Heaven and Hell

[Chancellor Tanterterg]

Speaking as a Jewish-American, I've kinda always wondered how Christians feel about this considering how often folks have, upon learning that Jews don't believe in heaven or hell, expressed genuine confusion about why we'd still believe one should try to lead a moral life.

[RFayette 🇻🇦]

Fear of hell is a valid reason to obey God but the best kind of obedience is one motivated by love for God.  Nonetheless, fear of God is the beginning of knowledge and as such a healthy fear of God’s wrath is important for moral development and sanctification.

[afleitch]

I'm not 'moved' by heaven and hell as concepts because Christianity in advocating for them, hasn't agreed on what they are. And what path leads you there. It's actually a strength rather than a weakness because it can be whatever you want it to be;

Heaven for those with faith. Heaven through works. Heaven through both. Heaven for the elect. Heaven for a finite number. Heaven with purgatory. Heaven for everyone. Hell is literal fire and brimstone. Hell is pain. Hell is seperation from god. Hell is annihilation of the soul. Hell is for no one.

To ask me to fear hell is the same as expecting a Christian to 'fear' reincarnation and moksha. It doesn't really follow; you're going to have to internally ascribe to Christian notions of divine judgement, often culturally imprinted, in order to fear them. Otherwise they don't apply.

[lfromnj]

They say that lifes a carousel.

[Antonio the Sixth]

Yes/No

I've talked about at length this before, but I've always found the understanding of heaven and hell as reward and punishment for one's deeds to be despicable. It's actually far more offensive to the faith of the many Christians who act out of genuine altruism than anything atheist edgelords have been saying about it. I get that there is some theological debate about this, but personally I'd find it hard to justify the idea that one can be saved simply out of fear of hell or desire for heaven. It seems antithetical to the kind of human flourishing that Christian ethics at its highest aspires to.

Now, when it comes to "leading a moral life", sure, it is theoretically possible for someone to be consistently good out of selfish motivations. I'd argue that it's unlikely in practice, because our society incentivizes immoral behavior so much that the only way to stray away from it is to have an inner motivation to do so, but still. There are plenty of examples of people doing the right thing for the wrong reason, and while I think that these people need to experience moral growth, we still should commend their actions as examples of how a good person should act.

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Yes/No. I broadly agree with both afleitch and Antonio on the first question (although unlike them I do believe in heaven and hell myself), and as to the second, people with certain personality disorders aren't capable of the emotional states we normally associate with altruistic motivations, and I believe that these people are seriously ill rather than automatically reprobate.

[RI]

Imperfect contrition is completely valid, but it's obviously inferior to perfect contrition.

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

I replace Heaven and Hell as Buddhist have down with striving to achieve enlightenment and Nivana. Everyone's view on Afterlife is different, Jehovah witness and Catholics believe that: Utopia, Buddhism believes in reincarnation and Protestantism believes in Heaven and Hell.

There are Demonic forces and the cycle of life and death and sin or Karma

[The Arizonan]

Speaking as a Jewish-American, I've kinda always wondered how Christians feel about this considering how often folks have, upon learning that Jews don't believe in heaven or hell, expressed genuine confusion about why we'd still believe one should try to lead a moral life.

I was born in Reno, Nevada and was raised Roman Catholic. Now I live in Phoenix (which has a Jewish mayor for anyone who cares) and don't know what I am anymore in regards to religious beliefs. Maybe agnostic. Personally, I think the idea of hell not existing is one of the best things that could possibly happen.

There are some good reasons to live a moral life if the outcome is the same in death. If you live an immoral life, it will seriously harm your reputation if other people are aware of it. An immoral life can also get you in trouble with the law and affect your ability to make a living. Think about it. If you don't have any personal rules and are screwing over other people as an employee or as a boss, that is bad for business. Plus, leading a moral life is actually simpler because you are avoiding vices that will bring you down.

I recently found out that I had a great-grandparent that is Jewish and now sometimes I wonder what it would've been like to have been raised Jewish. Does anyone have any input on this?

By the way, Happy Hannukah (even though it's still November).

[Amenhotep Bakari-Sellers]

In modern culture as well as in Buddhist and Hinduism,  it's called Nirvana, where the soul is waiting on Judgement Day or reincarnation. Even Western cultures believe in reincarnation,  which takes place well in advance of Date of death; consequently, one can see dead love ones in after life