves. @FrenchRepublican - what would you say are the priority issues / policies we could expect compromise on if Rs take control of the Senate? I do have concerns about the far left of the D party having too much influence but I similarly have concerns that we'll just get 2 years of gridlock and nothing accomplished with a R Senate led by McConnell. 

[KaiserDave]

Yes, the trifecta is a concern for me and what's weighing on my mind for the Perdue / Ossoff race. That said, the thought of having Mitch McConnell running the Senate does not excite me terribly either as I think he's quite political and not always in a manner that is in the best interests of the country. Also, I actually do want Biden to succeed, and do somewhat worry that McConnell will just reflexively oppose anything Biden proposes rather than consider the policies on the merits. I'd like more messaging from the Rs that they will work with Biden, and what policies they think they can pass together if they get control of the senate.

McConnell won't let Biden succeed. It's likely he won't even let Biden get a full cabinet. You saw how he was with Obama. Do you really want to go through this obstructionist, democracy-destroying nonsense all over again? McConnell clearly does not care about the long-term well being of America.

For the Dems - I have concerns that they will go too far left with a trifecta. I'm not on board with Green New Deal or canceling everyone's student debt as I think there are more effective ways to stimulate the economy. Manchin saying he opposes packing the courts is a good step, but senators like Sanders saying they oppose the $908B stimulus bill because it's not big enough are head scratchers to me.

Here's the thing, Biden doesn't support any of that either. He defeated the socialist in the primary. A trifecta would probably deliver immigration reform, voting reform, a well-constructed stimulus package, green infrastructure, drug pricing reform, and a public option. I'd be shocked to see much beyond that. Is any of that really too radical?

I share the concerns about McConnell and am looking at how he handles the bipartisan stimulus bill negotiations for a sign of how he would handle the Senate as majority leader post-runoffs.

In terms of the policy, you're on the right track. It's all about the details but I would support:
1) Immigration Reform - Make DACA permanent (it's not fair to ask children born here to be sent back to countries they have in many cases never been back to or even speak the language of), but we need tighter restrictions and regulations on employers in terms of verifying workplace eligibility. Border wall is a waste of money and money for this should be repurposed to
2) Voting Reform - Not sure what you mean here as I think current elections are free and fair and largely non-fraudulent. Well, NY should conduct election counts more efficiently, but that's another story
3) Stimulus - I think we should extend unemployment insurance and also provide small businesses with some sort of "out of work / recovery" payment. To the extent that states are providing essential funding related to the covid response (e.g., staffing up contact tracers), they should be able to receive funding, but this shouldn't be a bailout to states that have long had chronic deficits even pre-Covid
4) Green infrastructure - I support tax credits and a loosening of regulations for renewable energy
5) Drug Pricing Reform - I support allowing drug imports from Canada, as well as changing regulations around when generics are allowed onto the market based on drug pricing levels. I do not support price caps on drugs - too much command and control will have secondary consequences
6) Public Option - I support allowing this, but I think the debate will around how heavily subsidized it will be. The public option shouldn't be a backchannel to crowding out the private sector here.

This is the type of campaign I wish the candidates were running...

What from I can tell, and correct me if I am wrong. Warnock and Ossoff are focusing on entirely on bread and butter issues like the positions you listed. Unfortunately I don't think Perdue or Loeffler are capable of doing anything on the campaign trail other than kowtowing to Trump.

And if Mitch does stay as Majority Leader, I don't think any kind of common sense legislation can be hoped for. Unlike you or I, McConnell doesn't care if Biden succeeds or not.

Dems were fairly obstructionist against Trump, and in many cases I agreed, but they still teamed up to pass laws like the First Step Act, and most Dems (I believe) voted for the USMCA, and if Trump had put effort into it we may have gotten infrastructure reform. But if McConnell, stays in, I doubt we even get a vote on common sense proposals.

[forsythvoter]

Yes, the trifecta is a concern for me and what's weighing on my mind for the Perdue / Ossoff race. That said, the thought of having Mitch McConnell running the Senate does not excite me terribly either as I think he's quite political and not always in a manner that is in the best interests of the country. Also, I actually do want Biden to succeed, and do somewhat worry that McConnell will just reflexively oppose anything Biden proposes rather than consider the policies on the merits. I'd like more messaging from the Rs that they will work with Biden, and what policies they think they can pass together if they get control of the senate.

McConnell won't let Biden succeed. It's likely he won't even let Biden get a full cabinet. You saw how he was with Obama. Do you really want to go through this obstructionist, democracy-destroying nonsense all over again? McConnell clearly does not care about the long-term well being of America.

For the Dems - I have concerns that they will go too far left with a trifecta. I'm not on board with Green New Deal or canceling everyone's student debt as I think there are more effective ways to stimulate the economy. Manchin saying he opposes packing the courts is a good step, but senators like Sanders saying they oppose the $908B stimulus bill because it's not big enough are head scratchers to me.

Here's the thing, Biden doesn't support any of that either. He defeated the socialist in the primary. A trifecta would probably deliver immigration reform, voting reform, a well-constructed stimulus package, green infrastructure, drug pricing reform, and a public option. I'd be shocked to see much beyond that. Is any of that really too radical?

I share the concerns about McConnell and am looking at how he handles the bipartisan stimulus bill negotiations for a sign of how he would handle the Senate as majority leader post-runoffs.

In terms of the policy, you're on the right track. It's all about the details but I would support:
1) Immigration Reform - Make DACA permanent (it's not fair to ask children born here to be sent back to countries they have in many cases never been back to or even speak the language of), but we need tighter restrictions and regulations on employers in terms of verifying workplace eligibility. Border wall is a waste of money and money for this should be repurposed to
2) Voting Reform - Not sure what you mean here as I think current elections are free and fair and largely non-fraudulent. Well, NY should conduct election counts more efficiently, but that's another story
3) Stimulus - I think we should extend unemployment insurance and also provide small businesses with some sort of "out of work / recovery" payment. To the extent that states are providing essential funding related to the covid response (e.g., staffing up contact tracers), they should be able to receive funding, but this shouldn't be a bailout to states that have long had chronic deficits even pre-Covid
4) Green infrastructure - I support tax credits and a loosening of regulations for renewable energy
5) Drug Pricing Reform - I support allowing drug imports from Canada, as well as changing regulations around when generics are allowed onto the market based on drug pricing levels. I do not support price caps on drugs - too much command and control will have secondary consequences
6) Public Option - I support allowing this, but I think the debate will around how heavily subsidized it will be. The public option shouldn't be a backchannel to crowding out the private sector here.

This is the type of campaign I wish the candidates were running...

What from I can tell, and correct me if I am wrong. Warnock and Ossoff are focusing on entirely on bread and butter issues like the positions you listed. Unfortunately I don't think Perdue or Loeffler are capable of doing anything on the campaign trail other than kowtowing to Trump.

And if Mitch does stay as Majority Leader, I don't think any kind of common sense legislation can be hoped for. Unlike you or I, McConnell doesn't care if Biden succeeds or not.

Dems were fairly obstructionist against Trump, and in many cases I agreed, but they still teamed up to pass laws like the First Step Act, and most Dems (I believe) voted for the USMCA, and if Trump had put effort into it we may have gotten infrastructure reform. But if McConnell, stays in, I doubt we even get a vote on common sense proposals.

Warnock and Ossoff are focusing on the bread and butter issues, and I think the focus on healthcare resonates most strongly, but frankly as a swing voter, they are spending too much time attacking Perdue and Loeffler on the stock trades. I'm already well aware they made these trades and while they seem a bit unethical, they weren't charged and frankly aren't going to swing my vote one way or another for the simple reason that I think the issues we are talking about are far more important and impactful to ordinary people.

[ProgressiveModerate]

Yes, the trifecta is a concern for me and what's weighing on my mind for the Perdue / Ossoff race. That said, the thought of having Mitch McConnell running the Senate does not excite me terribly either as I think he's quite political and not always in a manner that is in the best interests of the country. Also, I actually do want Biden to succeed, and do somewhat worry that McConnell will just reflexively oppose anything Biden proposes rather than consider the policies on the merits. I'd like more messaging from the Rs that they will work with Biden, and what policies they think they can pass together if they get control of the senate.

McConnell won't let Biden succeed. It's likely he won't even let Biden get a full cabinet. You saw how he was with Obama. Do you really want to go through this obstructionist, democracy-destroying nonsense all over again? McConnell clearly does not care about the long-term well being of America.

For the Dems - I have concerns that they will go too far left with a trifecta. I'm not on board with Green New Deal or canceling everyone's student debt as I think there are more effective ways to stimulate the economy. Manchin saying he opposes packing the courts is a good step, but senators like Sanders saying they oppose the $908B stimulus bill because it's not big enough are head scratchers to me.

Here's the thing, Biden doesn't support any of that either. He defeated the socialist in the primary. A trifecta would probably deliver immigration reform, voting reform, a well-constructed stimulus package, green infrastructure, drug pricing reform, and a public option. I'd be shocked to see much beyond that. Is any of that really too radical?

I share the concerns about McConnell and am looking at how he handles the bipartisan stimulus bill negotiations for a sign of how he would handle the Senate as majority leader post-runoffs.

In terms of the policy, you're on the right track. It's all about the details but I would support:
1) Immigration Reform - Make DACA permanent (it's not fair to ask children born here to be sent back to countries they have in many cases never been back to or even speak the language of), but we need tighter restrictions and regulations on employers in terms of verifying workplace eligibility. Border wall is a waste of money and money for this should be repurposed to
2) Voting Reform - Not sure what you mean here as I think current elections are free and fair and largely non-fraudulent. Well, NY should conduct election counts more efficiently, but that's another story
3) Stimulus - I think we should extend unemployment insurance and also provide small businesses with some sort of "out of work / recovery" payment. To the extent that states are providing essential funding related to the covid response (e.g., staffing up contact tracers), they should be able to receive funding, but this shouldn't be a bailout to states that have long had chronic deficits even pre-Covid
4) Green infrastructure - I support tax credits and a loosening of regulations for renewable energy
5) Drug Pricing Reform - I support allowing drug imports from Canada, as well as changing regulations around when generics are allowed onto the market based on drug pricing levels. I do not support price caps on drugs - too much command and control will have secondary consequences
6) Public Option - I support allowing this, but I think the debate will around how heavily subsidized it will be. The public option shouldn't be a backchannel to crowding out the private sector here.

This is the type of campaign I wish the candidates were running...

What from I can tell, and correct me if I am wrong. Warnock and Ossoff are focusing on entirely on bread and butter issues like the positions you listed. Unfortunately I don't think Perdue or Loeffler are capable of doing anything on the campaign trail other than kowtowing to Trump.

And if Mitch does stay as Majority Leader, I don't think any kind of common sense legislation can be hoped for. Unlike you or I, McConnell doesn't care if Biden succeeds or not.

Dems were fairly obstructionist against Trump, and in many cases I agreed, but they still teamed up to pass laws like the First Step Act, and most Dems (I believe) voted for the USMCA, and if Trump had put effort into it we may have gotten infrastructure reform. But if McConnell, stays in, I doubt we even get a vote on common sense proposals.

Warnock and Ossoff are focusing on the bread and butter issues, and I think the focus on healthcare resonates most strongly, but frankly as a swing voter, they are spending too much time attacking Perdue and Loeffler on the stock trades. I'm already well aware they made these trades and while they seem a bit unethical, they weren't charged and frankly aren't going to swing my vote one way or another for the simple reason that I think the issues we are talking about are far more important and impactful to ordinary people.

As someone who generally supports Democrats, I wish that we would sometimes focus on our policies more than the moral flaws of the other canidates. Ultimately, we have a lot of policies that are very popular and resonate with many voters; there's still a huge handful of voters who just want to see their lives get better rather than all the political drama. I would argue that especially in rural areas, Osoff and Warnock should make their case by saying that giving Democrats control of the Senate would allow congressional Democrats and Biden to work together to make things better whereas McConnel would just block everything. Overusing the stock attack won't end well; once people are aware of it, constantly reminding people in every add gets nowhere.